All right. So before everyone comes in, I'm just going to give you a small introduction to what jQuery mobile is. So I might as well actually just show you the demo itself. I don't have the demo here. Well, I'm sorry. Actually, there's no internet connection, I think, is there? So what jQuery mobile essentially allows you to do is you can quickly build applications for mobile devices. Now, there are a lot of these frameworks promising these claims. And you might wonder, why not just start from scratch? Why not just go ahead and do it like how Facebook and LinkedIn and all these days do it, you know? We have the cool kids who have HTML5 mobile applications. The reason is that essentially this helps you get all this stuff done much faster. It keeps in mind the human interface guidelines of all these mobile device manufacturers. It takes all the quirks between different mobile devices into account. And it does a couple of other nearly neat things, like, for example, degradation, proper degradation, and stuff like that. So I guess I'll just get started. So my name is Anil Sanjeev. I'm currently working in a Bangalore startup, and I'm building a dashboard framework for web and mobile devices. So if you're, I mean, obviously, we're getting people in. I graduated from two IIT Kharagpur, and I've interned at Google and Microsoft Research. And this is essentially the application that we're going to be building. It's a simple phone book where all of the phone numbers and names have been stored inside. It's been stored inside some medium. So right now we're just going to be using a JavaScript object to store all the data. But later on you can store it somewhere else. You can open up one of the records and you can see a contact over here. You can see the phone numbers in a nice list manner. And you can even edit it. And you can update it and save it and this would reflect. So if you want, I can actually use the app and show it to you. So I have over here, I can add a new name over here. Let's just say Rahul. You can add an additional phone number and you save it. And it adds it over here. You can open it up and you can go back here and you can edit it. As you can see, I'm not sure about how the colors and the fonts look over here, but I can clearly tell you that it does look and feel really good on a mobile device. In fact, if you have a mobile device right now and if you're interested, you can open up static.skyronic.com slash js2 and you find a link to the slides and you can also find a link to the application that we're building. So I'm first going to warn you about what jQuery mobile is. You can build fantastic applications which are touch-friendly and you can do it with very little code. The amount of less code you need to write is actually surprisingly, it'll actually astound you. There are fantastic themes that come out of the box and the themes are built using CSS gradients. So I mean, so this means that you don't need images and you can also make some modifications which will reflect across the entire thing. And they're also building a theme roller like application for jQuery mobile. So you can actually just go and quickly use a form to reconfigure the entire thing. The applications degrade gracefully which means that even if you open it with a browser with less JavaScript support or if you open it with a lower JavaScript support, it was designed in such a way that as much as possible your user experience is as good as possible. And you can do it without any CSS or JS code. It's surprisingly easy, I'll actually show it to you. So I need to use very few images. There are a few caveats though. One of them, the first one is you need to write your app again from scratch. You cannot drop in jQuery mobile into your existing web-based application and magically get a touch-based framework. It just won't happen. You have to build everything from scratch and you need to do it keeping the jQuery mobile framework in mind. The second problem is that even though there are a lot of these list forms, buttons, and sliders, go back, check out jQuerymobile.com slash demo or something. And you can see that there are some fantastic forms which look and feel really well and there are different themes, different buttons with icons, they're all there. But leveraging these existing CSS classes, leveraging these functionalities is slightly difficult. Of course, there are some ridiculously ugly portions as well.  One of the things I do, it will actually mangle the entire DOM. The things that you write, you will give it one form of HTML and it will pick it up and it will completely mangle it. The reason, there are actually very good reasons why it needs to do this in order to give the kind of functionality but what this means is a lot of code that you expect to work will not work. You take a div and then you try to find its parent. It might be one, another list item might be a parent in your regular code but when you actually execute it, something else might be the parent and you won't even know what happens. So usually debugging these kind of programs is slightly more complicated. Another problem is dynamically creating the UI is complex and dynamically modifying the UI is even more complex than that. So here's the first thing I'm gonna show you. It's a relatively simple, it's just a relatively simple piece without any CSS or JavaScript. I have a div over here, never mind what the data role is but so when you have a data role inside a DOM attribute, it is essentially a system that, it's essentially an attribute which tells the query mobile how to treat your thing and how to decorate it and you specify here's a data role which says page, here's a data role which says header, here's a data role which says content and here I have a link over here to hash page two and over here I have an ID called page two with the header content and something over here as well and when I load it up inside a browser, so over here it just says I am page one, this is page two, can everyone see this? So when I click on this, it gives me a nice neat little transition. So over here and if I press the back button, I actually can see that the transition happens again. The more interesting portion is that the moment I click on this, page two, can you see this fragment over here? It's set in a way such that if I copy this, paste it and open a new one and say page two, it opens page two by default. This means that the moment the page loads, it actually looks at the fragment over here or what is known as inside jQuery mobile, the hash and then it makes its decision upon that and it displays it. So there's another even neater thing that happens over here where I'm gonna show you two pages. There's one neat one.html over here and there is neat two.html. Neat one.html links to neat two.html, neat two.html links to neat one.html. Let me just open it up and I will open up this. So it just says I am page one, this is page two. I click on it, it works fine. It's exactly, you know it works exactly as you're expecting to work. Even if I right click and say, even if you press and tap and hold on it and you say open a new tab, it opens up everything works the same. But what very interesting happens is let me open up the inspector. Okay, I don't think certain portions you can see over here, hold on one second. Let me just, yeah, can everyone see the, all right. So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna load page one. So over here, you see that this works fine. But when I click on the page one link, it actually does not load anything else at all. What actually happens is that it opens up the link in an XML HTTP request. It picks up the DOM, it looks at the first div data role equal to page, picks that up and then adds it and does the transition. And this works seamlessly. And if you actually look at it, the URL stays correct. It actually leverages what is known in the HTML5 world as push state, where you can actually change the URL without actually changing the page. So it's pretty neat stuff, but we'll be doing some stuff similar to it when, so the data role attribute is essentially telling jQuery mobile what functionality to add. So you show this during the time of page load and it goes and it instruments it with certain kind of functionality. It can be a button, it can be a footer. There are plenty of them and these are very well documented on the website. And similarly, there are a lot of these other data hash something else, like for example, you've got icons. So I can have a button and I can specify the icon of that. I can specify the position of the footer and these are all done using the data attributes as well. There are a couple of key concepts to remember. First thing is that the data thing has to be available on page load. I will tell you that this is the default behavior, but it can also be circumvented. You can do it and you can build it in a way such that it's done after the page load and it will modify the DOM so your old code will not expect it. So I'll show you. For example, here's a button. Here's a button with just a href equal to button, data role is button, icon is delete and this is what it looks like. But after jQuery mobile goes and what is known as decorates or instruments or adds functionality to this device, it comes in and it becomes so much larger. And the main reason is that it goes around, as I said, you have an A and you've got a lot of these spans over here. So even if you say A dot text, if you say, so for example, if I had A and I had an ID of some button, my button and I say dollar hash my button dot text equal to something else, you expect that the delete will get changed. But what actually happens is that all of these inner items over here will go and get modified. So this is what I mean by saying that you cannot expect your old code to blindly work. Another, for example, is a checkbox. A checkbox, which is so reasonably simple. You just have a field set, you specify a data role as a field set and input and a label and it becomes this big. I mean literally the code explodes and I can show it to you in the inspector but I mean that will be really small but you can make out that the amount of code that it inserts and these are all with good reason by leveraging CSS classes, they're making sure that after one download of jQuery mobile CSS, you're more able to load better every time. So here's a core page. You have a data role as a page, a header, a content and a footer. You can have any number of pages inside your application and you can probably sit between pages but only one page can be displayed at a time. So a page is pretty much the atomic level of display as far as jQuery mobile is concerned. So here's what we're gonna start doing. We're gonna build a simple phone book application. So in your index.html, there's nothing special. You need to specify this meta name of a viewport that is available and it's done in every example that's there inside jQuery mobile. You need to specify, you need to just give it a CSS, the jQuery mobile JavaScript and the jQuery minified JavaScript as well and any custom JavaScript you wanna execute. So we're gonna do something known as custom routes. So while regular routes of jQuery which is loading the page, it works fine. We're actually gonna be trying to do a lot of things very dynamically. Of course, it's perfectly possible to have a PHP script, pick up phone books from a database and render it in such a way that you don't even need to do anything. But what we're gonna be doing is actually gonna be looking for fragments and we're actually going to intercept when jQuery comes in and we're gonna tell it which page to load. So this way you'll actually have the app being dynamic and yet it'll be pretty bookmarkable. But we also need to override the default behavior but it'll be slightly complicated so we'll get started doing it. So here's the conditions that we have. When the URL is hash contact two, we show the contact page