That's all of us that we're expecting today because we heard from Sid that he can't make it. So that means we're calling the meeting to order, whatever it is we're supposed to do at the beginning. We are now officially meeting instead of just chatting. We, let's see, I think the first thing am I supposed to say who's here, why doesn't everybody just say they're here or something. Yeah, I think we're supposed to say that we are here we can hear and be heard. All right, so. Erica are you here. Erica Pia does here it can be heard. Allegra. I'm wrestling my dog who doesn't want to be on the camera but wants my attention. Okay, Rob. Here. Paul. Here. Ashley. I'm here. Here. And we know the city is not here. And so here we are. So the minutes, which is the first thing on our agenda went out late, I think, but I believe that they everyone got them. Does anybody have any questions. Usually what we have done is just if, if they look okay and no one says anything to the contrary, we accept them. We accept them as minutes and approach to whatever the difference is I don't know but is there anyone who sees any reason for not accepting the minute. Please raise your hand or speaker do something. Then hearing nothing. I will assume that we have accepted the minutes. And so the next thing on our agenda is delightfully. We have asked Tim McCarthy from Craig's doors to come and talk to us about what Craig doors is up to these days. He is here and Nate will. Whatever you do make him into a panelist so that he can give us a little bit of an update on Craig's doors. Hi Tim. Hi everyone. My name is Tim for those of you I haven't had the pleasure of meeting it. Super honored to be in attendance tonight thank you so much for the invitation. So, there's been lots of changes at Craig's doors in the past four months that's a bit of an understatement. I have undergone a full transition from the executive team down to the director of operations, which in and of itself is a is a pretty dramatic change. On top of that, we have scaled to a second hotel in Hadley. I'll go into those details later I should say. Our primary source of funding was put out to bid for the first time, which is anxiety producing. But we've been spending a ton of time and effort on rebuilding relationships with partner organizations in the human services field. We have small businesses in the citizens, but we're hoping to launch our first development campaign within the next month or so the first in over five years from what I understand. We're still getting caught up on on thank yous for all of the unsolicited donations Amherst is a truly amazing community. We are so lucky to be here. As a product of the transition, we have made improvements. Virtually everywhere we were lucky enough to have a consulting firm come in and kind of help us revamp Craig's doors into a second life with with some of the professional infrastructure like policies and procedures. We've been ensuring that those are being enforced. We've also been really working to take care of our staff, who are just an amazing team of folks. We continue in that mission to make sure that that our staff feels supported cared for, and that they can perform the job to the best of their capacity so that's a little bit of housekeeping. We're currently out of service delivery. We're currently operating out of 434 North Pleasant in the green trailer, which has been home for some time. We've developed that space into a resource center. So any members of the community can pop in. We're unhoused but are not staying with us are able to acquire case management, survival tools and resources, and we're able to refer them to other agencies where necessary, which has been wildly successful in its newest iteration. Across the street from 434. We are still operating at the university lodge. Our guest count from the 20 rooms is at 36 so we've almost accomplished dual occupancy for every room. We're really trying to make the most out of every resource that we have in supporting the most vulnerable members of the community. As I've stated earlier also had expanded into Hadley where we are operating another motel transitional housing setting. Over there, we have another 20 rooms, which are occupied by 32 folks so we're just under 70 in terms of our, our total sheltering count. On November 1 we are hoping to transition to the Lutheran church that's that's the goal. They are interested in regressing or reverting back to an overnight shelter model, which is a bit out of line with the where Craig's doors has evolved so I guess if I could say the greatest change, and my proudest area of focus falls under case management of those doors. My predecessor was had done amazing things and a lot of really quality contributions to the community that we serve. Among them was managing the scale our budget drastically increased relative to COVID. And we found ourselves at a scale that we had never operated from. I think the focus, I think the focus, again from the previous administration was the heads on beds model, which is great. It's a harm reduction approach it just says let's get as many people as we can into the shelter. Let's get as many shelter spaces as we can and we're going to take care of as many folks as possible. Stepping into the executive director position. I take a bit of a different approach. I think that in in exercising the way that we were we were bringing in folks from other municipalities and serving and sort of covering the bases from some of the obligations and responsibilities that we observe to be members of the other towns where people in some cases were transitioning to us so our objective is to support other communities in their capacity to deliver services to their most vulnerable members. And in our case to focus on serving our guests in a way serving the homeless population and community in a way that is deeper rather than broader. I would say, instead of continuing to expand the number of beds we're focused on taking care of folks who are from the Amherst Hadley, you know, our neck of the woods, and, and really deepening the services so we're dedicated towards offering wrap around services, which includes a focus via case management of ensuring that everyone has access to health care to mental health care, financial literacy training, and then perhaps most importantly in our space housing placement support. We're working with the three county COC to distribute vouchers to our most vulnerable guests, and we're working with virtually every housing authority in the state, trying to navigate opportunities that might be best for our guests recognizing that every guest is unique. The focus is recognizing that Craig's doors is not a medical or clinical space. So we're not dealing with diagnoses at all. We're dealing with behaviors, we're a behavior based shelter, and we recognize our limitations in that sort of service delivery so as we continue to expand, we don't anticipate any further increase in the number of beds. Of course, if the, if the need from a county perspective is articulated, we will always step up to that, but in terms of self direction. We're really working on deepening our services to the folks who we already have because otherwise the sheltering system as broken as it is right now. It really just contributes to the problem. So it's excellent to have a harm reduction philosophy and foundation but the heads on beds model just means that we take care of folks for four months they go back into the woods. They live in isolation they live in a sense of being sort of outcast from the community. They continue to suffer they come back in to get warm for four months they go back out to suffer they come back in for four months so since we've executed our, our broader deeper dedication to case management we've seen record numbers for housing placements for Craig store not only for Craig stores but for the region. It's becoming a bit of a joke. I was speaking to Pamela Schwartz earlier who's the director of the Western Massachusetts homelessness coalition, I might have that position wrong but she was commenting on the fact that we have outpaced every other organization in a way that is inexplicable. To me it's very explicable and it's the product of very deliberate efforts put into particular aspects of our service delivery. And to really create a sense of community and home for our folks. Last week we started our first activities groups which are really just non clinical group counseling sessions that are exercised through art therapy. We had a journaling class yesterday. It's amazing to see how desperate some of our folks are for just positive engagement, rather than sitting up in their rooms or returning to their more maladaptive coping mechanisms, because we are a wet shelter. We're seeing some really productive engagement, both with each other and with the staff and with the larger community so it's a really exciting time at Craig's doors. I continue to push forward again with the sort of Carl Rogers mentality that you don't need to be a clinician to be a therapeutic individual in someone's life so I'm incredibly lucky to have the staff that I have the support of the community that we've seen so far is remarkable. Dave Zomek from the town governance has been just inexplicably supportive and truly helpful and so it's been a real team effort. And yeah I'm sorry if I went long I get a little excited when it's okay. I don't see if there any questions but I've remembered something I forgot a leg or do you remember you're supposed to take notes today. Clearly I did not. Oh dear. What was just said that I will. So will this. And I will go. I apologize. Thank you for not reminding you it's written on a piece of paper here but I got whatever and didn't say anything I apologize to this is being recorded so I should have said that this meeting is being reported and there is a will be a transcript like I can send you it's not, you know, it's, I don't know 85% accurate or whatever it is but paper to continue my note taking responsibilities. Maybe we have a couple minutes anyway we could see if anybody has a question they'd like to ask him. Paul has his hand up. Oh, and then Rob me. So, I mean I first I do want to credit the past administration for really managing through a rough cobit time was incredible effort and resilience and expanding services and being creative and how they expanded into university and motor lodge and, and I think just, you know, moving year round all that stuff so the credit to, to Kevin for all the work that he did and, and into securing the additional funding so I think we start there. I love everything you're saying Tim in terms of moving into a deeper direction in terms of not just the harm reduction model. The town is supportive of obviously a kind of supportive of it. And I think that the whole sort of areas going at 132 North Hampton Road which is our supportive housing, a big piece of that, and we hope to do more of that in our town that's moving forward on some projects that might be additional beds like that, that will help in that transition to helping to not solve the homeless problem but to give people homes. And so I just I loved everything you said the energy that you're bringing is palpable everybody in the community feels what you've brought to it. The leadership of you know that the board leadership of Craig stores is really re energized by I think a lot of it is do your sort of leadership that you've brought. So just thank you for stepping up and being being there. So, thank you so much and I do as well want to echo Paul sentiment and I apologize if I wasn't loud or Tory enough what Kevin accomplished is immeasurable.  