Nous allons commencer l'recording. Bonjour à tous, et bienvenue à l'infrastructure de GeneKins Weekly Team Meeting. C'était le 13 décembre 2022. Nous avons moi-même, Demandu Portal, Bruno Verrarten, Stéphane Merle, Hervé Le Meurre, et Marc Waite autour de la table. Nous allons commencer avec l'annoncement. Donc, le week-end 2.382 est au-delà des assets techniques, comme d'habitude, le reste de la checklist va être créé un peu plus tard aujourd'hui. C'est le week-end 2.382. Oh, wow, flash. Merci. Bonjour, Kevin. Donc, ce week-end est maintenant en termes de package, file et image. J'assume que le change log est réveillé, si ce n'est pas déjà fait. Donc, ça ressemble bien. «Reviewed, approved, updated, approved, and queued for merge, thanks to Kevin's work. » Merci, Kevin. Donc, oui. Non, rien pour l'infrastructure de GeneKins Weekly Team, comme Stéphane dit, notre instance est maintenant répliquée avec cette nouvelle version pour infra.ci. Donc, on verra si ça fonctionne ou si ça ne marche pas. Le next annoncement, c'est juste un souvenir qu'il y a entre Christmas et New Year's Eve. Personne ne sera dans l'arrière de l'artiste européen et de l'ouesternes pays dans le monde. Donc, let's assume que nous ne rassurons pas la rencontre du 26 décembre. Depuis que c'est été délégué du calendrier de GeneKins, c'est une bonne assumption. J'aime ça. Nous serons consistants avec le calendrier. J'ai rencontré un annoncement ce samedi, 19 décembre, repos.genkinci.org, l'instance de l'artif Gfrog, sponsorisé par Gfrog, pour nous, sera en bas, ce qui signifie que tout le bâtiment de GeneKins sera en bas, et personne ne sera capable de construire GeneKins dans le monde ou une GeneKins Relies ou d'autres compagnons durant le temps en bas. Je pense que ce que vous allez faire c'est qu'il y a un site ci.jankins.io et ses amis pour être en mode sainte-définition ou juste ci.jankins.io juste ci.jankins.io Et le sainte-définition sera en bas, et tout le monde sera en bas, et le sainte-définition sera en bas. Peut-être qu'il pourrait être smart pour mettre le sainte-définition dans le sainte-définition, ou pour le sainte-définition, juste pour être sûr que si nous commençons à avoir des artefacts rares que nous n'avons pas créé un centre d'updates ou des bâtiments rares, que ce soit le centre d'updates. Donc je pense que c'est une question croyant à Daniel parce qu'il y avait un temps sur les choses sur le centre d'updates qui nous a causé pour faire sure que c'était très, très souvent. Et en ce cas, ça pourrait être en 6 heures. Et la question à Daniel c'est, qu'est-ce que l'impact si c'est en 6 heures. Est-ce que nous avons l'impact sur les contrôles de Jenkins mondiales, etc. Alors, à l'inverse, nous devons avoir aucun impact sur le contrôle de Jenkins parce que le file de centre d'updates est là. Il sera juste âgé de toute façon. La dernière fois qu'on a l'issue générale avec le centre d'updates qui s'est réclosé pour 20 heures. Donc les gens qui n'aimaient que nous, et les maintenants de plugins qui veulent être réclosés, pour être réclosés. Donc pour le deuxième groupe de gens, ils devraient être réclosés dans les mails. Nous avons un blog poste donc je ne suis pas sûr que nous pouvons les contacter. Eventuellement, peut-être aux communautés de Jenkins, mais oui. Et pour nous, il sera payé un objectif qui est de monitoriser l'âge de l'âge de l'âge de l'âge et de faire la transition sur le site d'alimentation qui sera plus de 6 heures. Mais si c'est correct, on va aux sponsons avec Daniel. Vous avez de bonnes points historiques qui disent que nous ne espérons ni aux Daniels parce que nous avons ons les outages. Dans le passé, ce n'est pas du ban d'aribes sur les agents de Jenkins. D'accord. J'apprécie bien, il y a même un processus pour suivre, pour falloir le tirer. Si c'est trop tard. En automatique, il y a quelques heures, et si c'est plus que ça, vous avez un processus manuel pour suivre que nous avons quelque part. Absolument. Je n'ai pas oublié ceci, mais oui. Donc oui, ça sera clairement OK. Est-ce qu'il y a une question en announcement sur cette opération ? Je n'ai juste une note. Je m'en souviens juste que je n'ai pas soumetté un tweet pour le blog J-Frog, donc je vais en fait soumettre ça à l'application d'une chaîne d'outreach, pour que nous puissions avoir un tweet pour le blog, aussi. C'est cool. Merci beaucoup pour ce souvenir. Et on devrait probablement tweeter ça de nouveau, ou on devrait envoyer un autre annoncement Friday. Et puis, si quelqu'un est réveillé à l'époque où ils ont commencé, il pourrait demander une chose similaire sur le sunday. Je ne suis pas sûr que je serai réveillé à l'époque où ils ont commencé. Est-ce qu'on a un temps état, Damien, ou est-ce que ce n'est pas... Non, je n'ai pas eu d'answer. Donc, on va essayer de les envoyer aujourd'hui. Nous ne savons pas ce qui sera le temps de l'économie, donc j'assume tout le temps. Oui, ça pourrait être une surprise, on verra. Merci, Polkz. Ce n'est pas qu'il y a un calendarié. Donc, le suivant, la relance de week-end, comme d'habitude, la semaine prochaine. Donc, ce sera le 20 décembre 2022. La prochaine relance de week-end, c'est ce plan pour le 11 janvier. Je ne suis pas sûr d'avoir une relance de sécurité. La prochaine grande relance, c'est le dévox. Le dévox, c'est ce que je peux dire. Nous avons aussi un décembre 20 décembre, pour le projet Jenkins sur le code Google Summary. Et j'ai une question open, j'assume qu'on va juste permettre la relance de week-end sur le décembre... 26... ...le 7 décembre, pour procéder, parce que le décembre est plus hassle que la relance de week-end. Mais est-ce que c'est bien avec tout le monde? Je vais probablement vérifier, donc je ne me sens pas mal si... si on ne le fait pas. Oui, ça doit être... ça sera seulement la relance de week-end un peu plus tard, mais oui, ça devrait être bien. On va... On va... On ne va pas tenter d'essayer la relance de week-end, comme l'année dernière. Ça va être malade. OK. Un mot sur le travail qui a été fait, donc on a fermé l'issue 1, qui me semble une attente d'obus parce que la personne a créé leur compte deux jours auparavant, un ou deux jours auparavant, n'a jamais fait n'importe quoi sur GitHub. Mais l'email n'est absolument pas le correct. Donc il n'y a pas d'email avec celui-là et ce compte n'est pas lié à cette personne en aucun cas. J'ai demandé la question et fermé après 21 heures juste pour mettre un peu de pression sur le requester. Peut-être que ça va, mais oui. C'est un mot, donc j'ai pris sur moi pour le fermer, ce n'est pas plané. Il pourrait être un erreur, si c'est le cas, je suis désolé, c'est en avance, c'est... ça me给ande. Javan 19 support, merci Stéphane. Javan 19 est généralement disponible grâce à tous les développeurs sur CI, Genk & Seiyou et tous les machines de la structure utilisées par les agents de construction. C'est un souvenir que son Chidika non est ETF. Je pense que c'est très facile six weeks. We'll talk about that a bit later, there is a new subject on that topic. But right now it's available, so thanks, Stefan, for that work, Christmas gift in advance. Remert movement, rename of Jenkins Infragovernance meeting, so that's the website, meetings.jenkinsia.org. There has been some misunderstandings, so now it's back to its original state. Juste note for everyone, when GitHub page refuse to use a custom domain, you have to validate