of entry number two. When URL is hash edit of two, entry number two can edit page. And then when URL is hash add contact, you show the new contact page otherwise the home page, simple enough. So the first thing we do is we bind to an event called before page change. Now the before page change event is fired before the page gets loaded. So whether it's the first time or any kind of page change that happens, this event is loaded. What we do is we check that the type of the data.2 page is a string. If it is a string that means it's a URL and we have to intercept it. If it's not a string, it's probably some kind of an internal state transition happening inside the application. If it's not a string, we just say return and the default behavior takes place. We pick up the hash part which is dollar.mobile and we pass the URL. We pick up the hash and we split it by hyphen. Now we assume an index of minus one and we take the index. So ultimately there's a relatively straightforward code. The code is available. But ultimately the important thing is if the first hash part is contact, we show the first contact, show the contact page and pass the index to it. If it's edit, we call a function called show edit page. If it is add contact, we call a function called show add page. This is all inside and then at the end, we say ev.preventDefault. This is very important because if we don't call this, then it would do all of our code and then it would go back and go to the previous behavior which is going to be opening up the homepage or whatever it is. So the custom routes, you've got an app object to be here. You show the contact page, edit page and add page. These are just three empty functions that we'll be adding some stuff. Now we also add a phone book over here. The phone book is nothing but a small key value store, a name and an array of phone numbers relatively straightforward. So I'll just move ahead. We are going to build the homepage right now. So to build the homepage, this is HTML that we're going to have. And I want you to focus on a few key items over here. So the first thing over here, we have the header with a button called add contact over here. The data rollers button and we have an icon over here. This is what it's going to do. We have a small header one called phone book which comes in and comes in over here. And over here, we have this item called data roll list view. So if you take a UL or that an unordered list and then you add some list items and you give it a data roll list view, so it gives you a nice touch friendly list if it's an icon of whether it's a bunch of icons. So what we do is we actually do something called, we actually hook onto a page, they are like dollar home page and we say page init. So we hook onto the page init event which is fired before the page is initialized. So what we actually are going to do is we're going to tell jQuery mobile, okay, when the page is being decorated, when it actually goes in, looks at the DOM, scans the DOM and says, okay, fine, here are all the data rolls. I'm going to go instrument them in this kind of format. Before this happens, you probably want to do all of these things. So that is what we're going to do. And we're going to call this function called refresh phone book inside the app object. The refresh phone book first it does is that it initializes the page if it not already initialized. There are a couple of cases that this might be possible, but by dollar home page dot page, it is, that's the way it works. If you work with jQuery UI, you'll find something like this very familiar. You'll find dollar hash something dot button. And that's very straight forward because it actually uses the jQuery UI widget system underneath all of the code. And I have this thing called contact list over here. In fact, this code I've sort of given you separately. Contact list, it goes and it empties all the items inside. And it runs through the phone book and it opens nothing but list items. It opens, it runs through all of the parts of the phone book and it opens the list item along with the name. And it calls this function. This is very important. So now if you don't call this, all it does is that it shows you a regular HTML list which is nothing but three links over there. And it looks really out of place. The only way you can tell jQuery mobile, jQuery mobile already thinks that, okay, fine. I went to this list view DOM, I decorated, I didn't find anything over there. I went out. But you need to actually tell it, okay, go back over there and refresh it. The way you force it is, again, this is one thing which I found, which wasn't very well documented, but you say list view and you pass this string refresh. And once you do that, it actually goes and refreshes the entire list view. So this is how the DOM looks before refresh runs. And if you want, you can see how the DOM looks after the refresh runs. So if you see over here, I don't know, but ultimately this is the UL that you have over here. And you've got li div div a. So ultimately it goes and it modifies and adds a lot of classes over here. And these are the things that make it look the way it should look. Now, next thing we're gonna do is we're gonna build a contact page. For the contact page, if you remember, now we're just gonna show you the small contact page over here. We're gonna have a small thing called hash home page. And we're gonna basically create a link, a button that goes back to the home page. Now, the funny thing is that if you add this button and the default transition is it slides. It slides as of going to the next page. Now, obviously this looks very unintuitive because if you press the back button, it actually should go in the opposite direction. So you say data transition is slide and the direction of the animation is gonna be reversed. So again, you're specifying all of this inside the DOM itself instead of having to go and using some kind of a jQuery dictionary to configure all of this stuff. And you also have an edit button which we will be adding some functionality to later on. And we have some content which is a phone, again, with an empty list view inside it. Now, first thing we're gonna do is we're going to initialize the contact page. This is because since we're calling this function right after trapping this, like, ultimately in the page loads, it calls and it says, okay, here is the URL fragment. And we took the URL fragment, we saw, okay, the contact page is the one that we need to call. So before we actually modify the contact page, we need to make sure that jQuery mobile has initialized the contact page. So we do that by saying dollarcontactpage.page. If you do this 10 times, it does not matter because the first time you do it, it does everything. And the next time you do it, it does not make any difference. So first thing you do, you pick up the item from the index of the phone book and you take the name label, set the text, you take the phone list, empty it and append nothing but list items over here. So this is essentially a list which is a static list and you run the phone list, dollarphonelist.listview and you say refresh again. And as for the edit button, you just set the href, the URL as hashedit-something, which will be handled by the edit page. So that's it. And if you see it, and if I go over here and if I look at the edit, I don't know if you see it over here, but it says hashedit-zero. So that is essentially what is gonna happen. So yeah, the problem with that is it allows you to, like ultimately nobody is stopping you from actually going to the dorm and making the modifications. But to actually do that, you need to be able to maintain the consistency in all the classes and stuff like that. So for that, that it does not, it's not that it doesn't allow you the freedom to do it. You have the freedom to do whatever you want. But because you're playing by its rules, because the way it makes its modifications is like this. So in order for it to support buttons, icons and buttons, field sets and all of these things, these are certain decisions that the developers of jQuery mobile have made such that these kind of things are possible. So for the colors, see, the main thing is I'll actually be going and explaining how we're gonna dynamically update the thing. So the main thing over here is when you're dynamically changing the thing, you can modify the CSS. Ultimately, it's just a webpage. So you can pretty much do anything you want. But the moment you're actually going and you're breaking your head over their code, then you find that it's difficult. So if you stick to this, like for example, if you have a regular website, you just have a regular website, you just want, you know, it's just not about me and all of these some five, six different links. And you just want to show a mobile version of the same site. Then this is fantastic. Just put a bunch of link items over here, set the data role at this, no CSS, no Java script, and suddenly you have a lovely touch friendly website. So that is where this really shines. But on the other hand, like a small site deviation, if you're actually familiar with Centra Touch. So Centra Touch is a framework developed by the EXTJS guys, the Centra guys. So they actually go on a completely different approach. What they say is that everything has to be done programmatically. You go and then you specify a list view item and then you do all of this similar to how you do it in GTK or something like that. And that works for some people. This works for some people. So this one is the one that we've chosen for our development right now. And so this is why I'm telling you. So, sorry? So JQ Touch is also another, see there are three main things, jQuery, mobile, JQ Touch, and this. So JQ Touch, as far as I know, was started by Centra Labs. I mean, I think it's still part of Centra Labs. So as far as I've heard, it's very heavy on images. It's surprisingly good on iPhones because it uses the WebKit transitions and things like that. But on Android, it doesn't work as effectively. And it's not very well maintained and not very actively maintained and not that much. The amount of code generated is primarily like this because if you look at the CSS, actually I'm trying to contribute patches to jQuery mobile. I've actually contributed four or five pull requests so far. And I've had to break my head over their classes. But the more I actually saw it, I saw that actually it makes sense. You see, there are actually pretty smart people who've been going around, who've been designing this. I mean, John Rezegh and a lot of these other people, I mean none of the names come to mind right now, but a lot of really smart people have actually thought about this and said, okay, probably this is the best way of going forward. So you're not limited by choice, but yes, this definitely has this drawback. As I said, that's the first thing I mentioned if you remember, it does modify your DOM. So your old code won't work. But as long as you keep that in mind, if you keep that in mind while you're building your applications, then you're gonna have a much easier time. So yeah, it's actually like if I can get an internet connection, I'll actually show a small demo of the real full stack of jQuery mobile. So probably you can get more interested. So this is actually a very important portion that I need to tell you about. So when you say, when to change the page from one page to another, you can change the page to anything. You can change the page to a particular URL. You can change the page to three, four other different things, you know, if it can be an external URL, internal URL, all of that stuff. But over here, if you change the page to hash contact page, what will happen is that the URL fragment on the top, the URL fragment will say hash contact page because it's trying to use intelligently, use that kind of fragment setting push state over here. So to override that, we actually say options.data URL equal to