We managed that. Again just remarkably well so yeah if I if I was not celebratory enough of my predecessor I apologize but it's definitely from the foundation that he built that that we're moving forward from. Absolutely. So, Rob. Yeah, thanks for the presentation. I'm what you were describing deeper rather than, or deeper rather than broader sounded somewhat like what it was me connections is doing I was wondering if there was overlap or whether you were doing the same thing. Yeah, yeah. No, it's a, that's a terrific question and you're exactly right wayling and I have a really great relationship. We there is absolutely overlap. There was an extended period where we were not. It's funny we we have a an office in the ACC building Craig stores does in the top right corner that's technically our case management office. And so we developed an informal relationship but we hadn't been collaborating at a level that I really look forward to, to pushing forward with. They do amazing work. Lots of it is the same work and on occasion the same funding sources that we have. I've had a myriad of conversations with wayling, where we were able to recognize the potential of us working together and us learning from her operation as well. Again, we're a, we're a shelter who is moving into the case management space as that becomes standard operating procedure for for shelters across the state. But absolutely, we are working with them to a lesser degree than I would like right now but as we stabilize and reach a point of sustainability, working closely with Amherst survival center and ACC. We look forward to sort of our the in between from both of those programs and we look forward to playing the role of facilitator and ensuring that that the three of us are collaborating and working in conjunction with each other. Thanks. Thank you. I had a question. Thanks. Yes, I have a question. So, again, what Paul and Rob said in terms of accolades just amazing and I absolutely agree with you. We have individuals who have so much potential and engaging them and building on their strengths is what you know is what's going to be successful. You mentioned that you have a really high opportunity or ability to move people into housing. Where are they going and what kind of supports are they being provided to ensure that that engagement continues. And I know that you know your your heart is heavily Amherst and my concern is that they're being moved out of a community that they're that you're creating for them with each other and the connection with you so how does then you know that connection stay not necessarily with you but others who may provide that same engagement and support and strength based sort of future possibilities. Sure, but that's such an insightful question. There's, there's a, there's a few responses that I have and again I have a tendency to be amazed, you know, mused by the sound of my own voice so I'll try and not go too too long but as a quick anecdote. We had housed someone. Five years ago, they had been chronically homeless. They had basically the last 15 years of their life was five years in a shelter five years in a woman's prison five years in a shelter. We were able to acquire housing. And I think we somewhat ignorantly thought that they would be thrilled by the opportunity, and they were until the day of moving when they grew to inebriated to move in frankly. And I think that there was, we had neglected to take into consideration that, okay, for five years they were in a shelter surrounded by people with similar experience. Five years after that they were in a woman's prison surrounded by people with similar experience. Five years after that they were back in a shelter surrounded by people with personal experience, and now they're moving into their place and it's isolation and that sort of fear of being alone was something that we had neglected to take into consideration so let me try and answer all of the pieces where they are going is relative to each individual guest.  Others recognize rightfully that homeless people don't have an address right by nature of being unhoused. They're not citizens of anywhere, you know, they certainly are but aren't treated as such or afforded the same opportunity so I think that our focus is allowing our guests to move into whatever community, they are afforded the opportunity to and they're interested in so we're never forcing folks into housing circumstances there's a lot of guests who turned into homeless spaces which was a bit you know it's always shocking I think to to new staff. They're, I will give credit to Elliot services, who function out of Northampton they have a C spec program that provides continued support for our folks when they get housed. I think that most of the folks that we work with would love to be in Amherst and Hadley and we've been really successful at at finding those placements in rolling green and the various other apartment complex within the space. There's that that the complexes that are next to the pride on the main road they're heading toward the mall. And so we try and work with what is available locally. Again, the guest takes the lead right they're the expert on their experience they're the expert on where they want to go. And we try to acquiesce to that as much or accommodate for that as much as we can. And then we always ensure that there's a warm hand off with another agency it doesn't matter what it is in one case in the in the anecdote that I shared it was actually a was helping them align with a sponsor and knowing that they had some sense of community before saying. Good luck. The other thing is we're never just saying goodbye and good luck where we're always ensuring that they know that we're available to them the resource center is open nine to five Monday through Friday. If they ever need to get ahold of us we're here, and we'll always be here to support them. Regardless of their housing status. Or any other circumstances that that might impact their, their, their larger experience. I think I had most of what you're looking for I hope. Cool. We got a couple more minutes and it looks like Paul has another comment or question or something. Yeah, I just question if it's okay Carol if Tim could you explain for the group and for the five members in our audience who how you came to this work. Oh sure. So my journey is is a bit of a long one I spent most of my career in in business, particularly in development and sales I lived. Actually, actually I know you're enjoying hiatus right now I spent years in hiatus and I worked for a small it consulting firm out in center bill which is inside of hiatus. And from there, I ended up volunteering and then serving on the board of directors for the United Way, when I was about 24. During my time at the United Way I grew to really know the nonprofit space on the Cape and I fell in love with the work. I ended up serving on the board of directors for Shays no limit basketball league which is also out of hiatus. It's more of a mentorship program that it is a basketball league there's a basketball component. And fell in love with that. I came back to Western Massachusetts because I had been admitted into a master's program at UMass Boston I was supposed to be here temporarily. COVID hit. I came back into Gould Farm which is a residential therapeutic community and Otis mass further west. I performed my internship there loved it. That wrapped up I came back to Western Mass and started working for Kevin, just as like a side job while I was earning my master's relative to circumstances that kept arising I found myself in different positions, while navigating a full time graduate schedule. And again I just sort of fell in love the further I my journey within the nonprofit space and particularly working with the unhoused grew the more my affinity for the work grew and yeah I've really taken to it I also have lived experience as it relates to substance abuse personally and within my my larger family. And so, as I often say, you know, a couple of other decisions and I'd be in a bed, rather than in the office so it very much a strong reminder to me that this is a mission of equality, and the importance of treating everyone with dignity and respect can can't be understated and the impact that that can happen so I've entered a space that allows me to remind myself every day. First of all it offers purpose, and it reminds me every day of the principles that I really trying and guide myself through life with. And it's an opportunity to exercise those in an act of service. Thank you so much. Thank you. Can I add something for a second. Okay. Um, well, I haven't looked at the Amherstown website in a little while but I just don't, I can't imagine that we are using social media effectively because it just hasn't happened yet that there's like a place on the Amherstown website that says, Do you need rental assistance click here. Do you need emergency housing click here. Do you like there's all these services that exist. And I'm not totally sure that the outreach part is happening very effectively. And so it's like, there's a lot of resources that is good, but I think we need to like, reach out to people that need it better. So if I could, I'll respond to that so to be clear actually, we're not, we're not a municipal department we're not we're not a part of the Amherst government, but we experienced the we're in that the position that you just described perfectly in captures where we're at as well in terms of the lack of outreach and a lack of social media, the as a product of the transition some of our passwords were lost and so we're still trying to recover our Facebook account. But you could not be more on point, both in terms of how we want to be advertising to the community so that they can potentially support and get involved with us and simultaneously to the folks who need our services. We had a very outdated inaccurate website that we're currently overhauling as a development project. We're trying to get the students who work for us and are particularly savvy in the social media space to leverage those tools. Yeah, it's just it's a really astute observation and it's, it's a project that that we're actively working on and I would say the entire community of folks who offer the service the same services that we do across western mass are also a bit behind. I mean I would, I would like to see like a clickable link on the Amherst town website and I would love to see like a fit like a Twitter feed that has clickable links and a Facebook feed that has clickable links I mean, homeless people have the internet. More than ever. Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. Yeah, they're, they're, you know, there's a lot of prejudices and stereotypes surrounding the unhoused population but yeah they're incredibly nimble in their technology use because they're regularly having to sign on to a new network or utilize a new device or, you know, that's how they get their information. So, I totally support you in that sentiment. It looks like he has something to say. I'm sorry, I did did you have more, Ashley. No, it's just that I mean, I guess what I'm thinking is that creating housing is one thing that is very important. The, the avenues to get the people in the housing is kind of is almost like a different thing but it's, it's very important. It's as important. Absolutely. Okay. Sure, thanks. Thanks, Tim. I'm Nate. I'm a planner with the town and, you know, we'll probably meet more as the as the future goes on.  You apply for two years, right? You apply for two years of funding or is it year for this day? I mean, it is new this year.  Absolutely. So it's that that's a question in process right now I would say we did have to submit budgets to DHCD forecasting through 2024 so the 2324 procurement period wrapped up. And I will say that in an ideal space we would be operating two facilities, one a congregate shelter, and one the more sort of transitional housing space that the UML provides. So in an ideal world we would always have those two space at 24-7, 365, both of those spaces, and our resource center. The reality that we've seen particularly in this sort of experimental summer that we that we utilize it's the first time that we've been open to sites through the summer usually sheltering is considered a winter endeavor. But the number of lives that have been saved as a product of being indoors with us is an estimable. I mean, no, it probably is estimable, but I would imagine probably nine to 10. We have pulled people from encampments that were critically ill. We have brought people back from overdoses via the administration of Narcan on our sites, all, all of which would have been impossible in an encampment. We were able to how well sheltered to pregnant women who were who had not received prenatal care. We're recognizing that people don't stop suffering in homelessness, just because the temperature improves that if we look at this as a legitimate societal concern that we need to treat it like a legitimate societal concern and not like something that just pops up when the weather gets cold. I also recognize that my approach is a little bit more progressive than other operations that are that are just working overnight shelter so I'm not suggesting I'm the only authority on the subject. I'm exclusively pulling from my own experience at Craig's doors. You know last year we started as an overnight shelter at the Lutheran church as a product of coven we became a 24 hour shelter and we never turned back. The efficacy of a 24 hour shelter in improving the quality of life and in establishing permanent housing solutions supportive permanent housing solutions for the chronically homeless. It's just increased dramatically since we've had this 24 hour year round model. Part of that is just a product of engaging with them more. But I also think part of it is the development of that community and that trust and the relationships that are required for them to be able to heal. We're a very trauma informed model we focus on the reality that most of these folks are in their circumstance, relative to a life of experiences that we can't capture and so we just try and maintain positive regard for these folks to try and believe in them until they can believe in themselves and I think that that requires 24 hour home support a safe place to go. And from a operations perspective. I will tell you that running an overnight shelter when we're a low barrier shelter is incredibly difficult because we get folks warm and safe and then in the morning we kick them out into the world they have nowhere to go it's freezing cold out nothing is available. They return to their more maladaptive coping mechanisms they show up belligerently drunk. We're a low threshold shelter but we're not going to put people out on the street, you know so now we're having to navigate the impact not only on the individual but the impact that they're going to have on their neighbor and our staff and thus our organization as a whole. So we're able to monitor behavior throughout the day and provide supports. The outcomes are just again it's just a it's just a brighter and and brought in a much more comprehensive success in terms of the outcome. So, again, to be a bit more concise. Well, hopefully we're going to stick around for a long time. The ILC. I'm hopeful I'm waiting on a call later tonight. They may be interested in returning to an overnight operation and if that were the case, you know, we'll do what we can to explore other spaces for the 24 hour site but that might be where we need to end up this year but the ideal, the ideal. The ideal sustainable model for Craig's doors is a congregate shelter, a resource center and a transitional housing space. Okay, so hopefully we can move on because we do have we have to get to our planning of our forum that's coming up which is the next thing on our agenda so is there anyone who just desperately needs to say something else or can we move on. Then I'm going to pass it on to Erica is going to take us into the next part of the agenda. Thank you, and I think, Tim, I just want to thank you for really raising awareness in our excellent conversation about why this Amherst municipal affordable trust is doing the work that it's doing because we're really interested in all the way from the on house to permanent housing and home ownership so we'll do as much as we can to help create that, that has trajectory where people can actually get housed. All right, so the next area is discussing the September forum. It's going to be on Tuesday, September 13 at 630 from 630 to 8 to 830pm. The location social hall of the Unitarian Universal Universalist Society and Amherst, but we have a question for the group which is, we want the group to consider the possibility of moving this to a zoom meeting versus an in person or something to just hold right now. In terms of planning and I hope john is here because john was also going to provide an update. The last time we talked, we had looked at outreach, and Risha I think you're going to work with john to think about a plan for outreach, especially around the Fort River school community, then working possibly with wayfinders to really think about a good outreach plan so we can get as many people involved as possible in this conversation and finding out about, you know, the wayfinders project. John, if he's here he's going to give us an update around the Amherst meeting. Okay, good. And some of the reasons why we're thinking about zoom versus in person as well. And then we were thinking about what are some of the logistical needs and how can we support those logistical needs. And we're both Carol and I are going to open up the meeting. And but I'm going to let john talk a little bit about where we're at with the forum and then I'll talk about what Carol and I intend to do and get some feedback from all of you. I know from wayfinders this year too so she might want to come in and to be, if she has things to say with john, you can decide john. Yeah, yeah, and we just have one more meeting before that but we really want to make sure that we're totally organized and providing support necessary for this to be successful. Yeah, I just sorry before john. Nice to see I just want to say that the decision for remote or in person will, you know, would be nice to make it tonight because you know we need to get that going in terms of information to the public and if we want to post on the calendar or flyers or anything. So you know I don't want to pressure anyone but I think at the conclusion of the discussion tonight it'd be nice to have a decision there just so we can, you know, get get that moving. I agree Nate. Risha wants to speak to talk about outreach. And if Michelle Macadera wants to speak I think that's fine as well. The market did a good job of summarizing what the plan is, as it stands right now, I have one new piece of information that may impact on whether or not we want to switch to a zoom meeting, rather than an in person meeting. I have been in email conversation with Amherst media. And this morning late this morning I received a note from Jim Lesko who's the manager of Amherst media. They have been considering our request which was to do a video of the meeting as it's occurring and also to broadcast it live over their channel. The note that I got from Jim indicates that that's not what they're going to be able to do and it's a short note so I'll read it. I did over and have come to the conclusion that the amount of work to stream live out of that location, compounded by the fact that a lot of slides will be presented. We feel would work best for us and hopefully you is for us to videotape the event. Get the slides from way finders so we can insert them with full resolution. And then we would have a show to cable cast numerous times and upload to our YouTube account, the quality of videotaping offer a screen and or wall doesn't translate well. So, basically, while they will certainly record the event, they're not going to be able to stream it live which was one of the hopes that we had. So, then we kind of have a difficult decision to make which is, what's the value of streaming it live which we can do over zoom. Versus having the in person meeting at the UU social hall. We've had an in person meeting for at least two years of this kind. I can't remember exactly when the last one was. We've generally had good attendance at in person meetings, but we've also had pretty good attendance, but zoom meetings. Depending upon the forum we've had anywhere I would say from 50 to 80 plus people attending in a zoom forum. At that point of view, I think community participation is as likely with zoom as it is with an in person meeting. So that's the major decision we need to make. If we do decide to do it over zoom I'm sure Amherst media would keep a copy of the meeting. It appears over zoom and make it available on their website. That may actually be easier for them to do than to come to the UU social hall and record the meeting live. And then insert we find your slides afterward. So, basically I agree with Nate we should probably make that decision tonight. Because we need to have a poster to share around and that would have to carry the information about the link to the zoom meeting. And we have to let the UU particularly know that while we thank them for originally scheduling this we're not going to go forward with it. It looks like Michelle had something she wants to say at this point. Okay, I think I'm unmuted correct. Yes. Okay. I'm just curious what you guys are seeing in Amherst for covert cases because I know in South Hadley in like the day cares and childcare and things like that. It's running rampant. And you know when this forum is supposed to hit, we're going to be back in school. I'm just wondering if it's safer. You know, for us to be doing it via zoom, just throwing that out. All has his hand up so maybe has a response. Yeah, I mean, clearly being in your own, you know, on your own screen is safer together. We've lost the ability to really track COVID because we're not doing people aren't reporting the tests anymore. We don't do asymptomatic testing anymore. But I think you're right. We're just sort of anecdotally knowing a lot of people in town hall who are, you know, just my circle of friends, people are contracting the virus. I think you're right to be concerned about after