the custom domain by putting DNS records generated by GitHub. But please be aware that when you validate a domain in GitHub, there are three locations where you can validate one and it's easy to do the mistake. So thanks to GitHub support for helping me on this one. You can go to your account and there is a security area with verified domain, but only for your account and the repository of your accounts and your folks. You can go to your organization security settings and verify domain, but that one doesn't work for GitHub pages. You need to go to your organization settings, pages section, subsection, validate domain. And here you have to verify the domain with DNS. Took me some time to understand that and the tickets to the GitHub support, but now it's back online. So the repository has been renamed. Thanks for the proposal of RV, based on the misunderstanding of the discussion that we propose to make it explicit that it's an archive. And now for the, there is another issue open, we'll talk about that. The ball is in the board members area. So they decide if they want a new repository, this one, but yeah. Discussion need to happen before we act. Server 500. The old one trying to sign up before you go on from that one. It was discussed in board meeting on Monday and decided that we would continue the discussion in the GitHub issue to be sure. We understand we have all the right context. I didn't bring enough context to the board meeting to have a good discussion there, but the board members that were in attendance, me, Uli, Alex. Yeah, the three of us agreed, we would continue the discussion there. Okay. Do you want me to attend the next board meeting to explain a bit? Okay. No, no, no. We should be, we should be more than capable of being involved in a GitHub discussion without requiring that you attend a meeting in order to do that. Oh, that's not the meaning. It's more if it can avoid good taking too much time and having a summary. That's very kind of you. But I think our next meeting will be in January and therefore if we can't resolve this question asynchronously over the course of the next four weeks, we should sort of be ashamed of ourselves. OK. So just just to a reminder, given how it happened, there will be a vote of all boards member and the validation on the following weekly team before acting. That's and that is just fine. Yeah, just to be sure that no one act too fast. Right. Not not a problem, but this I think we are a few who did not evaluate correctly the sensitivity of that topic. We don't have guests. So I prefer having a long discussion, even if it takes time and then it will be OK for everyone. Consensus is key for that specific topic. Thanks very much. Agreed. Accounts. Jane Kinsayo does not have HTTP 500 errors. Thanks, Tim, for that part. That was also the opportunity to archive another repository and the component inside our system. The error was due to a former component in charge of synchronizing LDAP with Jira. But since Jira is on the CDF six, at least two years, it's automatically done on Jira site, so it wasn't used anymore. So thanks, Tim, for the help on the cleanup there. We had an issue with Windows Virtual Machine for CIG and Kinsayo agent failing. That has been fixed. Thanks, Stefan, for the help on that one. We had a short term and a long term fix. It was due to templating. Here, just a note for the person following on the platform message meeting, the Windows container agents for inbound or for inbound agents have a different, slightly different behavior than the rest because of the way PowerShell and the entry point script are parsing the arguments. It sounds like it's a tricky topic because of shell and interpolating parameters. But what bother me as an administrator and users is that the behavior is different between virtual machines and the container. So I'm not sure how the virtual machine or handling that part could be interesting to mention that. I'm also maintainer of the inbound agent so I can take part, but important to share the topic. Various plugins download fail with HTTP response. So we have found an issue on mirror bits and it's not really an issue because there is no documentation but it seems like to be a normal behavior based on reading the code. When you remove a mirror, there is a short outage of a few seconds that can extend to one minute. The time that the ready system propagates to all replicas inside a cluster. That's what happened when R.V. cleaned up former mirrors. We didn't know. So it generated HTTP 500 for some people downloading plugins. That mean we might need to have to write the runbooks. Next time we have to delete. It's not the case when you update or create but when you have to remove a mirror from the list. First, the first thing will be to scale down to only one replica, the cluster. Apply the change and scale up again. Just to be sure that's everything that even if there is an issue, it doesn't take so much time. It's eventually consistent. Métiquer a couple of security warning that one wasn't for infrastructure themselves. That was more a track for the data center manifest that has been done. We have renewed the certificate for repo.genkincia.org prior to the migration. Thanks Kosukei who immediately provided a certificate for one year. So that one is OK and GFrog is aware. Not able to fork genkin's repository. So we were just waiting for confirmation by the contributor, which they did. HPI file in Artifactory. So it's a brand new plugin. And the brand new plugin. Add issues, multiple issues. So some part of the documentation where weren't there were some holes in the plugin developer documentation, as I understand, in the area of Gradle because they use Gradle for building. So we raise the topic. Their initial release has been is out. They need to Artifactory should move to Maven in order to benefit from automatic documentation on plugin.genkincia.org. And there has been an issue on the Javadoc due to that plugin. You haven't an open issue on a few minutes. Clean up resource of Prod Confluence. That was that was a bit of money. So thanks for that work. So we have set up a dump of the database which is inside the Azure bucket. That dump is encrypted with the GPG key of a few person here. And it's inside an encrypted bucket which is private. We have different layer of security. The reason is because Confluence had the security section. So that's quite a sensitive data. And the resources have been removed from Azure so that should be a few hundred of dollars per month. So it's so that should be visible on the next bill. I don't remember the last issue. I think it was absolutely off topic. Yes, it was off topic. No question on the work done. Just a note from Mervé. Good thank you. Renew. I'm adding back on the announcement. Renew all of the domains. Jenkins DNS domains. So that was under that system by Tyler. So I understand that Jenkins.io has been renewed successfully. Is my understanding correct? Checking to be sure. I remember which ones it is that are. Yeah, so Jenkins dash no Jenkins dash ci.org has been renewed. Jenkins.io will be renewed. Probable within the next 16 or 17 days. Upcoming the two weeks. Yeah, six next two weeks. OK. So thanks Tyler and Mark for. Yeah, thanks for the automation. All I did was monitor and Koseki. Oh, yes. Koseki for the naming. Was it a new one? No, I think for repos. This is this is different. This is that was an SSL certificate that Koseki did. OK. Certificate. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry. No problem. New items. We had a short outage on C.I. Jenkins.io earlier today. Peugeot duty show that.  So we status was updated and updated back once C.I. Jenkins.io was back. We have an issue to open to put what we did. No obvious error. We saw a peak in network traffic, a lot of incoming connection and outbound traffic as well. A lot of system CPU usage. So not IO, no IO, no IO peak at all. So it was definitely CPU waiting for network resources. So we check the logs of Jenkins. Nothing, we check thoroughly the Apache error logs. Nothing word. No word request on the access log as well. So we are not really sure what happened. That spawned for four or five minutes. We can see that clearly on data. So we will open an issue, put everything there. And I think we will need to ask the security team just for a double check just to be sure to see what happened. But in terms of infrastructure, nothing obvious that was correlated with a peak of bomb builds, though. Like 600 builds at the same time. But that's something we're used to. So not really sure. Yeah, I've been helping with the bomb maintenance and I've been thoroughly impressed with how well ci.jankens.io, there have been times I think I've seen queues of over 800 and I may have seen queues of over a thousand and it's still survived. So yes, that's a huge work between pipeline underlying work, tuning and infrastructure work. So thanks everyone on that because yes, that's work very well. No, obvious issue, metrics and I'll show a peak of network connection. So something we have in mind here for ci.jankens.io is that the tuning of the Apache server is not always the best. It doesn't have caching of static assets, for instance. But one of the element here, we are not sure that it was Apache. Datadog does not show something obvious. Apache was waiting for connections. So one of the working hypothesis right now is moving away from GNLP TCP connection and moving that web sockets because that will decrease greatly the amount of TCP sockets because connection are reused by Apache front server even when you upgrade web sockets and it will avoid exposing the TCP port for the TCP connection. So that could be a working hypothesis. Peak of TCP inbound GNLP because we saw a lot of agents spawn on EKS at that moment. Award on OSUSL unless you have a question about ci.jankens.io So I've checked with OSUSL because of an issue with the mirror. So first of all, I've introduced everyone from the team at least Marc, Stéphane, Hervé and Hy because they were still linked to Tyler for them. So even Olivier was an unknown person as I understand the email but I might be wrong. First of all, checked in with them. I'm going to run a book to write so the goal of this run book is to document for the team that when we have an issue with OSUSL resources so first, which OSUSL resources do we have and where to open issues. So there is an email. There is an email. We have to send the email and it automatically create issues for us. We don't have access to the portal and that's normal case for them. As a reminder, OSUSL is a sponsor that's Oregon University. They provide us virtual machines, mirrors for free and they use to also provide us poor PC machines on an IBM mainframe as I understand. No, it wasn't... No, OSUSL could provide those to us if we wanted them it's not them. We were actually using services from IBM for those. So my mistake, I misunderstood. So OSUSL could provide us more resources. They have facilities. They have PowerPC for sure. I'm not sure about mainframe, but they have PowerPC available for sure. And IBM pointed us to OSUSL if we needed them. But I don't see enough interest in architecture so we're not going to bother. OK. So the reason... but no interest for Jenkins project. So the reason I'm mentioning that I shared with Bruno that could be interesting to contact them for other architectures because they also have IRM CPUs and I assume they could be interested if they are not already providing RISC 5 machines as well. That could be something to check with them. We'll do. Yeah. So that could be interesting if we want to provide let's say on the age agents for CI Jenkins. If we want to validate regularly plugins or Jenkins corolles. So that's related to infrastructure. No questions on OSUSL? OK. So we have the issue there. I won't repeat. So Sunday we are going to migrate. Repo Jenkins CI GFrog is going to migrate for us the instance. Everything is on the issue. What about GDK depreciations? So we have two GDK depreciations to discuss or at least to mention. First GDK 8. So we are inside the critical area which is how to make the life of plugin developers easier. It's been sometimes that we don't, that there were some I forgot the word differences let's say between what the documentation and tutorial for plugin developers says what the Maven archetypes used to generate new plugin project from Maven and what the documentation of the shared library maintained by the infrastructure are seeing. We had three different ways. One of the main issues that for sometimes, quite sometimes we try to go on just call the function and let the default value take place which was fine until we reached the GDK 8 depreciation. So there are half of the people involved that state GDK 8 should just be deleted we should shift the default and the other half of the participant of the discussion are more, they don't like surprise so shifting the default value could create issues. There is no easy consensus there but one of the direction that everyone agrees on will be having a work to be sure that build plugin function starting from this week should not be called with the default value to avoid bite surprises because if everything is explicit at least the list of platform you want to build your plugin and test it against then you should avoid surprise in the future and we could change so maybe removing a default value could be something what's the impact? I was saying I don't think that's our job but would it be possible to have something automatically send a PR ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?


The Joint National Association of Persons with Disability has called on President Bolahti Nubu to be inclusive in his administration by appointing persons with disability into his cabinet. We have at least 31 million persons with disability here in Nigeria. So we are looking for excellence to look at our population. We want to have a brilliant presentation in the issue of governing of this country. We don't want other people to represent us because people were to be close to us. He is also our slogan to say, don't tell about us without us. Therefore, we are looking for excellence in the presence of the President of the Republic of Nigeria to give us at least one special advisor on persons with disability. We are also asking his excellency to give us at least three ministers who are persons with disability also representing persons with disability in this parliament. Notice the satisfaction, the work of the National Commission of Persons with Disability under great leadership. A lot of our social economy program has been taken to 40 persons with disability here in Nigeria to the National Commission of Persons with Disability.