contact plus index. And by doing this, you effectively prevent this kind of thing from happening. So I'll just quickly run you through the edit page before. So the edit page is all again very straightforward. You have a button over here, which just says data URL back. We'll just push you to the previous page and it's a cancel button. There's an edit and there's a save button. And some part of the content which I've clipped out is over here. You've got a label which is known as name, sorry, which is an input which is known as name, and a phone over here. So the phone number, I wanted to pay a little attention to the list over here. I have one list ID over here, which is called add phone button container. And I'm gonna be listening to events on add phone button container and not on the button itself. And I'll actually be going into details about why I'm doing that. But ultimately what you need to know is that there's a list ID with this and there is a button called add phone number. So one more thing, one small side note is that if you wanna add a new contact, I'm gonna be reusing the edit page, but instead I'll be passing minus one as the index. So I for show add page, all I'm just gonna do is I'm gonna say show edit page and pass minus one as the thing. So first thing again, decorate the basic elements by saying hash edit page dot page and assume that the request is for adding a new item. That means I create a blank item and if index is not minus one, I just pick it up from the phone book. So this way it works seamlessly, like regardless of whether you're actually trying to edit it or create a new one. And it sets the name input text box. So all you're doing is say hash name entry and you're setting the value as this. This is all very straightforward. So now comes probably one of the most important regions over here. How do you dynamically update the UI? So the page is already shown, like if I show you over here, now if I go to the add and over here if I see, I can add any number of phone numbers. So this is what I found is one of the trickiest part of jQuery mobile when I was starting to learn it is how do you modify the UI? If I just go and if I just append the list item over there, it does not work. And if I have a relatively more complex thing like an input and things like that, that absolutely didn't work. So what I do over here is I have a function called create phone field, which I'll define later and it accepts a phone number, which is a value. Yeah. Sorry. So how do I know, like how do, so obviously when I'm clicking, when I'm dynamically adding something, so that doesn't happen, that's an event app that gets triggered only after the user is touched, right? So yeah, we'll get back to this. So there are other, see the thing is that there are other, there are more than ways of doing it. So what I'm showing you is just one of the ways. So what I do first is that I remove all of the, I go pick up phone, edit list and I run a small jQuery selector and I say li as long as it's not last removed because the thing is that the page state does not change. So for example, if I add three items over here, I click save and I edit another phone number. These div elements are still in place. So what I need to do is I need to clean up, to clean up, I need to remove it. So this is one more gotcha that you need to remember as far as working with this. So like if you load a new page, if you load a new link or something, you assume that the entire DOM has been refreshed to its original pristine state, but that's not the case over here. So again, we go to each of the phone numbers existing already and you say create phone field with this particular thing and you go to the add phone button container, you unbind it because it would have been bound previously. Again, it was, it's not in a pristine state. It's in the same state it was last time. So if you have a click handler, have another click handler and the next time you open the page, you're gonna end up having with two events being fired.  So as far as create phone field is concerned, you create an ID phone hyphen and with some temporary random variable over here and you again, you pick up a list item over here, a label and an input. It's relatively straightforward. So over here you say add phone button container dot before phone field and this is again straightforward, but most importantly over here, you need to again refresh the list view. You need to refresh the list view and you need to save phone field. Phone field is basically the, this is phone field over here. So when you create this, this is what is gonna be created by the previous pieces of code. It says label for phone three is phone number, input type is text, ID is phone three, value is this and you save phone field dot find input dot text input because jQuery mobile does not know that you've created a new DOM element. So what you need to do is you need to find the input DOM item over there, the jQuery selector and then you need to run text input on that which will actually go and apply all of the CSS classes such that it looks nice over there. If you don't do that, it will look like a regular WebKit text entry box on the water here. So if you actually see, so now there's one important thing which I'm going to show you is like again if, why did I actually hook on to add phone button container? But like before what I had done when I was starting out with jQuery mobile, what I did is I actually listened for an event on this A and I had this thing called add phone button and what I did was I thought I had to add an item before this ally over here. So what did I do? I said when this event is fired, dollar this which would refer to my current item dot parent dot before and that made perfect sense because my HTML that I outputted is like that but if you actually see the code, if you actually see it inside the inspector, this is my A. So dollar parent actually is a div. So what I need to say is dollar dot parent dot parent dot parent dot before, which becomes much more unintuitive. That is why I say it's in fact it's best if you can just refer to absolute IDs everywhere as much as possible instead of trying to do parent or trying to use relative DOM items over there. So back to the yeah. Oh clone a DOM element. So it should be possible, but I'm also like I thought of using clone initially but that would have been a very straightforward solution. Why I'm trying to do it this way is that so that people understand how to use, how to redecorate the item but it should be possible perfectly possible to clone. In fact sometimes it's actually an easier thing to do more than this. But then again the problem with clone is that I don't know if the bear of clone but does it even clone any event listeners that have been put inside the DOM because then it might not probably not be a, okay again it should be possible. So for the save button what we do is we unbind again because it would have been bound in the previous time you had opened the edit page and on the click use pass the index the self because of JavaScript self and this nonsense and you call this dot save item. You again use the options dot data URL, set edit and pass what other particular index over there and you change the page. So again it's extremely straightforward over here at least it seems straightforward for me if you have some problem probably I should come back and explain it to you. And saving the phone book is again very straightforward.  So in the item again there's all regular jQuery selectors you say name entry the attribute and for phone I just need an array of all of the values inside this. So what I do is I say phone edit list dot find input and I run a map over this and I just return the attribute value for each of the items that selected that master selector. It seems a little complicated but it's the simplest way of finding all of the values of the phone book inside the particular thing and returning it. So and again you save it you push it to the phone book if index is minus one which means it's a new addition to the thing or you save it to the phone book by using self dot phone book. You again call the refresh phone book by using refresh phone book what it'll do if you remember is that it actually goes it raises all of the old it raises all of the old list items inside the original DOM and then it modifies the page and you change the page back to homepage and then you're done. So anyway if you have any questions about this you can email me my email is chironic at gmail.com and that's pretty much it. I mean I probably got done soon enough. So no questions? So the event was brought to your time at the second start and what did you like about the event? Any aspect? No, what did you like? I liked it. The website? Sorry? No, the meeting was brought to you. Okay, the meeting is for the talks. And what was the program set? What was the program set? What was the monitor talk? What was the monitor talk? The speakers were on. Like, should you do your meeting very late, right? But I love the meeting. Okay, come here like that sir. Save the opportunity. The tables and all of these things. Yeah, but when you're working back in terms of space it's not so fast. I think it's like, I don't know what you mean by that. Ah, that is not important. They don't start meeting at this time. Yeah sir, I think it should be. I think it should be. I think it should be. Here's the numbers. So I think there should be audio tables. Some of the speakers are texting you. Same for the projector. Some fixes. Outside. The lighting. There was too much light. No? Is this in the back? There is some one part of the room that I rather go to. Some light and you want to see this light?  So that's the question sir, should you do talk of the same person or something? Okay, I want the next question. What it is about the technical aspects of the talks, whether it is to advance or whether it is too much of a beginner's talk, what do you think? But where is it fine enough for technical talk to keep us happy and not make it talk to keep you happy? So, do you know that both here, these talks are expected to advance? Yeah, I think I've got three years. So, I mean, in the case of the people walking around, do you want to go there? I don't know if it's enough. Okay, I agree with that. So, I want to ask the listeners to come here, you know. This is something like one year we can't be here. One year we can't be here. We actually went to the Luzberg party, so that was all about the technical aspects of the talks. Ah, I think we can right now like do it like all year. But, I think today is today morning. So, I think for people it's normal. I think that's the only one that's lying there. We cannot show what solutions are coming. So, the solutions are going to take a time. And also, one of the things I saw, some of the speakers didn't seem to know the exact profile of the audience around them. That can be communicated with clients or speakers. They have a sense of the level of people they're talking to. And based on that, they can customize that. Yeah. All less. That's an expression. What is that? I'm sorry. Okay, I just want to make a question now. What do you need to find out? Please come. What is the profile of the audience and the speakers? The problem is I have something to say about the soup thing. So, you kind of still have to make these assumptions. You need to start these. I guess the assumptions that I need to start from the very basics. Otherwise, the context has lost. And will there be enough profile data about the audience that let me plan something? So, where do I have a solution? I must admit. I stated the problem in my question. So, is it possible to find a solution for the speakers around them? Yes. I think a solution. So, that is a problem that's like that which addresses the basic problem. This is the introduction. You can put it up. No, you can put it up by yourself. No, you can put it up by yourself. That's a bad idea. This one is a good idea. But we have seen that Australia is our place. We have noticed which top they are greater than. And we have seen that because of the condition that they came over here. I have a suggestion about the video process. There are a lot of questions that we ask a little, which is fine. I guess, but then that's what I'm going to make the video look like. The questions are unheard. Obviously, speakers are anticipating the video process. So, they are completing the questions. So, I think one of the most interesting things needs to change. There is this answer. Give me the mic to the audience. I'll record the questions. This is the rule. I'm going to give you an idea. Actually, I'm not correct. But they won't be able to record it. They won't be able to record it. So, I'm going to ask you a question, please. I don't need your help. I think I was saying. That's about it. I'm going to ask you a question. The video though is quite absurd about that. See, I'm going to give you a question. Please. We have J.Q. on us. Actually, I'm going to ask you a question. It's like my suggestion. I was not at it. There are quite a few speakers in the room. What are the speakers in the room? It's just out of the blue one. The other thing I want to look quite tired. What topics would you like to see covered next time? Okay. Next. Yes, please. I was thinking about, you know, any contest. Any contest. Is there any other contest? The only thing that I saw here is that more than a very good introduction to the dynamics of that, that we can now take away from it another entry for my book, which I'm going to put in half an hour, three hours, and then we'll take it back to the side. See.  