Labor Day when all the college students come back and people go back to school I think they're, we don't know what's going to happen. So I think the uncertainty is against us if we want to meet in person, because we would have to be prepared to it to zoom pretty quickly. And that could be. I know Risha wants to speak. So let's let Risha speak and then maybe you can just take a quick vote. Okay. I have been thinking through a marketing plan for the forum with John, and it's still very draft. It doesn't look like I can actually share screens, which is fine. I can talk through it, but actually we mean just so you know where I'm coming from I do social marketing and behavior change for my career so that means marketing of social ideas and trying to get people to adopt pro social behaviors, typically. And so the way we do this usually is to think through the goals and then the target audiences which I know people hate those terms. There are barriers and motivators for them to adopt those behaviors and then we think of it as four P's so the product price place and promotion that would get us there. So we've identified two goals for the forum. The first is to build support for the development as well and in that is reduce or address any opposition to the development, and the, the target audience for that is to the neighbors. I'm going to stop there and explain the other one but I need to come back because I do have some questions on what we know about the neighbors. Well, let me just go down that road so typically we think about an archetype so try to personalize the the neighbor and to me the neighbor groups fall into a few categories there are the landlords who rent out nearby the developments. There are the residents themselves who may rent or own places nearby. And then there are the business and I'm counting sort of churches and schools within the business community, but they could be considered slightly separate. But they may not live nearby but they spend a good deal of their time and care about the people coming through their doors. I don't know. I looked on Zillow in the neighborhoods. It looks like there's been immense turnover of home ownership in the area. Over the past two years so it looks like about 50% of the homes in that area were bought in 2021. So I, you know, it's only what Zillow says I can't vouch for how accurate Zillow is sale in place is in that is in that vicinity and so that also contributes a lot there's a lot of properties in that within like the 200,000 range. I don't know anything about these landlords I don't know if they are. They're living there. I don't know if they own if they're renting it out and own multiple properties. I don't know anything about the demographics of who owns them. Do any of us know anything about that or is there a public record that I could look at. Risha you and I should talk, you know, tomorrow or next week and I'll tell you really bad horror stories and actually I wouldn't know right now but you know we have property records cards and then if I know names we can look up you know you can do LLC lookups through the state database and determine who you know who's the individual but you know as far as I understand a lot of it is rental, you know, there's a few immediate neighbors to Belcher town not to well to both but homeowners to East Street school who would be concerned with the development. They voiced it previously. You know and then there's you know so there's two sides right there is the school and then there's Belcher town road. So yeah we can talk. You know and I mean in terms of how broad you're looking we can just, you know I could we can I can set up a zoom meeting and we can look at a property map and just spend some time walking through it. Okay, happy to do that. And I'm sorry we haven't connected earlier. That's fine. To go down further on that so assuming that we don't have any particular knowledge within this group about who those employees are and who the residents are. Hypothetically, what we've come up with as barriers and motivators for them to be in support versus be opposing the development. There are concerns about return on investment for either owners or those who the owners who rent out or owners who reside. I'm concerned about noise quality of life parking would also impact businesses potentially, and the types of people moving in and those are just the kinds of opposition you hear around almost any affordable housing so whether they're going to come up in this case I can't speak to but those are the typical complaints. Schools in theory. This is a guest would likely be happy to just have more students in their neighborhood. So Fort River School would theoretically just be happy that there's family housing and more students. And the businesses would be happy to have more customers. Again, with the caveats of, you know, we don't like all these people hanging out or the parking or the noise or whatever they're people scaring away our customers. Does that feel like I've covered the reasons that people may or may not be opposed to this. Can I just say that with 132 North Hampton Road, a lot of these issues came up, and it was the forms were phenomenal in terms of how they address these. So I think you know you're on point with what concerns I heard from the neighborhood from people in the neighborhood. At the same time there are lots of people who supported. You know this so I think you know, I think it's great finding out you know what are the barriers and I love the fact that you also have motivators, because I think that's, you know, thinking about what the motivators are for people to support it is really really important. And I just remember all the conversations and having people come and talk about how they're so excited to have to have an inclusive community and and being welcoming to others. So, you know, what I was going to say is, yeah I think identifying that and then you know Michelle's on the call but then how, you know, how way finders addresses those right so, you know, with North Hampton road the most recent one, I mean it was to the point where people are asking about the police records or, you know, the response of, you know at the time was valley CDC for other properties that were similar so, you know, if you know are there what were the typical types of complaints against those properties how are they damaged. And you know, oftentimes a product's built and developed and then two years, three years go by and then everyone forgets what happened because there are any issues but it's easy to say that now but when it's happening. You know it's hard to explain so yeah I like I like where we're, you know, how we're trying to set it up. I do think that, you know, there, I guess I think the immediate butters will probably be most concerned and so then, you know, things like screening right noise light. All those things are just kind of the tangible impacts of development and there may be more but first word you said screening screening like so you know if you know like right up, you know, through vegetation or fencing like how do you buffer. Okay, you know an immediate property adjacent to the development in terms of. Okay. Michelle has her hand up. So, you know, one of the big things is tax values. You know, people always complain that their value of their property is going to go down with when affordable housing moves in that one's hard to fight because it doesn't but there's no real good, you know, data to prove that it doesn't. Your values won't go down. Of course everybody's concerned about the people who are going to be moving in and how management screens and we'll have management on or they're at the meeting.  We hear this a lot but in, you know, we tried to tell people, the number of children are going to impact our schools and our schools are going to be overcrowded. But as all of us here probably know schools are asking for children. They've had a declining enrollment for how many years and so the other one is parking, you know, because we don't usually do a two for one parking in our developments because we know and we will address that because we have, you know, investments in Amherst, and, you know, we basically do one for one, and not all of our spaces. Traffic traffic always going to impact. Allegra has a hand up. Like, oh, what, well, one thing I was thinking just in terms of perhaps a strategy to garner support is thinking about the fact that I mean if it's family housing and we're rebuilding the Fort River School to house, you know, two of the elementary schools kind of there's this parallel process of projects going on right there. And wouldn't it be great to as we're creating a new school create housing for families that will then utilize that school. Yes, so maybe it makes sense for me to go into the the four P's and I know that's very marketing but and I'll explain what they mean and in this kind of environment but the product is what we're offering and as I agree Allegra I think that the the framing is probably around family housing. Although it's mixed but to emphasize the family I think cuts down an enormous amount of potential opposition pleasantly designed with ample parking was my little description of what I saw. Obviously that needs to be correct. But I think that the product is is such that it will negate a lot of the potential opposition that we saw with more single unit housing developments. I think I can talk about what else can be added to the description or in reality. The price in this context is not what it costs to to rent or buy a unit it is what it costs for someone to be supportive of the of the development. And that can be time that can be finances. I think here is where we want to emphasize that there could be an economic boom now it's not a huge amount of housing but you're bringing more customers into the area there are more customers for your businesses there are more students for your schools, which as you said, Michelle is is wanted in this case. But, but people might not know that so it's a good talking point to emphasize that our schools are under crowded, not overcrowded. And the place is how we would talk to them about this. And so where are you going to reach these folks and that's why understanding who they are is really useful because if they are landlords that don't live in town. That might be a different method of reaching them than if we, you know are going to people who actually live in those houses. So I guess is the door to door visits and mailers and school leadership meetings to get because I do think the school will be quite supportive and can be an ally in this. And then finally the promotion so what, what would we say on our flyers because that's the promotion we're doing. So I, I sort of have this framed around sort of completing a neighborhood or making the neighborhood complete, bringing back our community. As, as thoughts of how we might want to frame the kinds of benefits that we really get with this and how we introduce it so, as I said that's one half of the plan because there is another goal around more unrelated to this development and more supportive of affordable housing or generally, but any thoughts on any of what I've said for that part of it. Michelle, I want to eat a lot. Yeah sorry john. That's okay I want to add one thing here. When we were looking at 132 North Hampton road