Hi everybody, Joe for jazzy'scasebrakes.com. We did it. We filled the jazzy's three box Mamba mixer One spot gets you two teams and we're giving away five Kobe Bryant graded autographs. That's pretty nice We'll be giving them away in this order right here the mixer itself includes these three boxes So we do have flawless collegiate basketball and that does group rate checklist doesn't have a checklist that assigns These college players to their pro teams. So when there's no checklist we go by our no checklist rules Which you can read about in our FAQ But basically it's if they're an active player, they'll go to the team. They're currently on if they're inactive, right? If they're retired, they'll go to the team. They played for the longest. We'll use basketball reference Dot-com as a tiebreaker if they play the same number of seasons Then we'll go to the next column over on their player page. You'll get it You'll cross that bridge when we get there. Hopefully there won't be too much of that And then at the end we're gonna randomize the original 15 names and we'll match you up With a Kobe card. That's gonna be pretty nice But first the break so thanks to everyone here who bought their spots straight up and thank you and congrats again If you won a spot in those fillers, so let's copy all those names And we'll double you up right here So you can see Alan's clear four spot right here and that was his clear four spot right here Jonathan was the first person to jump in on the full spot right here. You can see him again right there All 30 teams are in let's go. Let's roll it randomize names and teams one and a four five times the Kobe giveaway different dice roll Like we would with like break credit or any of those other type of things. So one and a four five times one two three four and fifth and final time After five we've got canard down to Noah One and a four five times for the teams one two three four and five One and a four five times. We got the Washington Wizards down to the Sacramento Kings Got a new font that we're working with for March canard with the Wizards Eric with the magic Richard with the Bucks Jonathan with the heat Alan with the Spurs Jonathan with the Trailblazers Mike with the Pelicans Alan with the Sixers Alex with the Thunder Jonathan with the Warriors Rocky with the Pistons and the Grizzlies John with my Lakers Noah with the Raptors Steven with the Suns Richard with the Clippers and Alex with the Timberwolves Terry with the Jazz Ken with the Rockets Alan with the Nuggets Mike with the Bulls Ken with the Knicks Steven P with the Nets Richard with the Pacers and the Hornets Canard with the Hawks Eric with the Mavs Alan with the Celtics Terry with the Cleveland Cavaliers and Noah with the Sacramento Kings We're gonna sort by Alphabetically by team and we're gonna pause the video when we come back. We're gonna see if there's any trades and Then we'll have the three box break stick around. We'll be right back All right. Welcome back everybody. No deals were done in this break So the list right here you saw on the previous screen remains the same here on the first of them on No, no worries. No worries. I just want to make sure you didn't miss it. So there's the the team results once again So Alex you've got You've got the Timberwolves and the Thunder All right, and here are the Coveys that were given away here just a quick quick preview of it We're just gonna be giving these away in the order that they were listed on the description Set these aside here for now and remember we're using the original 15 names So when we do the randomizer top five of the 15, right? Let me flip back really quick right here because I think I already got it set up There's the new dice and there's the original 15 right here. We'll be using that list When we give those away and then let me flip back again, and I've got And that's the order. So we're just randomizing your names not the cards So should be a lot of fun But first the break I think we're gonna get that collegiate out of the way Right here as I mentioned, there's no checklist that attaches these players to their proteins so we're going to We're gonna go go by our usual no checklist rule, which I mentioned earlier if they It's a retired player. They'll go to the team. They played for the longest And we'll use games as tiebreakers seasons and games as tiebreakers On basketball reference comm and if they're active players, they'll go to the team They're currently on how many blank cards I need for this To hide the encased we got three if we got three we got auto. I don't know who that is, but we got auto auto and Gem so we'll go right to left And maybe we'll go right left center sometimes the center card usually they The bigger hit that box never mind. All right, we're gonna start off with Villanova's Jalen Brunson One out of ten legacy patches Jalen Brunson now with the mabs, right? Has he always been a mav? Yeah Dallas Maverick. I feel like he's a Certainly Playing some great basketball this season that'll be for Eric and the Mavericks We've got a one-of-one Donovan Mitchell. Wow nice with the ACC patch right here. That's Terry with the jazz That's awesome Terry All aboard the big hit Express Next up we've got Devin Dotson nine out of twenty two-color jersey and Autograph and that's a really cool Donovan Mitchell and Devin Dotson is currently in the G League So what's the pro team that I mean still with the Bulls, right? Yeah, he's with the Windy City Bulls. So that'll go to Chicago. That's gonna go to Mike Sommage I'm gonna set that down in the Mitchell aside. Let's snap a photo of that later We've got Ray Allen seven out of twenty now what team did Ray Allen play for the long Let's go to basketball reference comm Ray Allen Out of Yukon. He played seven seasons for Milwaukee That's two more seasons in Boston and Seattle So that'll go to Richard and the Bucks Next up is two-color patch and autograph RJ Hampton nine out of twenty Hampton is currently with With Orlando that'll be for Eric and the magic and then another magic Cole Anthony one out of twenty Nice. He's having a great season Fun to watch Another one for Orlando another one for Eric and the last one here nice Seven out of ten two-color patch autograph Tyrese Halliburne, who's currently with the Pacers. That's gonna be Richard on the Pacers got the college stuff out of the way Now let's see or the box out of the way. Let's see what's in the In the case here the small princess As Naturally mine not lab-grown gems First one is Three out of fifteen Damien Lillard and his Weber State Gear Dame Diamond for Portland. That's gonna be for Jonathan in the middle here 13 out of 20 13 out of 20 James Weissman Nice one for Golden State Jonathan K With Golden State last one out of flawless is Devon Vacelle three out of five rookie gem signatures Train whistle for the Spurs that's gonna go to Alan who won the Spurs nice Alan All aboard the big hit express All right, so that was flawless collegiate 2020-2021 flawless collegiate basketball in the books slide this over here I Guess we'll do NT and then one-in-one because fewer cards in here See what the NT has in store for us. All right, what do we got here? What do we got? What do we got? Good luck everybody blank card. We've got a plate 16 the second card is a plate 16 out of 49 Janice onto the combo That is for the bucks that'll be for Richard the plate is for the jazz. That's Carl Malone. Nice Terry with Utah Terry all aboard the big hit express Got George Hill 25 out of 99 Philadelphia 76ers piece of his jersey going to Alan We got a national treasure relic. That's Stanley Johnson Raptors 48 out of 99 dino DNA for Noah That'd be nice Alex that would be nice We got Alonzo morning 63 out of 99 for the Charlotte Hornets that'll be for Richard. I've got Trey young ice Trey 72 out of 99 for Atlanta Nard with the Atlanta Hawks We got a Chuma O'Keeke 64 out of 99 for Orlando That's gonna go to Eric and the magic Do you believe in magic? And a thin card here. We've got Udoka as a Buick a private signings autograph For Terry and Utah a couple more here. We've got a buddy healed 16 out of 25 Sacramento Kings that is for Noah and Sacramento and the last one here is It's a nice James another James Weissman RPA Part of that big Warriors logo right there 16 out of 75 Still making his way back from injury. I think but there you go Jonathan with the Golden State Warriors warriors come out to play Last box here. Good luck the one and one So the first card should just be whoa We did get a downtown. I was not expecting that Wow And it's downtown Trey young and that is for Carnard Bolt and the Atlanta Hawks Whoo, it's what downtown Atlanta looks like In case you've never been there Spot on that is awesome. All right. Now. What do we have here right Logan? I'm not it's not usually expecting a Downtown of just a single box in a mixer All right, what do we got here? Got 68 out of 99 Gale Goodrich old-school Laker And that's gonna go to Jonathan and Los Angeles Los Angeles Lakers I think we're playing the Mavs tonight as a Laker fan. I'm worried Tough season for the Lakers this year. All right So a pretty great break ladies and gentlemen Could get even better for some of you because we're giving away these Kobe's so the First Kobe is the 2013 prestige. That's the That'll be to the name on top. I'm gonna make sure I got this in order the 2012 contenders Kobe for the second name down The third name down will get this Kobe Fourth name down will get this Kobe and the fifth name down will get this Kobe It says in the description small crack on backside label. I think that must be that right there That's okay. It's not gonna affect the card So that's the fifth name down as I mentioned before we're gonna use the original 15 names As it stated in the item description there you go. So top five out of 15 You can get a Kobe card graded. It's pretty nice. This is the big moment here Let's roll it randomize it five and a one six times top five after six fingers crossed. Good luck one two three four Five and a one sixth and final time after six. Here's the top five Right there.  Thank you very much everybody. I'm Joe for wow Logan saying that downtown trade just sold for 1375 Pretty nice. Hey, thanks everybody for watching and breaking with us I'm Joe for jaskiescasebreaks.com and I'll see you next time for the next one. Bye. Bye