The only thing I want to say is in addition, let's say you have two more spaces. Thank you, but it's open to do that. That would be, yeah. But what happened today, yeah. But what happened today was like after three or four things to attend, they would rather end up talking amongst themselves. Then keep on attending more and more. Yeah, that's good. And I think one of the things, you know, just connecting a panel, like somebody takes a little bit of power, but you know, I think this is an exploration of things. If that's the reason, you know, we're going to be able to get back to the panel in the conference. And then don't see the barcats. So it's going to be, okay, we're going to start off with the magnet that we had a week ago. Okay, so we had a magnet a week ago. So that was meant to be this kind of thing. It's going to be straightforward. All you do is sit here and talk to the magnet. Okay. So either we love it or we don't love it. It's that thing now. So how do you do it? You have to attend the magnet because it's attached to the next year. That's what we need. So maybe the next one is an offer. That's what I'm talking about. So that's what happened last week. I couldn't attend because it was not close enough to the event itself. For people who are coming from outside of Chitano. That's right. If you can put up tents here and how does that work? If you want this biggest night, the next day you're supposed to sleep here. That's what you're talking about. Next one. So thank you to us. We can also participate remotely. We can elaborate on INS. A lot of us are doing that. We're all INS. We're discussing things now. I'll share a couple of things. We're not so much like 52 hours. Is that possible? We have PC movement to look up on. We have mobile. We have mobile. Mobile. We have mobile. We have mobile. We have mobile. We have mobile. We have mobile. We have mobile. We have mobile. We're going to repeat that question. We'll answer a couple of things. What's the topics we'd like to see? In terms of maybe JavaScript and maybe other sessions? I think we should have a... ...mode. ...mode. ...mode. ...mode. Jareon languages. Jareon languages. ...mode. So data mining is the code? Data mining and machine learning. Data mining is the code? We prepared. We prepared. We prepared. Somebody else is doing their part. I am. I'm going to have a look. Okay. Okay. Okay. I'm going to have a look. I'm going to have a look. Okay. Okay. We have two events coming up. One is the J.S.M.O. that is happening in Pune in December. We are repeating J.S.M.O. to Pune and H&M. It is a Pune-S.M.O. that is the verdict. We are hoping that by the third it will be more or less used up for an accident. We are repeating J.S.M.O. Some of them, you see, made a pretty cool J.S.M.O. It is going to be the same for the subject of the speakers. Sponsors, some of them are repeating, some of them are not. Pune is most likely in December 10. We still tried to find this review. And for those of you who came all the way from Pune about it, it is going to be closer and we are going to do some more J.S.M.O. And the same for Chennai as well. And there is a drawing that is happening in the member. So drawing 1 is a 2-day event. This is a launched collaboration. We are working with drawing 1 in Europe. It is the world's largest series of drawing events. So we are going to hopefully get a whole bunch of guys coming into Europe giving us a lot more recommendations on that. I also just want to mention this J.S.M.O. Javascript user group that is going to be set up. So the thing is, finally Javascript is picking up everywhere. So we are going to go to KDV, my window way. It has become important. We don't have enough people who understand it. I mean there are a few of us. What we are trying to set up is a local user group. Like we are going to try to use the group. There was Javascript user group. We are trying to run the first. We will be involving a couple of us. Just discussing what is the latest stuff. If you don't understand the basics, come join us. We will explain those stuff to you. There was a talk where somebody mentioned promises and I think a lot of people didn't understand what those things were. So stuff like that becomes quite basic in a couple of years. That will be part of the whole Javascript. There is a thing called ES5. There is a thing called ES6. ES6. There is a whole lot to discuss. So we are setting up a user group to discuss all of that. We are interested in sending out a mail. We send out a mail. Please respond back on that. We will probably put up a cap on how many people we can afford to have a mail. So that might be the case. Because I think we can take over 30 people in the space at the end of the talk. And we can have an axe party. And we will probably have a talk. All of us will be connected with one someone. So please respond if you are interested. If you want to topic, I would like to suggest something different with hardware. Integrated hardware. If you are doing a stuff, any of the fun things to do with some other stuff, you can just sit on it and do something with it. Any of the other events that we will be talking about, because they are happening at the end of the talk, it is not a good talk as much as it is supposed to be. You have to talk. But I do not think that the standard of the implementation of the hardware will be always so abstract and out of the phase. Most of us don't even know how to connect with a serial model. It is true. That is a great idea. Passing the generation what is a serial model. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That is an example of that. This is port open. So I think that is a great idea. A lot of people are not very familiar with it. Yeah. That is a good idea. Yeah. So, the proper is to do some good training. So, I am planning to do a public thing. Or a big kids training. Maybe in October or early November. I decided to do it based on. So, it is going to be a bit of a basis for the most of the stuff. More on the advanced side. So, if you, any of you are interested, or you see it regularly at work, just tell me if you are interested in it. I am also going to do it. So, I think that event is going to happen soon.


And to the rest side. Pull the sword. One. Not too close. First look where you go. Make yourself long. Yeah, that's okay. And pull the sword. This is incredibly tough for the quad. It's like one, two. You did something right. Bring your body. You twist your spine. Twist your spine and watch what you're doing. And next move. And look back. Yeah, actually, actually when I was young and I was learning this form from my master, I was practicing this kind of, we call this traditional Shaolin Lohan movements. And I was very, very satisfied because for myself, I don't want to do the common Shaolin movements like you can see in other Shaolin temples and all these kind of jumping and fast movements. When I was learning this kind of traditional moves, I was exactly like in the feeling, yes. Thank you very much. Exactly what I need. I love this. And this was actually, my goal was to train some original pure Shaolin material and only for the 18 movements of this Lohan Gong exercise. It was giving me already a lot of, not only emotional happiness, it was also giving me other techniques. You look, for example, if you're a normally person, for example, you make different moves like nobody do.  It's a cultivation for your body. This is the one thing. The other thing is it actually, it can fit to any purpose in your life. If you like only do the Tai Chi moves, you can move in this pattern. It's good. Have fun. If you're a hardcore martial artist, you also feel, well, yes, I have the power.  This is the benefit. And it gives you totally, when you practice these movements, it gives you totally different mindset. And sometimes as normally people, we will face different obstacles in life, maybe for business or maybe for our school or teachers, whatever. We have confrontations in our daily life struggle. It gives a totally different approach to obstacles in life because you have already built up with this warrior, we call this warrior, set a warrior spirit and mind. And this will help. And it's also fun. You don't move like everybody moves. This is also one of my idea. I think this is it. There's a feeling with this movement. There can't be certain like, show me, do some. And this is only one movement of 18. The other they will follow.  You're here again. You adjust yourself. You see, you have here again the triangle move. And it will also help you to build the power here. And if you, you can say you have here the triangle move. Okay. But here actually you have a different and it will looks like a polygon. Yes. And when you absorb, look here is the chest, the straight. Then we have here the distance from the shoulder to the elbow and from the elbow to the fist. And if you close that, this is a polygon. And this actually is in that move also inside. Yeah. And this, this structure is universal. Yes. Okay. Yes. But he's holding the camera.   Yeah. And this is only some, I don't know what to say. By contracting the muscles, the muscles will tell you stop by themselves. Yeah, that's true. Like, yeah. Okay. And next move. No, you block. No, no, no, you can't go if you don't look. Yeah. Okay, here you go. That's a block and the hit. Okay. You're here. And look at this. And you're here. It's powerful. There's chest. Chest. Yeah. And the Latissimus dosi need to be hard. Hard. Yeah. I think you did something with your arms. And this is the Sibar Lohan Gong. Sibar. Sibar means 18. Lohan is our heart and Gong is the work out. Yeah. Okay. And Lohan Chi Gong actually. Sibar Lohan Chi Gong. Yeah. And this is without this, this small golden bell is ineffective. Yeah. Then if you only practices, you learn only Chi Gong. But you don't have the pondering and hammering. Okay. But if you only practice the pondering and hammering and you don't have the Chi Gong, then the also it's not complete. But you can separate this. You can practice only the Chi Gong. You don't need to hammer your body. Yeah. It makes it feel like. Okay. But if you add to hammer the body, then it becomes a small golden bell. Yeah. This is also very important. Because everyone's purpose is different.