there was very determined opposition from the immediate neighborhood. We were surprised if we see that here. Nonetheless, we were successful in countering that opposition by having people write letters to town council speak at public meetings who were in favor of the development. And I think that as we plan for this event. I would probably ask anywhere from say three to five people who we think would be in favor of the development to speak publicly at the forum. You know, for example, the religious community that's closest is the Jewish community of Amherst. We could have somebody from the JCA potentially speak in favor of this development. Similarly we look for other people. And I think that that might be a useful thing for us to have planned in advance. How much time to plan this. I'm really getting concerned about the time that we actually have. Yeah, I agree Michelle. You know my my site design isn't finalized yet. And I don't even know what my, my, my house. You're fading out Michelle. I know it's zoom and it's me I'm fading believe me. I think Michelle, that's a really good point I guess you know we can talk about, you know, how, how and where way finders is in the process so you know, and I think we should like what exactly are we doing the for outreach, you know, would we mail a person within 300 feet which is kind of a standard process for, you know, permitting and would we also, you know, we can create, you know, put on the community calendar, it would be a posted trust meeting can be advertised other ways through the town. But I think we get you know, we can talk about that. And in Michelle right, you know, is this an informal meeting or is this something that you would package as part of the project eligibility so it becomes. It would be package part of the project eligibility. Right. At least one of, you know, though. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so that yeah I think that's good yeah I do. I agree John I don't, I mean I was just looking online while we're talking at who's the owners are and there's a lot of non owner occupied many of them live out of town. Not that's not saying that the residents or the owners won't be, you know, curious or anxious about what's happening. But you know there are multi unit developments in the neighborhood so you know, you know we can say that in terms of the scale of development. I feel like it's, you know there's already density and multi unit development so it's not out of character. You know not you know so I think yeah I mean the town we were excited by, you know, by all this and we still are so I think most people I don't know how you know it's funny, you know this happened. In the street school we, you know, and move forward but you know I'm not sure how much people have been keeping track of it or what they know right now so you know I keep thinking like oh everyone will know about this but it may be a surprise to a lot of people in the community. And so I think we have to kind of be prepared for that that some people may come and really not know much about the project or the process.  And then maybe another piece that begins with a few people saying, gee, this is going to be great. And then a little bit of, if we just make those pieces in an agenda than each, or different people can work on the different parts that they're supposed to work on and I think that it will work and it will be like, this is the first time out of the gate, this is exciting and positive and, and I don't want to get it overwhelmed by the things we think might happen I want way finders to present their great wonderful idea of how it's going to be. I agree, but, like I said, I don't even have a site design right now for one of the properties. So I may not be able to show anything. But I'm getting concerned time is running out. What do you have an idea of what you will do if you don't have a site design I mean do you have a thing that you can do instead, or are we just doing this too soon. Can you help me on this one.  Yeah, I mean, I mean, when do you think if our architects have three weeks. Yeah, we're meeting next, we're meeting next week right. I forgot the date but that's on the LD that's on the LDA. Right, well I think it was also would also tack on the site design so I mean I feel like. Okay, I did not know that all right. Yeah, I mean Dave and I think that's what we talked and assume that. So, yeah I mean you know it's funny I think people respond better to you know something visual but if there's just a concept site design for both sites and even if there's, I mean, you know, it may be that the what the building basically looks like is going to change the permitting and so you know when Diane presented to the trust a while ago there's you know some, you know preliminary numbers for housing units and income range. I think all that. Yeah, I was you know having the architects going to be part of this, and let them do their little spiel about the passive house and energy, you know conservation and the green of it. And then you know we were going to have property management speak but it is, it is nice to be able to show the butters, what the property is going to look like. It really is. Yeah, I find that goes a long way. You know that they're not getting a, you know, 10 story where a lot of people I don't know have this misconception of affordable housing, you know, something from Chicago being built in their backyard. And so a nice rendering goes a long way. Michelle, what are the barriers to having this what you want to have in place by the forum. Well, most of it is, most of it I already have pulled together john. So we already have a PowerPoint. I mean you saw the PowerPoint we presented PowerPoint. Some of it's still pulled together, but it's the timeline, I'm uncertain of the timeline, just due to, you know, certain things so I'm, I don't know how, I mean we can speak very vaguely about the timeline right now. I don't want to speak more specific about what I really feel is the timeline, because I don't want to, you know, set a certain timeline in it not come close to fruition at all. You know, so it's just there's a lot of little things. It's just I am getting concerned of where we are. You know, and yeah we're talking it's a month away. If I can ask Michelle, when do you think you're at the point where you'd feel comfortable and confident about presenting this are we talking about another two weeks a month away or like six weeks, seven weeks or just five weeks. I will feel more comfortable after probably our meeting next week with the town. You know, if, you know, the thing is moving we're not stopping. I mean, we've got our whole design team in place now I've got all of our due diligence team in place now we're moving forward as fast as we can. But I'd like it to be a little bit more in place. I, I hear that it's uncomfortable but I guess I'm, we have a schedule for the 13th is there a reason that you think we should change that or will you manage to be able to do whatever you can do it won't be perfect but it will be whatever it is is that okay. That is fine as long as you know that you know the some of the things are, we'll have to make sure you know I will feel better next week after I'm meeting I really will. And I think Nate can agree you know, there are certain things that we need to still work on. And once we have a little bit better understanding. Next week, I'll feel more confident, and I'll be more upbeat I promise it's an exciting it isn't exciting I love this project I really do. I love this design that we came up with. I, I think it's phenomenal. You know, the people that we're going to help the families we're going to help. Right. Yeah, so I agree so we're meeting next week early next week, the town and wayfinders and so you know, like I said we're still finalizing some details with contract and other things so I think that's you know where Michelle is hesitant because you know that that isn't all in place. I agree I you know so the concept for the East Street school is really nice and you know they wayfinders has adjusted the concept for belts for belch town road. You know, the trust when they presented there was some comments about you know the parking wasn't front and was more. You know, we'd like to bring the building closer to have a village center feel as opposed to an office park feel and that's something that they're working on so you know I feel like it's in a position where you know wayfinders does want to move forward this fall with say starting permitting so I think this is you know Michelle even I agree even if the visuals aren't ready I feel like we would be great just to get this the conversation started. And knowing that you know you have to go through product eligibility and then you know that's a that's one phase and then we have to wait to start permitting after that so. Right, and there's a lot of diligence that needs to get done in between. So yeah, and I'm just trying to put together a realistic as realistic as possible timeline, because I don't want to give people a sense of false hope either. You know, when, when this is actually going to get built. Okay, so it sounds like we're going to stick with the date and the time. And it sounds to me that you know our agenda is we're going to open it up and introduce this way finders going to take it from there. And then we're, I don't know who the we is but someone's going to find three to five speakers to be putting out how they support this. Is there anybody who wants to volunteer to do that. I'll work on that Erica. I'll work on so much. Thank you. Thank you to come up with a tenant or two who may want to speak. I mean we can ask our tenants at other developments within Amherst. So let me put that out there to see if we can get a tenant who would be willing to speak at the public forum. I think having somebody from Olympia Oaks would make sense Michelle if you can do that. I will check on that. Not guaranteeing we can get somebody but I will check. And it's a beautiful place so people haven't gone by there. It's a very nice place. Okay. All right, so what else do you need. We should you have everything you need. Well I'm only halfway done. Okay. We're only halfway there. So I mean one of the things I want to point out is that if the, the most recent or the closest landlords are not living there and live out of town. That might influence the decision on whether to go virtual versus in person. I'm not likely to attend if it's virtual I would presume. And that is up to the, the trust to decide that but I just want to point that out. I also think, and maybe I'm wrong here but the sale in place that having that in the near vicinity, I feel like is a model for there is higher density housing in the area and to my knowledge there hasn't been a huge amount of problems now. Maybe I've forgotten and didn't know when it started but I think that there's already a model. There's a lot of people in the neighborhood so people I don't think would feel like it's changing the face of the neighborhood that much. And to Carol's point about being negative. I mean, I'm not suggesting we say any of this stuff this is the, the stuff we consider so we have the answers, if and when the opposition comes out and aren't surprised by it. The other side of this is the other goal I would think for the, for the forum is to have people sign up to keep informed to become more active in affordable housing in the town. I think I joked with john he said, you know, the goal is to share information and let people know what's happening and I said if I if you were my client, because I am a consultant. I was never to share information the goal is to make something somebody do something with that information. And so I think the thing you want people to do is, and I am open to other suggestions but is sign up for a mailing list or sign up to be connected so that as things happen they are informed and can engage. And ideally that that would be a place where we could also give them prompts of how to engage. So who are these people. This is where I've actually done the most work. I looked at the mailing list and Googled every single person who signed up and looked at them. And so this is my version of their demographics I didn't ask how they identify themselves in any of these. So classes at age, gender, ethnicity, and on the list they had been categorized as sort of why they were on the list. So of our actually just closed that of our 86 people on a list and I think it was a slightly outdated list because there was some technical difficulties getting the right one. So the 86 names I had. We have 70% are female. 