I'm Barbara Rae Holcomb, and I'm one of the coordinators of the ASL lecture series. Really, our committee is pleased and honored to have Dr. Stokey here. Even though it's not advertised as part of our regular series, we've provided today's program as a special honor. Dr. Stokey has done a lot of ASL research, and we've really been inspired by his initial work in establishing the recognition of American Sign Language as a language. Dr. Stokey is here with our center for teaching, research, and learning as a visiting scholar. We've been working here for one month, and we really appreciate the honor of having him here. He's also a professor emeritus at Gallaudet University, and is involved with the research department there, as he has been for many years. He's written a number of articles, made numerous presentations, and please join me in welcoming Dr. Stokey. Thank you very much, Barbara. I wish I could give you the presentation in signing that you would understand and enjoy, but I'm going to leave it to the pros. First of all, I'm immensely happy to be here. I was looking forward to this, but I had no idea that I would meet so many new and interesting people. I knew I had old friends here, but I've just been having the time of my life for the last few days, meeting enthusiastic members of your community, staff, faculty, students, and graduate students and all, and it's just a real thrill to an old hack of 13 years, 13 years retired now to come back into the midst of an operation that's going like this one is. Just congratulations to all of you from NTID and RIT on what a fine institution you're in. I'm going to take that word back to Washington with me, too. I'm not sure what you expected from me this morning. I'm not sure I can get used to the echo, either. But I'm not going to talk about methods of communicating. I understand there's a certain amount of discussion of that going on up here. I will say that I think what we ought to do in the educational world is use whatever works best for our students. And I think we still need a lot more investigation of what it is that works best where, at home or in school, for whom, for deaf children, children with hearing loss, or more children who differ because their deafness occurred at different ages. And at what age? What's appropriate for teenagers in high school or young adults in college may not be at all appropriate in the nursery school or in the kindergarten. So we'll leave that aside, at least until next week when I understand there's a resumption of World War III. What I do want to talk about is representation. That is the way things inside our heads get out where people can see them or hear them. Normally we take it for granted that what we're thinking can be represented by speaking or by signing or by writing. And that will show what we were thinking. And if that doesn't work, there's the possibility of drawing or painting or dancing or making music. But if we want to find out how we happen to have this power of representing things, we have to look at the way things get represented anywhere, anytime, by any living organism. I mean, representation is not something very special and unique. Language is supposed to be unique to the human species, and probably it is. We haven't seen any other animals yet that can go quite as far as we can. But I think, too, that this power of representation and power of thought must be a natural thing. It's not something that came in on an unidentified flying object. It's not alien. It's not an invasion from a different world than ours. It must be natural. So I'm taking the position that thinking comes from representation. It's not that we have the thoughts first and then we represent them, but maybe it was representation that gave us the thoughts in the first place. And that, again, is the way our language works. I can say it that way, but what I really mean is that the representation helps our thinking. The ASL sign for building is just a great example of that. One on top of the other and then the other comes on top and so on up. We assume that the thoughts that we have here in our heads are there and always were there. And we assume also, I think, that language exists so that we can represent these thoughts. We also assume that there's a strict order in this. First we have a thought and then we give it representation. Well, that may be how it is now, but I'm going to argue that representing things in the first place is what gave us the ability to have thoughts, to think. I don't know whether that'll cut down the echo. I believe that thinking and representation must have happened together, developed together, each one helping the other. And since we're talking about natural developments, all this began a long, long time ago. Back to the beginning of life on this planet, the beginning of life on Earth. We're only going to have time here to examine closely the first 20 or 30 million years. The story begins with organisms that certainly do not think. If you add sugar to water containing bacteria, the bacteria will move toward the place in the solution where the sugar is strongest. If you touch a snail, it doesn't have to think about the touch. It just draws back into its shell. A dog sniffing a tree may not be thinking, but somehow the dog's nose knows that another dog has been there. All life is made out of the same kinds of material. All life is governed by the general laws of nature, the laws of physics and chemistry. And life is also shaped by the interior code of DNA. I won't say the whole thing out. It takes too long to finger spell that. DNA is better. The dog's knowledge and our thinking both had to evolve from simpler things such as the reaction of the bacteria and the snail. For the snail, I'm sorry, for the bacteria, electrochemical charges, the sugar ions in the water, reach the bacterium's single cell directly. It doesn't need a nervous system. But in the snail, nerves on the surface send electrochemical signals to other nerves which make the muscle contract. Human bodies have billions of more nerves than a snail has, but they have something else even more important. And nerves in our bodies are very highly organized. In the headquarters, the organization is in the human brain. So for us, messages do not travel along the nerves from skin to muscle directly. The messages from our sensory systems are routed to our brains where they're monitored, they're altered and otherwise processed. And messages go from the brain to the muscles which cause the movement. Now we're getting toward representation now, signs and tokens. Things like sugar and DNA and the scent of dogs may appear to represent something to some creature, but the animal does not necessarily make them as representations. Instead, they are presentations, they're presentations of the environment to the individual. We may see in nature something that looks like representation. I expect you've all seen stick insects. They're insects that look like a twig.  