I guess I'm a bit unsure about how you use the term trade-off rather than costs and benefits for a decision or the... Do you mind if I can try it? Can we be a customer for the decision of a project or organization to conduct a certain or it could be in terms of actual physical landscape itself. So for us to be able to try it. How do you find the trade-off in this? We have purposely left it open and the reason is, I mean, you know, one of the things that we realized early on in this process, and again, this is, you know, I don't want to, like, air dirty laundry and too much, but, you know, part of the dysfunctionality of all of it, one of the things we realized is that different perspectives not only see the case study from their perspective, but they also see the other perspectives from their perspective. Do you know what I'm saying? So we have, for instance, at our Tanzania workshop, there was a guy there and he said, oh, you just talked about opportunity costs. Here, in the conversation, he said, no. Different, you know, someone who works in, you know, sort of a more process mode, whatever their discipline or field of practice wouldn't necessarily think in terms of costs and benefits and would think in terms of fairness and equity. That's a very different way of thinking about a trade-off than thinking about, you know, who wins, who loses, and so forth. Likewise, you know, someone who sort of views things from a power perspective would say, you know, the trade-offs are being made, I don't know, trade-offs are being made through the kind of insidious process of redefining the forests. So the thing is, and this was really my initial, as I mentioned, my initial resistance to the idea of trade-offs because it does, it can be read from a somewhat narrow perspective. But what you have to realize is that lots of different fields use the idea of trade-offs and they use it in very sometimes explicit ways or very sort of formal methods attached to it but also in very informal ways or very implicit ways or through various benefits. Like whenever you talk about choice or decision, you really, in many contexts, talking about a trade-off and that may not be captured by an analysis that tells you to think about the cost and just the cost of that kind of challenge. Just a small addition on that, back to your language, where we've had many discussions on what is the appropriate Basin-Initia term for trade-off. I think the term we came up with is actually interesting, not in your valuation box, but it is in the process and the power and reverse to verbs. One is static, which is pudding, and one is tawar, which means negotiate. Tawar is, if you can say it back to English, becomes tug-of-war. But I think that's also back in translation. That's an easy term for a trade-off is actually translated back to an easy tug-of-war. Different things, negotiating and pudding. Yeah, that's great. If you've discussed all the analysis of the valuation process and power in terms of the gas that might appear, then what do you do with that information? That's why I was being very forthright in saying so-then-what. And we really are in the process of the so-then-what. So we want to be able to say something more than, well, this identifies these research gaps. I mean, that's an important thing to be able to say as a result of an analysis like this. But I also think one of the things that we've become very aware of, and perhaps we've developed this in kind of a testing into these workshops, is that there are particular, you know, every country has a different political culture, different institutional framework for doing things, different ideas about centralization, which is rights or various kinds of things. And, you know, again, in a sort of pluralism, one size doesn't fit all. And I think we've particularly become aware of this in Vietnam where there is a process that could occur in Vietnam involving this kind of analysis that would lead in a very different direction than if you were to do a political test in Indonesia or whatever. And so that's something that we're, I think, we're not struggling with yet, but we identify it as something that we need to address. You had a question? Can we see the former slide in terms of answering the first question? I just wanted to see, and it looked like, through plans, that it was the good players. And I would imagine that during your case, that you're likely to consult with some of the international level buyers, and maybe it's the social... I'm just wondering if that's really consultation. Yes. This, what I'm trying to do with this external consultation, I mean, I'm sort of approaching this in two sort of... And this is really about CICI, not ACS, right? This is... I'm coming at this as an anthropologist who's acutely aware of the deep distrust of anthropologists and academics in general by conservation practitioners. And I'm also coming at this from the perspective that in my field, we've talked about collaboration a lot, okay? But we've all, and I think we've covered a great, you know, we've covered a lot of distance, but it's always in the context of how do we collaborate with those local communities where we work. What we have in address is what does collaboration mean when you're working with, you know, CICI and TSE and WWF and so forth, where you come up against issues of complicity, academic integrity and so forth. It can be a very difficult thing. And that's what I'm trying to do is envision a process where we can do research in conjunction with these organizations, build partnerships in a way that's truly plywood, but that also addresses those academic concerns because we can't decide whether we're going to evolve, and so forth. The other side of it is that process. And this is one of the things that I've been doing here. If we were to, let's say, undertake something related to part of Borneo or Crow Triangle, you know, I wouldn't just be visiting TNCCI and WWF. But obviously, you know, scoping out who all the local NGOs are, who speaks for local communities and all of that. But this is really for the process of, this is for the process of CICR strategic planning. And for instance, what I present to Central Funders, to my university, to the Vice President for Research and all of that. But the other part is really cute. You haven't listed donors on that. You mentioned donors in terms of influencing the conservation. Yeah, I haven't. This is, again, this is CICR. This is not ACSC. So, you know, donors are definitely someone that we want to be speaking to. Right now, you know, kind of holding on from that to putting the ACSC process around the woods there. Thank you very much.


Russia uses Kinzel missile for the first time in Su-34 fighter. Russia's Su-34 multi-purpose fighter bomber used the Kinzel hypersonic missile in the course of the military operation in Ukraine, a defence official told TASS. The Su-34 fighter jet used the Kinzel hypersonic missile in the special military operation. The first crew, who successfully accomplished such a task, will receive state awards, the official said. Russia calls its actions in Ukraine a special military operation. Kyiv and its allies say the 18-month-long Russian aggression is an unprovoked war to grab land. Earlier Vadim Skibitsky, a representative of the main directorate of intelligence of the Ministry of Defence of Ukraine, said that Russia has a small reserve of Kinzel hypersonic missiles, about 75 units, and they can produce no more than six of them per month. As for Kinzel missiles, their reserve is currently around 75 units. The Russians value these missiles very much, not only because of their relatively small number but also because, according to our calculations, the enemy can produce no more than six units per month. At least that is what their plan provides. Vadim Skibitsky stressed, according to him, due to limited stocks and production of certain types of missiles, Ukraine's military intelligence sees how the tactics of the Russian strikes are changing. The Kinzel is Russia's latest system with hypersonic aeroballistic missiles carried by special-equipped MiG-31K fighters interceptors. The Kinzel missile features low radar signature and high maneuverability and is designed to strike ground and naval targets. The Kinzel missile system has been on experimental combat duty since December 2017. The Russian army first officially used the missile in combat in the country's military operation on March 18, 2022.