3% unknown, and that was because I couldn't. Oh, most of those are because we are sending to an organization not a person. And so I don't know who it's going to. I created some categories of who these people are. The largest group was categorized as a housing advocate. I think what that means is they just are interested in housing but don't have official roles within any current organization a huge number of these were past trust members or past other kind of community affordable housing community organizations members. So that was 35% the next greatest group were people who I called CSO and connected. So these are people who work for local NGOs and sort of connect us with them. And that was 24% 18% worked in the government. Town of Amherst 12% worked for an affordable housing org. These are not overlapping. I picked a category for each. 2% were developers 2% were businesses. One, and 1% was a journalist, and 2% were connectors. Which means that they didn't seem to have an interest themselves but for instance they were a representative for a church, and would share messages but it wasn't really for themselves. 81% are white. I identified them as white. 7% are Hispanic 6% are black 5% are unknown 1% is Asian so that's not great. I don't know the exact makeup of the town but I assume that's not reflective. And age. We're all old. I made guesses and I made random categories of age brackets. So I decided that the categories were going to be under 40 over 40 or over 60 so the middle is 40 to 60. And I think, and I'm probably wrong about a lot of these because I'm really just looking at pictures and guessing ages and this is not my forte but I think 20% are above 60. 65% are 40 to 60, and only 9% are under the age of 40. And that's not judgments right I mean it may be youth is not the target audience for our work, but it is a statement of who has signed up and who has engaged with us thus far. So, all that to say, our current supporters are white female over the age of 40, and actively involved in affordable housing or local nonprofits. I'm looking in our supporter list that could be. And so I should frame here I'm not looking to turn people who are opposed to affordable housing into signing up for our mailing list. I'm looking to tap into people who could be supporters who might be but have not actively engaged in any way at this point, but are sort of, you know, in concept, supporting. And so we have no people of color, not no but almost none. Not many people under the age of 40, and not many men. So that would be groups that we might think about specifically doing outreach to to engage with an affordable housing. And maybe I'll stop there if there's any thoughts or comments and apologies to everyone who I miss aged, gendered or raced in looking at their pictures. I just just I just want to I just want to say that I'm totally thoroughly supportive of this work and I hope we hire consultants in a general sort of way because the outreach piece is just so lacking like people under 40 are the people that need the affordable housing that have like single father homes, single mother homes, people of color, low income people tend to be can be single parents, people under 40, etc. We, we have to like find them. I think is one add that we should hire consultants. I just wanted to clarify, Risha, when you said our mailing list, you mean the mailing list that we're using to advertise or announce for me. Thank you. We do not have an a trust mailing list, we have a mailing list for the Amherst hasn't coalition that we push people towards in case they want to engage and they can share information about what's going on in affordable housing that and we can share information to them to be shared. If we so desire but yes I'm sorry, I didn't clarify we don't have a mailing list. Thank you. So I'd like the piece of, we have to make a decision if we're going to do in person and soon, but the piece that one of the goals is to get people to sign on to action. I think, you know, john I don't know Michelle john Risha and Carol if we need to meet and to flesh out the agenda a little bit more. So we're clear about what we're doing what our roles are and how much time we're spending on each. That's fine with me. I wasn't clear what I was allowed to do that wouldn't violate an open meeting so, you know, I didn't want to share this through email or ask any questions. You know, with larger groups, but it is very hard to do this. And probably is not the greatest use of time to do this, you know, in a regularly scheduled meeting was good information. And I think it's important for us to understand who was engaged in who we need to engage. So, I think that was very important. Okay, so I think this. Sorry, I'm not finished. Would you like, would you like me to talk to someone directly separately and open up the rest of the meeting, because I know we're getting late. I think we need to. If there are three trust members I don't think it violates the, the open meeting law if we meet with john and Michelle to plan, complete planning this out. Okay. And I'm wondering if we need to meet, because, you know, Michelle's getting nervous about the time. I think we're also to getting nervous about this time we have one more trust meeting before the 13th. I was actually going to raise some some things about the slides that Carol now are going to be doing and introducing. And, you know, we do have some time but you know I'm also trying to figure out how much time the trust has to open up the meeting. You know what we were going to do is start off with sort of defining the problem around affordable housing and looking at some of the data presenting some of the data and what I was going to ask is if people, especially Nate and possibly Rita had more specific Amherst related data, the data that I looked at was what john actually presented in the CPA proposal. We had more specific data, taking a look at the goals of the trust the mission the goals of the trust presenting that. And then under each goal, the different actions that we've actually accomplished. And from that point is what continues to be the challenge and what actions. Our next steps are going to be in the trust. But I'm wondering if you know we also need to think about what it is that we want others to be doing in terms of action so why don't we first start with making a decision about in person versus zoom. So I would like to propose that we actually agreed to do this as a zoom meeting and see, I make a motion to vote to make this a zoom meeting, and then we can open up for anybody who disagrees. Second. Thank you. All right, so now anybody who has any concerns about making this a zoom meeting can can share their concerns. Okay, Risha. Just given the geographical nature of this, I think it would be likely to get a lot more neighborhood engagement. If they're all right there. I think we will get more engagement from beyond the neighborhood if it's on zoom. But to me that's not the priority. Question. I don't like it. I hear and agree with what you're saying Risha but I'm just wondering because it would be at the UU rather than in the neighborhood itself I wonder if that would change the demographic who might be coming or if that would make it less neighborhood oriented and more like middle of town oriented. Anybody else. Okay, then everyone who is in favor. I suppose I'll do a roll call. I'm in favor, Eric is in favor. Paul. Yes, Risha. No. Ashley. Well, I'm a little conflicted I think it would be better if it was in person but I understand that more people. I'm a little conflicted I'm sorry I mean it online is okay, but I think it's much better, even if it's later to be in person. I would like to say in person is better. So uses the name. Okay. Counting these votes. Yes. Thank you, Carol. I forgot which way it is. I believe it would be better in zoom which are that's yes right. That's a yes. Yes, thank you. Allegra did I get you. You did that. I am. Yes. Okay. All right I think I have everybody on the trust. So I think there were two names. Do you do Paul. All is yes. Oh yeah okay I'm sorry. Okay. So I, I think we have agreed to a zoom meeting. But that doesn't mean that in the future I'm sure this is not going to be the only meeting and I think Risha you raised a good point in terms of in the community, and that possibly maybe the school might want to have a response for meeting. So I think we should start off with introduction of this, and maybe the wider audience is even better, because then we can see who's supportive and where the concerns are, and then we can plan for a follow up. I mean I think this is probably going to be an ongoing education and outreach. I think we've agreed that the 13th will be a zoom. And I think we also agreed that we're going to have a group meeting a smaller group meeting with three of us trust members, Carol, Risha, myself, and then Michelle and john to flesh out the agenda, and make sure that we're all organized and ready for this on the 13th. Okay, anything else before we move off the forum. Okay. All right, so the next item on the agenda is, we had discussed the ideas of having committees. And I think actually you really raise a committee that I think is really important which is communications and public education. So again, this is sort of the follow up of having raised what different committees we thought might be of use and important and maybe one of us could volunteer to look at these particular areas. So around communications and public education would include updating the website. You had other ideas around Twitter. Facebook feed. I think you know, I've looked at the website to there's a lot of opportunity for updating there's a lot of good information but a lot of it is old. So I think you know that's definitely a committee that could, you know be formed and have a lot of opportunity to do outreach and education. So something to consider. And, okay, so the other committees are legislative initiative. We generally try to keep up and keep track of all the different legislative initiatives that come forward and share it here and sometimes