And we might say that the shape of the insect is representing something that's not itself. But that's not representation that I'm talking about. That just happens. That's in DNA. That's the way the insect is made. However, when we come to the dog, the dog has a choice. The dog sniffing the tree may or may not decide to leave a scent token of its own. If it does, the urine sprayed on the tree truly represents the dog to other dogs, and it also represents the dog to himself if he happens to come by that tree the next morning. Nevertheless, intelligent as dogs are, they have never made a language out of these chemical signs. Now, take crows. Bird species I admire most, I think. Crows do seem to have a kind of rudimentary language of calls. They certainly can count. A contemporary of mine in graduate school actually did a dissertation about the counting ability of crows. That's Cornell 1946, if you need to look it up. Well, there's been a lot of study of bird songs and animal calls and other sounds animals make as looking for the biological foundations of language. But let's face it, how many things can sounds represent naturally? Nevertheless, there's a lot of fascination with what animals can do with language. I have met and seen the films or videos of Irene Pepperberg, who has done work with Gray Parrots that's pretty well published in Science and in more popular magazines. The best of their parrots in that lab can not only imitate different people in the lab, but when you listen to the recording, you can tell which person it is the bird is imitating. They don't get just the words, they get the whole sound of the person's voice and manner of speaking. And yet, to get to where we want to go, I think sounds are a dead-end street. I believe that the first creatures to represent something they knew and that they could read back again were the ancestors we share with chimpanzees. We know humans have this ability and both in experimental settings and in the wild, chimpanzees demonstrate just a little bit of this ability. They have two gestures that are widely known and seen. They have one gesture that means give me food and another one that means groom me here and they touch the part of the body they want the other one to groom. Also, Gerald Edelman in his book, The Remembered Presence, and the subtitle of that book is A Biological Theory of Consciousness. Edelman, a Nobel Prize winner in that book and two others written nearly the same time, presents evidence that chimpanzees can form concepts. That's about as far as they go, but they do sort the world into different kinds of categories. A chimpanzee knows that it's looking at a dog, whether it's a great dain or a little bitty one. It even knows that it's a dog it's looking at when you show it a photograph. But it's a long way from language. Edelman knows that, of course, and he argues that what the chimpanzees are showing is primary consciousness, this ability to operate in the world and to classify things into groups, to form concepts, to get a kind of a single idea in the head or mind, if you want to call it that, which represents any and all of those creatures. Now, then on the other, on the cognitive side, Merlin Donald, in his book The Emergence of the Modern Mind, connects this primary consciousness stage of evolution to representations. His thesis is that consciousness could have not have begun and could not have developed without what was in the brain being somehow represented outside it. So I agree with both these experts in this field. I think that cognition and representation work together to bring about higher order consciousness and language. Concepts are fleeting, nebulous things, like the random electrical charges that make the aurora borealis. They just fade to nothing unless they're represented by something, some sign outside the organism. I would guess, I don't know a thing about it because I'm not inside it, but I would guess that in the chimpanzee's head, the concept dog is formed when the chimpanzee is looking at a dog or perhaps hearing a dog barking or looking at a picture. But take away the sound, the picture and the dog, and the chimpanzee's not thinking about dogs anymore, at least it seems likely. So concepts come and go. They need something outside the conceptualizing nervous system that represents them. But once concepts get represented, they don't stay static, they can combine and recombine. For example, if I point with one hand to a person over there, that pointing can represent the person or it can represent the place where that person is. And then if I point with the other hand to a person or a place over there, that's both, if I do this, perhaps I'm representing the experience of seeing those two persons move together. I'm representing a memory that person A and person B came together. Could be that, or if I did that and that and that, maybe I'm expressing instead a wish that the two persons would come together. That once it gets outside the head, you can do things with the representation. Well, representations need something to represent, of course. But just as important, they need something else, some way of connecting them to what they do represent. I think that's the crucial thing. We are so familiar with language that we haven't given a thought to what it is that connects words or signs to meanings. If ever since early childhood, if we ask why a sign or a word means what it means, we get an answer something like, that's just the way it is. That's the way it is. A word means what it means because almost everyone who uses the language learned the word and what it means at the same time, altogether, as if one was part of the other. But there's nothing natural in this. I mean, it's natural because it happens, yes. But there's no natural, but there is no natural connection between the word and the meaning that comes from arbitrary convention. A representation and what it represents can be connected naturally. For example, the two things may be similar in shape or in some other way. Such similarity is characteristic of the kind of representation made by a sign called icon, an icon. And ASL signs like ball and bird and book, tree are examples of that where there's something similar, something we recognize as resembling one resembling the other. Something about the way these things look, birds and ball, books, trees look, is similar to something about the sign of ASL. Another kind of natural connection occurs when the thing being represented directly affects the way it is represented. There are many examples among ASL verbs. Sign language verbs generally will be another kind of sign that semioticians call the index. The index is a sign that has the form it has because it's somehow connected directly to naturally to what it represents. Take signs of ASL signs like fall and climb and walk and carry. In fact, any non-abstract verb I think in the language is going to be pretty close to what we conceive of as being the way that action looks. These icons and indexes, the noun-like things, the things that resemble somehow the sign or the sign resembles the thing, and the action, the word, action words, the verbs in which the movement of the sign reproduces in some way the movement of the action it represents. These are natural signs with a natural connection to what they mean, but they're also symbols. They're also language signs. They don't have to be used that way. I'm sure many of you have traveled to where other sign languages are used. In European sign languages, the sign for tree, you can see the similarity there. This is like a maple tree, but others do tree. They're talking about a tree trunk, I guess. It's kind of a vertical thing. All three of those signs, the ASL sign, the Northern European, the Southern European sign for tree, they all do resemble, but the people who use any one of those languages have a particular sign that they say means tree, and so it does to them. A sign can be naturally connected as an icon or an index to what it represents, but it also can be symbolic in the sense that the people who use it have decided this is the one and no other is going to be the thing of language sign. Another example of that is in the sign language of North American Indians, the famous American anthropologist, Garak Mallory, Lieutenant Colonel Garak Mallory, published the book, The Sign Language of North American Indians. In the front part of the book, he is extolling the universality of sign language and gesture and so forth. People understand it. I think you can understand it in the context of what I'm saying this morning, we can understand that. What he's talking about is that so many of these manual signs have something about them that sort of naturally suggests to the people who see them what they're supposed to mean. But even the Indian sign language was far from being universal. In the back part of Mallory's book, he's got this long dictionary listed by tribes. I don't remember which tribes are which except that in the southwest of the United States or in the southwest part of the continent, the tribes living there have a sign for a horse very different from the ASL sign. Well, we do something that that's their sign for horse. You get it? These people are used to seeing wild horses out there in the plains of Arizona and New Mexico and the horses are going by like that. They're rectangular shapes or silhouettes against the sky. Up in the in the middle west, more or western plains, there was another sign for horse. Another tribe didn't refer to horse that way, had a different sign. Anyone? That's because the horses were used to pull something, what's called a French word, a trevois, T-R-A-V-O-I-S. Some tribes use dogs for that. What they did was put a rope or a strap around the middle of the beast, two poles to that. The poles dragged on the ground behind and then they could tie their bundles, the TPs rolled up or whatever and the horse would pull it along. So that was horse to that tribe. Then there were the Indians who lived further east. In their sign language, they had a different sign for horse. You probably guess what it is. Oh, that's good. That's driving carriage horses. But the Indians in the near Midwest were familiar seeing American cavalry. So when they saw a horse, they saw a rider astride it. I don't know who it was or why it was, but the ASL sign for horse is made up on the head with the thumb and fingers. I just wondered, just idle curiosity, you suppose it's because that looks like the finger spelling H. And so you do the horses ear and the H up on