Top Strategy for Binge Indians and we have with us Mr. Tarun Katyaal from Z5 India, considered one of the most successful executives in the Indian media industry. Tarun Katyaal, as you know, is the CEO of Z5 India. In his current role, he is responsible for steering Z5 India's largest and most comprehensive digital entertainment platform for language content towards gaining industry leadership position. Ladies and gentlemen, we also have with us Mr. Abhishek Rage, CEO of Endemol Shrine India and he's part of the world's largest independent production company. Abhishek has been leading the company's foray into digital and web-based content. He has been at the forefront, nurturing key growth areas of business, like regional programming. And also, steering this whole conversation is going to be Mr. Naval Ahuja, co-founder, exchange for media. Very warm welcome to you gentlemen and thank you both of you, Tarun and Abhishek. Thanks for spending time and Tarun especially. I know you had a review with your boss and we managed to extricate you. So I'm sure you're happy to be here. I'm sure Puneet would have been happy to be with you. OTT is one of the parts of their business which is doing really well. So well done on that. Well, you guys don't need any introduction so I'll jump straight into the topic. Tarun, let me start with you with a very simple question. Yesterday I saw Sensor Tar released this report which said Zee in June was among the top 10 downloaded apps in the world. Even I saw the report in the media article. Tell me three things that work for you. I'm sure there are lots of things that are moving parts that go into making a content company do well. But tell us three things that you've done really well over the last eight months, nine months which have worked for you, which has got you there. So, you know, it's been a long journey. Now, it's not easy at all to compete for real estate on anybody's connected device. There is all those challenges that you have to meet about people's, you know, your own unique proposition in the user or consumer's life. Your ability to deliver that proposition once you get downloaded and your ability to even eventually move that user up to becoming a subscriber from being just a free user. And that journey is, you know, it's easier said than done. I think what works for us or what worked for us and what continues to work for us is our connect with India. We've always been very proud of the fact that we work for all Indians and whether we have a wide spectrum of use cases. So, whether at the one end, we have, you know, free content or catch up content from all our 40 TV channels that Zee produces and hours and hours of content that drops in every single day. To moving to the other end, we have high-end series and originals and now direct original premiers for top-end consumers who watch it on 4K, 8K TV devices. And that's really a wide spectrum. At one end, we serve a platform like ChiOS, which is very, which is bottom of the pyramid, which is a very no-frills platform on the Geo feature phone. And on the other end, we've got to have, you know, features and more to compete with platforms like Netflix on TVs like LG, Samsung and so on and so forth, their magic remotes and everything else in between needs to service. And so that connect, that diverse connect with India through technology, through content, and through also UI UX, which is served in 12 to 14 languages actually makes it happen for us. Fantastic. Let me hop across to you, Abhishek. You've been in the content space for a long time, especially in India.  Tell us two, three things that you've seen, which you believe will last post COVID, especially when it comes to content consumption and OTT. What's your take? So, I think largely at a basic level, the content consumption or the taste hasn't really changed. If you look at how people are consuming content on linear channels or not, the platform and the digitization as what is changing the platform and delivery systems. So, you will find that the taste for a certain type of content will continue considering what that TG wants or what that age group wants. We see a shift coming by where people are viewers are now getting used to, especially with COVID as they've tasted a lot of these OTT shows, they want some closure at the end. So binge watching a show and a series is becoming largely the norm. But I think if we really look at the spectrum of the TG, if you break it down, the requirement that they have largely hasn't changed or what kind of genres they want and how they want it. And like Tarun said, I think when you look at India, you have to create programming that works for the mass audience. And which is why the spectrum of the audience will have to be catered at various levels. You start off from very mass daily soap type of storylines, which could only be made finite like telenovelas really. And going right up the value chain into what you have as these 10 episodes, eight episodes and those kind of scaled up as well. So I think from a viewer perspective, we really need to kind of keep our content offerings as diversified as possible. And I think you're really catering across a multiple spectrum. And I think that should be the focus in the future. That's an interesting point you brought about catering to mass audiences. And I had a subsequent question on that, but let me pick it up now. I don't know whether I can, let me try to share my screen. Tushar, can I do that? There is a graph I saw in the Ohti Tikki ENY report. I'm sure you gentlemen have seen that. Let me just put it up for the sake of the audience. And here it is. I think you're able to see this, right? This is a number of users across consumer segments. By timeline, as you can see, there's digital only tactical digital bundle mass consumers, free consumers. And mass consumers are the ones who are sampling some sort of content, but not really, haven't really converted into paying audience. You correct me if I'm wrong here. And that's the biggest part if you see in terms of the size of the audience. What is the way to go after this audience? Because as we all know, a large amount of content on OTT right now is either being consumed free or coming bundled with telcos or at a very, very small, tiny sum of money. So what is the way to go after this large consumer base? So it's a right time and a right question. We just launched Z5 Club as of yesterday. And this is a pack that has three things in it. One is all our 40 TV channels and all the TV shows that go on it are now early access to all consumers by 24 hours. So you can actually watch a prime time show one day before it hits prime time. Right. So I can watch Goon Lee Bhagya, Coom Coom Bhagya tonight for tomorrow's episode that was going to be on TV. It then has all the drama content that we make with all biology and our output deal with all biology that gives us many, many hours of content. Yes. And then it has what we used to have a TV channel called Zindagi, which had a lot of international dramas. And it has that library now being redone with original shows and limited duration shows. But the biggest proposition on that is really your favorite TV shows before TV. That's right. Yeah. And we price this at 365 rupees for 365 days, which is really one rupee per day to watch your favorite shows before 24 hours before TV annually. And we think that this will be really the game changer in building mass consumers into paying consumers. And to answer your question about bundled or free and so on and so forth. Like Abhishek said, this COVID has actually changed the thinking of the consumer and they are willing to pay for content. The increase we are seeing in our base of paying consumers is quite phenomenal. And paying directly, not paying through the course. And even with telcos, the increasingly operating is that we are increasing the pack price and creating a bundle that the user pays for. So we've got a 79 rupee bundle with etel and we've got a 289 rupee bundle with etel prepaid where if you buy 289 rupees and you could be at 249, 200, whatever on your prepaid charge. But if you upgrade to 289, you get Z5 with that. So it's a paying customer for etel who's paying us in turn for all our Z5 users. And that's an interesting point you make Tarun and it's good that it's moving in that direction. But my follow up question to you is right now as a user, there is tons of content, OTT content available across platforms. If I want to consume only a part of the content, right, I want to watch a movie on one OTT platform and jump into watch a movie on another OTT platform. The options for the consumer right now are to buy packs which are at least a month in duration. Are you looking at a kind of pay per view scenario where you know you charge say 10 bucks or 15 bucks for a movie because what that does is as you know, telecom companies themselves have seen the moment you start reducing the ticket price, the entry price, consumption over time keeps going up. So would you look at something like that say a year from now where you are charging 15 rupees for one movie? We've tried it. So we tried it for regions where we realized that people in the regions didn't have to pay for national packs. So we had a Tamil pack and a Telugu pack and a Kannada pack. It worked very well. But the feedback was that, you know, people again within that, they were users who only wanted to watch TV content and our South Indian channel content before time. And then there were some who wanted to watch actually Hindi and Tamil or Hindi and Telugu or Hindi and Kannada and to have access to all the larger movies and the big series. And we saw that upgrade journey for the ones who watch movies and originals much more than the guys who want to watch TV. So for TV, we launched the 365 days pack, which is 365 for 365 days, which is too much at all. The ticket price compared pay for a Netflix, which is 600 bucks a month is, you know, this is deep penetration stuff. And we do believe that, you know, as payment gateways, as your ability to pay, now we have we've been listed on Paytm as a utility.  And you're not using the wallet as a payment mechanism on my platform, but you can pay for me like a utility on any platform. Right. I don't know whether you understood the, the tectonic shift that it makes, that it makes your utility versus you being a service. Absolutely. And all wallets have recognized that this is now the new utility in town. So where DTH recharges used to happen, where phone prepaid recharges used to happen. Now OTT recharges happen. Brilliant. I mean, entertainment, consumption of entertainment, one of the key aspects of our daily life. So it's only natural that it becomes a utility. Abhishek, let me pick up on Tarun's point about, you know, regional content. They tried a model in the regional space. How do you see the regional content space trends different from what's happening, say in Hindi, though, you know, India is, you know, 20 languages or at least 10 major languages in which content is being produced. Hindi is naturally the largest. English as a niche. What about other regions? What are the different trends you've seen vis-a-vis Hindi COVID and post COVID? What's your sense? Yeah. So I'll first start by another point that Tarun had made was on the pricing thing. It doesn't make sense to kind of charge per film or something because at the end of the day, you'll never be able to recover the cost. That thing is a very DTH window kind of an idea where it's a revenue share, which is very additional fringe revenues. That's right. The idea is to get someone to come on your platform and subscribe to the overall content and therefore continue consuming it. So a single film or a product strategy. You started pricing for films per film, 15, 20 rupees, it'll take you maybe 70 years to recover the cost of the film. Absolutely because the biggest is where people want to come is never going to be easily recovered. So it doesn't make sense. Now, similarly, there's also that implication that comes down to regional content versus national like they're not put it. Now in regional content, I think there are two big factors that that that will play a role on how we see it developing. It is a given that everyone wants to see content in their vernacular and would love to see that and that we're seeing from linear channels and how the growth of the regional industry has been. But technically, today we have about six regional languages. That's the four southern Bengali and Marathi as the key monetizable languages. Gujarati, Punjabi are still the fringe players on in terms of monetization of content. What is changing is the dubbing and subtitling of global content and of content created in India as Hindi content as well. Right. So the moment you go into that, you automatically are although maybe dubbing some people prefers most people don't subtitling still works better. That's debatable. But I think the access of content that is created in general is suddenly very huge. And the second part is but the medium does not now require a lot of technological or channel support like a linear channel has a lot of overheads and costs to be able to deliver a regional content lineup. Here now you can start off with very little and this could be the game changer to the other languages that have so far been termed as non monetizable. So if you were to make it at a decent price point, I think you'll see a huge jump in other languages. Northeastern Assamese even Bojpuri for that matter is popular, but you could see a big jump in terms of how that converts on an OTT space. Punjabi for that matter or Gujarati again. I think the OTT space will change that consumption numbers to a very high point. I think we'll see this as a big catalyst for that regional space grow. Give us a bit of an idea about cost because eventually monetization is also determined by the cost of the content that goes into acquisition or production. How does it vary for say OTT fresh content? How does it vary vis-a-vis television because you know the quality of shows has to be international standards exposed. See frankly it is subjective. So typically if you take up a regular linear television cost and if I were to compare let's say let's say Hindi soap let's say 8 lakh rupees an episode. Suddenly what you see is it's not no longer a 260 episode series therefore whether you make a set or you do any fixed cost that's going to get layered over 10 or 15 episodes. Now those are the kind of things that get that hits you largely in terms of the amort etc and therefore your price goes up. It's not that there's a big difference in how we always treat it. Now there