there are opportunities to actually write letters of support. So that would be a second committee to consider the third committee would be coordination collaboration with other relevant groups of coalitions. We're already doing, you know, representing us and being bidirectional in terms of bringing back information that's relevant to our work and their work and finding opportunities to coordinate and support possibly sign on to different efforts or sign letters of support. So our strategic plan, our strategic strategic plan ends 2020 so it ends in December. And we need to think about the next five years what are we looking at in terms of developing a strategic plan and moving forward in the next next five years. Strategic plans are really sort of a blueprint and a guideline for what are we visioning what are our goals and how we how do we move forward. And so I think that's going to be really important to think about the development of strategic plan. I don't mean that this subgroup has to do the whole strategic plan but at least outlining it coming up with recommendations bringing back things that we can take a look at and respond to. The other one is looking at different housing types and promoting those different housing types so we talked about tiny houses accessory building units. And then also possibly looking at incentives for creating this type of housing types. And then the last one was looking at new and existing revenue for the trust. So these were all the different ideas we had, we had one more idea. You know, aren't comfortable with, you know, being on a committee or, or leading a committee. One of the things we also thought was that there's, there's so much information that's relevant with regard to our goals in our vision. If someone has an idea or an article or learns about initiative or project wants to bring someone in to talk about a particular area that they think the housing trust should incorporate, we should think about, you know, putting into the strategic plan to start action on, then you could raise you could bring that topic in you could invites that person in work with Carol and I put that person on the agenda, or if it's particular you know project or initiative. For example, someone had, you know, sort of explored what the seminal housing trust was doing and brought it back here. There was even a video link that they use just to sort of provide further information for the resources best practices that we can share here and incorporate. This is another opportunity for trust members to really be engaged and help us think about our own plans and our own vision. And part of what we're looking for is really to make sure that we're all engaged in this and that we all feel an opportunity that we have an opportunity to bring back ideas and to, you know, to think about where we're going to move ahead together. So that that is sort of the area of the subcommittees. Carol and I are available. If you want to send us that you're interested in being one of these on one of these committees, we'd like to leave one of these committees or you have a particular idea that you want to bring to the trust that just email Carol and I, and we'll work with you on that. And I know Ashley you'd also mentioned the possibility of having a consultant maybe looking at communications and a reach and an education plan for us. So that that would be something as well that could be a project that a trust member could lead. So that's a lot to think about. So I'm just going to open up if there are any comments or volunteers. So if no, you know, we don't have to make a decision tonight.  You know, and you can meet remotely, you know, I can help set that up and post and help with posting so you're just to let everyone know that so it's not something that you know you, you can meet on your own and just kind of, you know, meet spontaneously it does have to be posted, you know, 40 hours in advance and everything and there needs to be an agenda in a minute so you know that's I don't want to, I don't think it's an obstacle it's just that's the process of, you know, of setting it up. I think there are a number of topics that could be subcommittee so the trust had some before and, you know, you know, I'd say it could be a few hours every month outside of the regular scheduled meeting where you meet and research and come back and report to the trust and then, you know, we could, you know, set it, the subcommittee can set up a timeline right so whether six months from start you'd have a product or something so you know I'm not. I'll speak for myself I don't anticipate that you know in a month or two you're going to have something that's, you know, a finished product unless there's something, you know, low hanging fruit as we say that can be worked on so some of these can be also just setting things in motion and that's really what the subcommittees helping to do not necessarily, you know, completing a larger task but helping to move things forward. Thank you. And I would say right now, we already have a subcommittee that's working on this forum so, you know, Risha and Carol and I will work on this forum but there's so many opportunities to bring in, you know, to bring ideas to the trust to really think about next steps and really moving forward some of the goals that we have. Right. So think about it. If you're interested, send us send Carol and me email, any one of these and if there are any other ideas that you have please send them to us. We would just want to make sure that all of you feel that you have an opportunity to engage and to lead and to also share on your vision. Okay. All right, so the next I believe is you Carol around the CPA. Yeah, well, the Community Preservation Act committee is our is how you been will continue to be I hope are fundamental main source of financing. And this year, the application process applications open I think that means that you can find the thing you're supposed to fill out online on September 1 and there are due September 30. It seems very early, but there it is. So, and my understood at least what I understood from john about what the process was like before. There's a written thing that submitted and they're asked they ask you questions you have to respond probably you have to show up at some kind of a meeting and answer whatever those questions are some of the questions are written and you respond in writing. In order to try to make this happen on time. I'm going to try to make a draft of a proposal, I believe we only need the one this year to try to fund actual housing development work we have a few things that we expect will be in the pipeline ball lane, maybe eventually strong street. There are things that are coming down the lane so we would like to have funds there to be able to do what we need to do this this round of funding is called for the money won't be available until July of 24 or something so how in the world we're supposed to know what we want then I don't know. But luckily the housing trust is in the kind of unique position of being able to request funds because we think we will need them for something. And, and have some ideas of what that is but we don't have to actually always have a, this is the nuts and bolts of what we're doing. I'm going to try to draft something that I will have for our meeting on September 13. I would love to have one or two people volunteer to have me be able to say, here's what I've got. What do you want to add, what do you don't want to add in as long as there's not more than a couple of people. I think it will be fine all we're doing is working on something that is going to be presented on the 13th. So, if anyone is interested in doing that with me, please let me know. Now or later. Rob, and a leg, one, two, three, four, nobody else. That's it. Otherwise, I'm afraid we will risk some open meeting thing. But that means I'll have a draft, I will, I will, because I know, I know be Erica and I so Allegra and Rob great. Super question. And yes, I am still interested in helping but also are we referencing the meeting, the presentation meeting or our next trust meeting which I believe would be the eighth. Oh, it is the eighth. Yes, sorry, you're right. Thanks for. Thank you. Yes, it's the eighth. So yeah. So what's today I'll try to have something in the next two weeks, at least for us to look at and do something with you for both of you. So quickly, you know, the trust can capitalize itself through CPA funds so we can bankroll CPA funding. Right. You know it's, it's allowed through statute. And the CPA committee makes recommendations to counsel and then the council votes. So that's the process that takes a little bit.  You know, we, Dave and I had met with way finders a while ago knowing that they're, you know, they're going to move forward with their project and because this is so far out. But they could also apply for funding. And so, you know, it's a strategy, you know, maybe that the trust puts in a proposal. If way finders does to if there's a lot more, you know, I'm not saying that trust would reduce what they're asking but we could right so sometimes it's a matter of knowing how much money is available through CPA and how much the trust needs in a given year so, you know, CPAs become pretty competitive in the last few years so the last round I think there was twice as much funding or maybe three times as much funding requested as it was available. And it became a, you know, a question for the CPA committee and for every applicant. You know how much money do they really need and what you know how do you, how do you plan to use it so you know some of it is also being able to explain what the trust has done or is doing with the available CPA funding and so, about half a million dollars might sound like a lot but really it doesn't go a lot in terms of construction right it. I think the trust has used it wisely in terms of providing value CDC funding for Northampton Road. It's been used to help consultants to get other projects started and so, you know, I think the trust makes really good use of the funding. I'm just saying that you know it could be that there's products we're not anticipating other housing projects and it may it may be asked of the trust to reduce what we're what we're asking right just so other project other specific projects could be funded. I still think the trust to submit a proposal, but it may be that you know there's three other housing proposals for projects that are more imminent in terms of, you know, need or something. Who knows what will happen after after our foot is in the door by having a proposal to put out there. Ashley went to say something. I have no idea how much it costs but in having some money for land that we can make tiny houses in or creating livable land out of the Hickory Ridge there's 100 and something like 50 acres. Some of it could be a tiny house village or RVs or whatever people want to create, but they still need hookups for water and heat and whatnot. So, just land as a, you know, in addition to housing is my idea. Okay. There has to that definitely something that could. Well, let's worry about that when we try to write the proposal but thank you for the idea. So we are a little bit behind what time we thought we were going to be I think that this part of updates about the projects that are going on. It will be pretty quick