the head, also where you make the sign for deer and cow, if I'm not mistaken. Well, to sum up what I haven't quite said yet, I've been trying to persuade you that manual representations are the only first way of putting concepts out where their makers can see them. Chimpanzees and hominids surely did that much, but hominids went much farther. When they saw what was in their heads represented out there in their own and others' movements, they could begin to connect things up. Remember my example of the two pointing fingers coming together? Such connected concepts now really deserve to be called ideas. When two people get together, that's more than just one person and another person and moving. It's two people got together. It's a complete idea. So that doing gestures of that kind, meaning that way, with the meaning fairly clear from what you were pointing at and what you did with the movement, it was possible for someone, some creatures there, to see that the moving hand represented a person or a creature, that the movement itself represented what that creature did. And even it could represent what was the result of that action. Suppose someone is saying, I wanted to see so and so, but he was just getting into his car. I ran across the parking lot and I caught him. You can see how the hand moving is like the person telling the story. The running across and grabbing is the action performed and the finger that's grabbed represents the object of that. Well, that's an interesting and very simple gesture, but it also happens to be what grammarians call a transitive sentence. And when you've represented something out in front that way that has that structure. I mean, I just took it apart for you here. The moving hand is the subject. The movement is the verb and the stationary hand is the object. When that happens, you have a sentence and along with the sentence, you have syntax which is one of the necessary parts of language. There are considerable arguments going on or there were as to whether chimpanzees taught to use computer keys or plastic tokens or gestural signs, whether they were capable of syntax. I'll leave you to the literature on that because it's being argued both ways. But signs like that could have been the very first sentence in the very first sign system that you could call a language. It's completely visible. It's completely performable. And because of the resemblance and the connection, it shows naturally just what it means. And the thing is that sounds cannot possibly do that. What you can tell from a sound is probably its location. If it lasts long enough, you can turn your head until the sound is coming in both ears if you can hear. But even if you do that, all you know is the sound is a sound is a sound. If you had the experience of seeing the animal making the sound, you say, oh, that sound is a lion roaring or that's a dog barking. But the sound itself doesn't represent anything except what it is. However, if the people who were making those gestural sentences got to be in the habit of making noises while they were representing gesturally, it could be that after a while making the noises that went along with it could replace the visible sign and the meaning. I mean, originally they would have occurred along with both the visible sign and what it stood for. And then later the sound alone would still be associated with the meaning and the visible sign could drop out. Well, it never dropped out entirely, did it? On the one hand, we have all these marvelous sign languages, sign languages of deaf people all over the world and even secondary sign languages such as the American Indians and Australian Aboriginal people use. But we also have the gesturing that hearing-speaking people use when they're conversing. So the system of representation is in there. I think underneath language it's still very much a part of it. So with that sort of thing the spoken languages could have arisen after sign languages had been well established. Because until you could represent complete thoughts visibly in signs which showed what they meant, there was no way that a spoken sound, a word, could have any meaning. People had to put some meaning into it. Where did that meaning come from? What came from the very sensible thoughts and sentences of sign language using people? If these ideas of mine ever get to be widely accepted, I think one effect of them might be that deaf people in their languages would get more respect than they have now. The whole outlook on language and thought would get back to some very basic things. The fact that we can think and speak and write and read and figure and invent and all that has as much to do with our vision and our upper body movement as it has to do with our spoken language. So I think. Now, since I haven't taken the whole hour, if there are any questions from the floor I'd be glad to do my best. I have a question for you. You talk about hearing people using gestures and European peoples and talking about Europe. I think that hearing people may use gestural languages and deaf people certainly have their signed language. And here in America, you talk about people with SIMCOM signing and talking at the same time and the impact on literacy. Here in America now with SIMCOM signing and speaking at the same time or methods of education, teaching writing or speech reading or literacy. Do you see a relationship? I'm not sure. Let me make sure I interpreted that correctly. I'm not sure I interpreted you right. Okay, let me back up and repeat this again. We're talking about the difference between America and Europe with hearing people, spoken language and gesture. And then as that spread through different countries, how would people communicate through gestures with one another? People in America are not as comfortable with gestures, natural gestures as people in Europe are, European countries. People are very comfortable with natural gesturing, they're more reserved here in America. How do you think that developed? Well, I think every group of people who have a way of life that they share pretty much a set of values and behaviors and decisions about what's right and wrong. In other words, a culture, people within a particular culture have their way of doing things and those in another have a different one. But if people from one culture go to another one and try to communicate as I think you were saying, they'll have difficulty. This did happen, you know, back in this 18th and 19th century when European people went into the Pacific and particularly Captain Cook's voyage. But that's just one example of many. Captain Cook going up the west coast of what's now Canada, running into the people living there, Native Americans, Indians. He needed water and food for his crew. And the only way he could communicate with those people was by gesture. And he did write it, he and some other explorers wrote up what they did. I remember one example, the most important first example in that was communication would take place by gesture, but only if the explorers, the travelers lay down their arms. The first thing is, don't bring those guns in here, put them down.  Well, by gesture, Cook and his party were able to persuade the people if they needed some water and they needed some food, certain kind of food I think was. And the Indians tried to tell them what they wanted to know. And what he finally did, he laid down like this on the floor, on the ground, three times. And sure enough, three days later, somebody they sent out came back with the food that was what they wanted. There was no language they could use between them so they had to resort to that kind of pandemime and gesture invented on the spot and so forth. And this works, it's always worked. And it works better for deaf people than for hearing people. There's some real empirical research on that, that when deaf people from different nations who have different sign languages get together, they don't know each other's sign language, but they're much quicker at understanding each other with that invented gesture and pandemime because they're used to using their eyes to get language information. I think your question, too, said something about literacy and that's a whole other subject. We can't really talk about literacy except the written form of spoken languages. Some people are trying to, I did it myself in my younger days, trying to invent a notational system for American Sign Language. Other people have picked it up and changed it or made different ones and there's people in dance, ballet and stuff have a sign system for it. They can tell you what every part of the body is doing at a given moment, but it takes a whole page to transcribe just a little bit of signing. So I'm not sure where the tie between the gesture and literacy comes in, but I do remember watching my colleagues teaching English at Gallaudet and sometimes the student wouldn't know an English word, but of course as soon as it was put into the ASL translation, the student got it and then there we were. There's a question back there. My question relates to developing language. You know that there's some research that talks about, oh, hi, sorry, hello. There's some research that talks about vocal development and internal, I think it was Lieberman. Lieberman may be vocal development