is a different storytelling there's a different approach I guess but those are not always the points that take the cost up. It's also the amort of a 250 episode suddenly coming down on 10-15 but if you were to use certain live locations pre-plan a lot I don't think a huge spike will be seen from where regional programming today is at cost especially something that is made on the bi-weekly side on the weekend or something. So I think at a decent jump of about 40-50% from their smaller shows can be made to test out the feasibility in smaller regional markets and then we could start off on scaling it up if there is a good consumption scene. Again this would be spread between how would you look at it from a perspective of AVOD and SWOD which is also a major difference for you to see and I think that's the approach to really start off and see what's more successful what's more financially feasible and then take the larger next steps to create a much larger content plan. And what's the way to kind of look at content cost that is being done right now I'm not talking about the regional space but Hindi content that is being done for the so-called big screen OTT and that's coming at a very expensive kind of ticket. Do you see those costs kind of coming down over the next three years? Yeah I think they're already down and I think most players have rationalized their costs. It is not about pure cost cutting but without cutting down on scale we I think there's been a big shift also on focusing on what is required from a production angle vis-a-vis what is the above the line talent cost etc. So I think their calls being taken on seeing not everything has to be a-listed. So we figure out what's good quality what's been done at different prices. So there's a different spectrum again on costs as well something that we are doing across shows varies in a huge way. We're doing some great content at a much lesser price with something that gets loaded with an A-listed talent will obviously be at a slightly higher price. So I think those angles are already being looked at and I think the well right sizing of cost as such is already underway and COVID has only accelerated that. So I think we're looking at that already. Arun you would of course you would prefer cost of content come down as much as it can. What's your sense I mean 12 months out 18 months out cost of content is going to get rationalized even more? I don't think so that the focus should be on costs. The focus should be on telling great stories. This is the time that OTT or digital is working very hard to make the migration from all other entertainment platforms to digital video streaming and I think in your investment phase if you start to think costs ahead of the user you tend to cut on momentum that you can create for yourself. I think this is the time to be able to excite the user with something new something novel something that they haven't seen and something that they've been meaning to consume which was not on television because you know on television it is the lowest common denominator who cannot create too much diversity too much special interest content in fact even too much male focus content. So in all of that I think if you were to start thinking costs ahead of stories you'll make the mistake. Having said that I think you know technology AI data we're using all of that in planning our content better. So we know at the user level we know what we should and shouldn't make but also in the production side we're now bringing in tools to be able to optimize location usage, optimize cost usage and so on and so forth and all of that will eventually take out the wastage from the system. It'll create a huge amount of efficiency. So efficiency is good but cost for cost sake is a bit you know a bit wrong to work on. Fair enough. Let me then jump to the other part you know you're right in the sense. Which thing are you happy with my answer? I would love it I mean that's that's something you should get more people to come up on line and say that I'm waiting for it. Tarun has to make sure that his purchase guys watch this video. That's why he's asked me again. Tarun let me take you to the other part of the equation you know you write you want to create scale don't bother too much about cost of course don't go you know here I have a cost but don't bother too much. The other part of the equation which is you know one user engagement and then monetization monetization right now is entirely or largely I would say dependent upon advertising the venues right in the OTT space and there has been a lot of attempt if you you know rewind 20 years back television companies were in a similar situation I remember 80% of the revenue used to come from advertising. Print is today still in that same board because they never kind of bit the bullet. Television companies today have a kind of healthy and you've run television businesses yourself so you know how the transition took place over those years. Three five years out from now if you were to you know uh better number how much do you think and how more than how much how do you think OTT players in the current environment where you have 30 40 players and let's say you don't count the long tail at least 10 meaningful large players. Is it possible to go after subscription revenues increase arches in this market and over next three years reduce your dependence on advertising so both will grow advertising pie is also small but say the percentage revenue that comes from subscription going to 20 30 percent for OTT players so let me answer this at an industry level and then let me answer it at a z5 level at an industry level there are two ends of the spectrum right the first end of the spectrum which started very early in the digital video streaming space is YouTube right and that skews all of what you're saying you're right YouTube is estimated to be about 6000 crores in India already yes uh if I'm you know I could be wrong it could be seven it could be five but I think it's in that range they think that it's closer to a billion dollars and then at the other end of the spectrum there is Netflix which is pure play uh as for subscription and there is Amazon Prime which is a part of a bundle but again pure play subscription right Amazon Prime and you can't attribute Amazon Prime only to uh Amazon Prime video but is is is now slated to be about 15 million to 18 million uh users in this country right which in itself uh if you take at their price point of you know 999 is a substantial sum of money but but you can't attribute that to Amazon Prime video alone right and then everything in between there is there are there are use uh there are platforms that skew towards advertising which are uh fully avod like you know vote is now getting into SWAT but has been largely avod uh sony live has been largely SWAT and they are avod and now getting into SWAT and there in there is a long tail of those that you know that do largely avod there has been us and uh hotstar which have been avod and and SWAT what we call the premium platforms uh and we've actually invested significantly on our SWAT slate we're now at about 130 original original series and and movies and so on and so forth yeah so at the at the industry level um the understanding that uh advertising is more than a subscription may not be entirely true uh novel uh and then coming down to our level I can tell you that we are already uh more skewed towards subscription than advertising on our revenue stream right uh and in fact our our I want our advertising stream to go up and this year because of covid anyway it's been challenging but uh the fact is that if not 70 30 60 40 if it it's not less than 50 50 for most players so in the fact that payment gateways are easier to buy in fact is that you can reach out to the consumers quickly and easily the fact that this is also a very easy bundled option for people for acquisition and retention for their own services as SWAT actually in this business grew fairly well and fairly early compared to the layered distribution structure that TV had the problem in broadcast was the leakage and the it was not a direct to consumer business right it is it goes through a distributor a cable operator and within a cable operator and lco and and so on and so forth and eventually the the 100 piece that are 200 or 500 that gets distributed from a cable operator gets split between so many lines of you know channels of distribution and then between so many channels within that are so many content providers between that here you buy z5 directly and it comes to me directly and there is nobody in the middle except the payment gateway who takes a payment piece and you're selling it as a service then anything else and that actually took the subscription game much faster and easier into the country than anything else also very structural changes like auto renewal so the government put in auto renewal capability on all our credit cards and almost all our debit cards and now only also on UPI so the churn on its own comes down because once you buy on an auto renewal card and we only sell most of our services on an auto renewal card we don't sell non-renewal if you have to buy a non-recording pack for us you have to buy a minimum three-month pack but you cannot buy a one-month pack or non-recording at all so these are the kind of structural changes that have made payment from consumers and direct to consumer for subscription much more lucrative for platforms and that's why platforms have been investing behind subscription content considerably over the last 18 months so give me a number three years out what do you think the industry will be earning i'm not asking z5 from advertising approximately what would be the figure three thousand the rules five thousand the rules so you know if you include youtube then the industry is already earning a lot right and youtube is the true blue digital video streaming on on youtube is already five thousand six thousand crores whatever you even if you make youtube 50 percent of the industry eventually then the overall industry should be where it is you know about 10 to 15 thousand crores fantastic last question i'm getting messages and i see the next set of panelists are also online acquisition of content and the you know huge cost especially using covid we've seen movies releasing i recall you know your parent company z entertainment i think it was 18 years back or 17 years back launched friday premieres uh new movies being acquired and aired every friday in the evening that was a massive hit and something similar is getting replicated because of covid partially uh we released yara today and yara is a very big direct to digital yeah how long do you see the sustainable because eventually unless money comes in how long do you keep spending on you know content acquisition you can't spend money on content acquisition looking at a four-year window unfortunately every a lot of these companies are shareholder driven quarterly results are important so what happens to movie content acquisition costs i think uh you know one theaters will come back so the split of the way you know the pie got split between theatrical and satellite and digital will come back after some point the other is we all are already investing in direct to digital movies ourselves which are at our cost not at the cost defined by the market yeah and we are in in the process of building our a slate of at least 18 to 20 movies in the next 18 months so at least a movie premier a month which is direct to digital for us so that helps us actually average out our costs but there will always be a role of rich builders and big titles and and you know they do cover their costs out quite well over a period of time right if amisha permits me i'll take a couple of questions uh there is a question for abhishek about the panjab market uh this is from briju pillai do you looking at the scenario that you know new shoots are challenging right now that the panjab content market will also split into tv and ott very soon um i sure like every regional i think it's it's worth trying because panjab market has basically worked on two factors one is music videos and second is bits of comedy which mh1 and other players have played on um and you see that we've seen that now that z's also come out strongly with fresh programming on panjabi etc we've seen some movement into uh content as such i think it's a good time to look at um content to grow there so everything will have to be split into ott and linear the monetizability of any product is going to decide how much of a split it's going to be or do we have a network play where content from linear will automatically be also monetized on ott so that's the only real difference and that's the yardstick really fantastic thank you uh gentlemen for a interesting engaging session i wish we had more time but the next set of panelists is already here and we have a you know couple more sessions to go thank you for your insights and uh people who have further questions can take it offline look forward to meeting you person in person very soon stay safe sure thank you navel thank you for doing this thanks for working with us together


In five years, you're going to have students coming to economics classes saying the reason why I studied economics was these market power videos I saw online. My name is Craig Paulson. I'm an economics professor at the Huntsman School of Business at Utah State University and also the host of the YouTube channel Market Power. I'm an Emergent Ventures grantee. My Emergent Ventures project is a YouTube channel called Market Power and I really help people understand how economics and markets shape our world. This is something that I came up with. I remember last year seeing a viral YouTube video that got me really excited about engineering and physics and I thought, if I was a student today, if I was in high school and I saw these videos, I would want to go to college and major in either engineering or physics because it just looks so interesting. And when I had that thought, I realized no one was doing that for economics. And so I'm hoping that what this YouTube channel will accomplish is getting people interested in economics and understanding that it's something that they should go out and study and learn more about and we really just need more people to understand economics in the world. In five years, you're going to have students coming to economics classes saying the reason why I studied economics was these market power videos I saw online. That's my dream is to have that kind of impact on the future students and help them see how exciting economics is.