because I don't think there's a lot to say 132 North Hampton Road East Gables is probably the slab has been poured at least it someone thought it was going to be when I talk when I talk to valley to Laura. It's been poured this week and I think that was last week so we've heard a little bit about belcher town road we're going to know a lot more about that and we on September on September 13. And I believe the things that we might, there might be something else to talk about. I will ask Nate, if he has anything else on strong street. Yeah, the I'm going to say john, there's two hands raised that we could jump to at some point. Yes strong street where it's been a slow process, you know there's a endangered species on the site and we've been working with natural heritage to determine how much of the property can be impacted. So we have a botanist, we have a contract drafted up and I'm working with a with a botanist and an engineer and the state to figure out how to move forward, and it's, you know it's not, you know it's a few thousand dollars, it's something that we just need to do. You know it's town property so you know we're assuming it's going to be housing, but these questions have to, you know at some point be answered because otherwise we won't really know what you know what development or anything could happen with the property so I'm hoping, you know in a few months time will have, you know, all those studies will be done and we can kind of determine how to move forward with strong street so you know the plan was still 10 to 15 units I don't, you know I'm not sure right now. The state is concerned about impact on the property so you have to be, I laugh because you know the, you know it is a big process to go through so we really have to go spend some time and have, you know a few surveys of the property and have a lot of field work done to see if we can develop it. You know on the face of it right now we really couldn't. Is that, I, it seems like last time you were waiting for a biologist I just wondered if anything has happened that's different than last time any. Yeah, yeah, yeah I've had a few conversations and emails and we've had discussions it's just it's the state's really concerned about impact to the species on the site, and so they really don't want any impact. And so, because of having these conversations about what does that mean and how you know. It's so ongoing there's no resolution but I hope to have it soon. Okay, well, since we have two hands out there. Maybe we will listen to our listen to what the two people their two hands up have to say since they raised them at this point or maybe even before this point. John, your hands first. So I think that must be an old hand up. Oh, okay. Sorry. Well, you don't have to talk it's okay. Then we have Kathleen, you're handed up. Yes, thank you. So I just wanted to mention that and remind us that while there is a lot of land at Hickory Ridge. Come spring. That most of that is a lake. Most of it is a lake. Much of it is a lake that overruns on to Pomeran Lane actually. So there's for building or housing. Most of it would be ineligible for that. Yeah, I think our understanding is that there's a small part of it that might be and it's in some kind of process that the town is looking at what to do with it. There's a small section on that butts Pomeran Lane, that is dry, and it stays dry, but most of that 100 and some acres becomes becomes a lake. It's not a small lake either it's a substantial lake. Yeah, thank you Kathleen. Does either Nate or Paul have any update on what is happening at Hickory Ridge or shall we just wait and is some other time going to be more useful to get information on that. Yeah, I mean the town, you know Dave Zomac and the planning department are still. And, you know, other staff are coming up with a plan for a public process there so that's something that's still happening and, you know, start by later, you know this fall. So, you know, I agree with Kathleen know there's, when you go when you look at it's really great so really nice site it's 150 acres and you are you know I think it's really impressive and then, and you realize that there's less than 10% of it could be developed for housing just because of the environmental aspect, and then you know there is going to be solar on it right so there's going to be two solar fields behind the river to the north and so then the town. You know, you know, there's some other areas that are a longer that need to be concerned but there's opportunity for some type of development or process that will happen this fall so you know as as it happens that you know the trust to be made aware of it. So the other couple of things we might have had updates on we are hope to have next time that's the. I think Laura or somebody from Valley CDC told us about the ball lane property last time. And we've invited already Jessica Allen who's the lead on that to be with us next time to give us an update on that I know that it's like going to be there looking to build 2040 units 20 duplex will be duplexes so buildings maybe with 40 home ownership opportunities. And the other thing we're hoping to hear about we're going to invite hopefully Dave to tell us about what's going on about the permanent shelter that the town is working on those two things we don't have updates this time but we hope to next time. Does anybody else have an update on something or other of a project that's going on that I should have listed and forgot or something or anything else. Some of the announcements I think we were going to talk just mentioned the house navigator of Massachusetts, and that I think really leads into some of Ashley's concerns about having a site where people can go and find affordable housing. They've just, this is a navigator site that just had over 100,000 users to find affordable housing affordable apartments. And so it's a one stop shopping where they can can literally see the listings all over. And they stated that they had 176 rentals across 2,604 properties and 275 messages its towns and cities. So we'll send out the links in the minutes so you can take a look at that doesn't resolve all of the concerns you have Ashley but I think this is a good. This is a good resource. And then the other thing in terms of announcements we we have one vacancy on the trust. So I think it'd be really great if all of us looked for somebody who would be great who could complement our skills and experience in our perspectives. And then we can ask them to apply and Paul I believe you are the appointing person for the positions. So those are the two things that I remember Carol. Let me just ask. Paul, if that's what is that what you are waiting for do you need some applications in order to begin a process to fill our missing position. I don't know how many applications we have I checked with Angela on that. So she's going to be setting up. We're doing our next raft of interviews. We're going to have a week after that. I just don't have any applicants we have if we have any. Okay, thank you. Nate what were you going to say. Yeah, I spoke with chapa this week that you know the citizen housing and planner association state level they're they're studying kind of the marketing of smaller you know affordable units and you know what the capacity of housing you know so I think they're looking at at that and that you I mentioned that we at one point the trust was looking at you know having a regional entity that could do marketing for developments that have you know one or two or three affordable units just because there is a cost associated with it so they're they've realized that and I think they're they're kind of you know they're studying it and maybe we'll come up with some type of plan so you know currently we have a few consultants that are in town that are working with developers that have affordable units to inclusionary zoning. And I think, you know, because they're in town I think they've already have a marketing plan and they know the demographics and so it's you know I think unfortunately for the first developer they paid for all this work and now all the the subsequent developers, hopefully get it at a lower cost because they're already in the area. But at one point, the trust that reached out to wayfinders or other organizations to see if they could become a regional marketing agent and help maintain affordable units you know waiting lists or other things and you know I just I just wanted to say that it's something that is, I think it's going okay right now but it's maybe something to keep on the back burner, just because you know kind of to Ashley's point, you know, if someone all of a sudden has to find an affordable unit it's like where where do they go, you know the housing navigators one, it's a website but then who's a person or an agency, and we refer them to various places but you know it'd be great if there was, you know some way to coordinate an application with all the affordable units and Amherst. And so anyways it seems like Chappell is also interested in that and looking into it so you know sometimes regionalization is better and sometimes you know maybe for affordable housing and this aspect it would be so I'm not sure where they're going with it but it's just you know they reached out with some questions and they said they're contacting communities and good to know they're working on it. Anything else. Erica. Any other announcements. Doesn't look like it so now we're going to open it up for any public comments that that anyone would like to make. And I'm not seeing any hands up from our participants in our attendees. Okay, so then we're going to move on to any, any items that we did not anticipate within 48 hours. All right. So, lastly, our upcoming meetings. So the next housing trust meeting is September 8 Thursday September 8 and we just mentioned two agenda items one ball lane. The other day was going to give us update in terms of the towns initiatives. And I think that is it and if they're as well as the forum we're also going to revisit the forum and hopefully have very concrete agenda and ideas and possibly even share with all of you the slide deck that we're going to present Carol and I going to present. And, and Carol is also going to have a proposal for the CPA ready for the eighth as well.  And if there are any other agenda items that you can think of please send them to Carol and myself. And I think that is it. And we have four minutes to spare for any comments. Feedback. Thank you, McCarthy has his hand up. I guess I just wanted to thank you again so much for inviting me tonight and for the opportunity to sit in I learned a ton and I just wanted to thank you. Thank you all for your efforts and in the same mission that we're on. Feel free to reach out to us anytime. If anybody would like a site tour I'd love to provide one and again thank you for supporting me the opportunity to share. Thanks for being here Tim. Okay. No other hands are up it seems. So I make a motion that we end the meeting. All right I see Paul and Carol and Allegra. All right the motion has been made. Any nays anyone wants to continue past nine o'clock. All right, I think we're done. Thank you Allegra for taking minutes. Thank you all for participating. It's been a great meeting and we will see you on the eighth. Great job. Cheers. Have a good night everybody.