Lots of people saying, I don't know if I have enough faith for this journey, and I like how in A Course in Miracles Jesus talks about faith and faithlessness, but it's he doesn't ever really Talk about faith as kind of a more or less thing. He never puts faith on a on a continuum of Small faith or medium faith or great faith. He says faith is really the power of your mind. He said, oh There's no doubt you have faith It's really it's kind of like the old thing Be careful what you pray for because you may get it. Well prayers are answered in the sense that everything in the world reflects your mind and And your mind is where the prayer is and you could say that your faith is the power of the mind So it's more a helpful question is what have I put my faith in and then when you get into the course workbook He gets very specific about you know less than 50, you know I am sustained by the love of God. He takes the time to put the contrast and he says in this world You believe you're sustained by everything, but the love of God pills money protective clothing being liked knowing the right people and List of things that you really have put your faith in you you believe in all these things and then in a few 20 26 Lessons later in lesson 76. He goes on you know you and Endowed the world with all these These abilities and skills and he you know he talks about You really believe you would starve unless you had stacks of green paper strips and piles of metal disc You really believe that that fluid push through your veins will ward off disease. He talks about the laws of economics He talks about the laws of friendship I mean he gets really specific and he basically is saying oh you've got faith Faith is not your problem We share the same mind so you've got faith no problem with that You've got a very very very powerful mind and you've invested it in a lot of ego beliefs And he's very specific about those beliefs in fact when I was doing lesson 50 and lesson 76 That was a bit you know he got so specific that I had to spend like a whole week Just going off and going. Oh, yeah I'm oh my best. Oh, yeah, I'm invested I could see I had misinvested in a very Major way. I had taken my faith and I had to completely misinvested I Feel like I read a thing on the stock market today, too, and it was just saying how They were saying that most investors in the stock market now most people who work with the stock market on a daily basis Now believes it's there. It's a prevailing opinion that it's rigged The majority of people who work with the stock market believe it's rigged and some of us You know rigged is kind of an interesting word, you know the game is rigged the The contest is rigged, you know when they talked about Miss America contest being rigged, you know It's fixed and they all already know that that there's so many transactions that are occurring the technology has got so great But they can do all these trades and transactions in milliseconds and Basically, they've got a lot of robots a lot of robots now They're working with and there are some people behind the robots But but basically the prevailing belief they said is that the stock market is rigged and with that belief that it's rigged Then people go I don't want to invest so they were talking about like with certain sector There's three hundred billion dollars less investments because people are getting They're getting fed up With everything now even fed up you believe it fed up with the stock market the biggest gambling Joint in town and how much ego loves to gamble and it's starting to get fed up with the stock market even It's getting dissatisfied So basically when you start to hear stories like that you start to realize that that it's not the faith is not the problem It's like what have I invested in so the first thing I would say to anyone who wants to make the spiritual turn Give your life over to God, you know, like people feel a calling like Mother Teresa did on her train in She was taking a train through India. That's when she got her calling Everybody, you know, it doesn't they don't have to be called to be a nun or a convent in the convent or a priest or a monk But but we we can we can feel that calling and I think it's a calling to divest in ego beliefs an Invest in the guidance of the Holy Spirit. That's to me what the turn is Divest of all beliefs and that any of the egos beliefs and laws have ever served me You know money possessions, you know achievements accomplishments intelligence Education, I mean everything take all the ones that you know, even the people go. Oh, please Baseball hot dog apple pie and Chevrolet. You have to start to realize all those things have been part of a mesmerism to To have your faith be invested in something in which you will not benefit at all It's part of a death wish and you and when you make the turn all you're doing is you're saying how have I poorly invested? And how can I change my tune my change my direction and and turn to the spirit and to me? That's that's really what the turn is now practically speaking That starts to mean that you're going to have to seemingly be given guidance to take steps to unwind From the world and it's it is divest. It's not you know in the alderman sense Where we're everything but in but it not in awareness if we still have beliefs that we are sustained by all these beliefs in the world then we do need to Go through a divestment period and to me that's important in the turn And Jesus even calls it relinquishments, you know, you'll go through a period of relinquishment He says in the stages of the development of trust Yes Some things Well, I you probably haven't heard all my talks for these last 20 years on but I talk a lot about exercise actually I really do I talk a lot because because When this body was seems to be much younger in time. Yeah, I I Was into a lot of exercise. I mean not just sports baseball and tennis and basketball and golf and and Yeah, I joined the gym and and you know a lot of cardio vascular fitness and Yeah, you don't want well just this is just a start though because I Got into it and then when I started into the mind training Actually when I started with the course of the mind training I belong to a club a fitness club and I Started to ask what is it for with everything and when I was doing the course it was like focusing all my attention on my mind training and Really, there was no attention on my body training at all. And so when I was started to ask what is it for? Jesus would tell me he said love I'm gonna use What you believe in and so instead of spending so many hours on weights and cardio vascular training I would still occasionally get guided to go to the fitness center But I was having all these holy encounters and all this stuff was pouring out of my mouth And it felt really wonderful But I wasn't getting a lot of exercise then and then as I continued on I would have sometimes thoughts like well You know without exercise the muscles will atrophy and you know, I'll just kind of shrivel shrivel up and you know what that's a joke, too because I Went through this so many years ago. This was probably yeah 20 some years ago and I Haven't had a thought of exercise actually for a couple decades. I'm I I don't even think of it It's like a cause-effect thing it's like we start to think I can't breathe breathe well without the exercise and But the Holy Spirit is so practical that as we start to give our mind over we more start to ascend in those thoughts That we're being given, you know from the spirit. It's it's more like things to start to Gently just kind of fall away and drop away Like I've had this talk about exercise for many years and in gatherings people would say don't you exercise? I said I don't even think of it I don't even give a thought to it and and there has been no Consequences, you know like they used to tell us about you know when we're eating nutrition and the food groups and all this and this My god, I you know all the stuff that we are part of our belief system, you know It I found that that it was the mind training that really brought me to health Because he says health is inner peace. He doesn't describe health in any terms in the course in terms of the body In fact, he probably would say that healthy body is is an oxymoron Because he does even say at one point in the course don't ask the Holy Spirit to heal the body Ask the Holy Spirit to heal your perception of the body See the assumption is that the body needs to be healthy or could be sick and both of those are judgments that are kind of projected onto it So I think it's really practical if if you know, you were having difficulty breathing and and you found a certain amount of exercise Helped you breathe easier or something we would say that's magical but but still it would just be more of a Backdrop towards while you're doing the mind training to do what feels intuitive. I always tell people eat intuitively and If you believe in exercise exercise intuitively not don't kind of push yourself and force yourself really Do it in an intuitive way and I did have a friend one time who? He had a series of heart attacks and he he would come to me I can heart medicine He was exercising and he was had a certain diet and everything and I forget how he he said I I just quit doing two of them, and I had a heart attack and and After the heart attack so what did you he said I went back to the Holy Spirit and Holy Spirit said I didn't tell you to Drop two of those told you to just drop the diet one and then you know it he kept going back for you another heart attack it was like You know really starting to tune in he had like three heart attacks But it was he still used it for his mind training, you know, he was always going back to the spirit like what what I do wrong oh Okay, all right, okay, you know it was back and forth not trying to jump the gun and just drop everything at once because even though The we made the ego and the ego made the world and we've kind of wound ourselves into the world The Holy Spirit is the one who has to unwind us from the world So I know I talk about a lot of things in my life, but they occurred over a lot of years I was just doing the mind training and getting the guidance and I would little by little you know put less attention on things and I didn't immediately drop all my beliefs around nutrition. I didn't immediately drop all my beliefs around exercise You know or diet and things but but progressively many things fell away as I gave my mind over to miracles