and cognitive development and language. Is that true that language and voice develops in the brain at the same time simultaneously and cognition and... I don't know about that. I doubt that it would be true for this reason that pretty good evidence from archaeology shows that people on Earth were acting in a pretty human way for a long, long time before they could speak. That is the kind of development in the throat that's required for spoken language. Well, Phillip Lieberman at Brown University, Krillin, others have done research on the shape of the vocal tract in human beings, adult human beings, newborn human infants, and then various primates, apes, orangutans, chimps, and so on. They say that it was pretty late in the evolution of the present human physical structure that we came to have the kind of throat that made speech possible, like 50,000 years ago. But I believe that a language was on Earth, a visual language, a sign language, for half a million years before that. It's certainly true that the human hand, the structure of the human hand, which is different from a chimpanzee hand by quite a bit. The thumb is differently placed and the length of the fingers and so on. The human hand has been around for millions of years, or a couple of million years, but human voices, human throats able to handle a modern spoken language that didn't develop until 50,000, 60,000 years ago. It's better if I come up front to sign, or sign from here. And everyone see me okay? I'd like you to explain the relationship between monkeys or chimpanzees and, you know, gesturing, trying to teach chimpanzees sign language. And, you know, one of the things that's bothering me is my own experience, my personal experience growing up at a different residential school for the deaf, where there was a wall literally around the school, and lucky devil, there was a residential school for the deaf, and right next to it across the wall was a zoo. So when I'd be walking outside the school, you know, we'd be teased. People would accuse us of acting like monkeys, or I think people made comparisons with a formal signed language and how monkeys gestured, and that's always bothered me. Do you see parallels? I mean, you know, the level of language attainment in monkeys certainly isn't like the level of language attainment with deaf people. So how do you educate laypeople who are naive that there's a difference between a fully developed language and the type of gestures or rudimentary language that chimps are capable of? That's really bothered me. And when I moved here to America, I was really surprised that that wasn't a concept here in America comparing deaf people with primates where it was in my home country. So I'm wondering if you could just respond to that. That's a great question and a deep question. And I can just give it a try. The people who think of deaf people and animals in that way are pretty much the same people who think of somebody of a different color skin as an inferior, who think of people with a different religion as somebody to be shot at in the streets of Belfast, instead of to be welcomed into their homes. I mean, this is human prejudice. It comes from ignorance, very much from ignorance, and it's learned behavior. Somebody who ever said that about comparing the deaf children in the school with the monkeys in the zoo didn't come up with the idea on their own. It's not a natural idea. They learned it from somebody else. Somebody, as one of my cousins like to say, somebody who was born with a bad feeling. But I think the only way you can approach that is through knowledge. People ignorant of sign language. Gee, when I went to Gallaudet 42 years ago, people told me that the deaf students there couldn't think in the abstract, they couldn't really master language, because they were deaf, they had a mental deficiency. That's all balderdash. Put a nice word on it. It's completely wrong. It's false information. It's ignorance. So the only thing I can do, I think, is try to get some better information out there. It certainly seems in the last 42 years that more information about American sign language and other sign languages has changed people's minds enough. I mean, I've seen that... Well, I've seen the day when Gallaudet University got a deaf person as president. I've seen a lot of the people I know, professional colleagues, my age who used to have to work, because they couldn't get an upper-level teaching position at Gallaudet, they had to work nights in the newspaper office of working a line-of-type machine. I've seen that change. I've seen former students of mine become superintendents of state schools for the deaf, get PhDs, write outstanding research discoveries. And this, I think, has happened because there's a little bit more knowledge about sign language going around than there used to be. And I hope I haven't offended you by all the talk I gave about primates and so forth. I mean, I have done a good deal of study of physical anthropology, and I do know that it's pretty well authenticated that the ancestor of chimpanzees and human beings was one species. That separated a long, long time ago. But that ancestor must have had a little bit more mental power than any of the other in the primate line, monkeys and apes. And modern molecular biologists will tell you that about 99% I think it's 99 or 97% of our cells, the cells in our bodies are almost 97% identical with the cells in chimpanzees' bodies. A good friend of mine, a very wise man who's done a huge book, a monumental book on the sign languages of Aboriginal Australia, says in an article in Man, the British anthropological journal, he said, it seems as if chimpanzees were on the verge of developing language, but they never did. And his take on that is they never did because they didn't need to. They lived in an environment, a climate that was perfectly okay. They didn't have to do anything else. Apparently, their cousins that developed into the hominid line, that developed into the human line did have to keep changing their ways. They did have to find new ways of coping. And one of the ways they found was to go from the kind of communication chimps and other animals have to something more and more like language. First, I read your book. And... I don't think I agree at all with what Firth said. I'm a little ashamed that you reminded me of that book long ago because what I'm saying this morning is thinking does not begin in the head.  What's in the head gets expressed with motion that can be seen, and then the motion that can be seen gets picked up back in the head, and language is a circuit of going around. If I said... I accept what you say that I said in the book, that's the 1960 book, that what I was... in the context, as I remember, a lot of people, even from Samuel Heineken, Germany, that great antagonist of the Abe Dele pay, Heineken saying that language is speech, it's voice. It's got to be put into sound or it's not language. And that long history is still going on of the fight between oralism and manualism. Mouth language and hand language. And what I was trying to say when I said that, which you quoted, was that language is not from the hands, it's not from the mouth, it's from the brain. What I really meant to say is, of course, it involves the brain and the hands and the mouth and all together. Thank you. That's great. Since you're called the father of ASL, in France, we hear that ASL is American Sign Language and they came over here and the folks from France met deaf people, and what was used here was labeled as ASL. I'd ask you, what's the definition of American Sign Language? If I really wanted to win this audience, I would say, what's your definition of the English language? Appreciate it. And you said I'm called the father of ASL and I've heard that and I always disclaim it. I might be one of the uncles who found the poor baby out in the woods where the oralist had kicked it. But I mean, thinking back, was Lauren Claire the father of ASL? Lauren Claire brought back to America by T.H. Gallaudet. Claire helped Gallaudet found the American School in Hartford, the first permanent school in the U.S. Claire also helped, found many, many other state schools. People came to him or he went to the place and showed them the signing system they used and so on. And so there was a big influx of French signing into the sign language used here. But if you can believe what's written on a Martha's Vineyard long before Claire came over from France the people were signing, had a sign language. You know who the father of sign language would be? If you can believe it. It's a guy that lived in the Garden of Eden with a woman called Eve. I'll give you a follow-up question. OK, I'll sign slow for the interpreter, OK? I have two questions. The first, I'd like to ask you ASL is a visual gestural language and receptive skills are important and signing. Are you really skilled at ASL yourself receptively and expressively? No. No. OK, then, then how did you find that ASL is a full-blown language? It seems somewhat contradictory that you're not highly skilled at ASL. You're not a skilled signer and yet as you started to study ASL you found, boy, this is great. This is a language, it's a full-blown, fully developed language and you're recognized as the person who did that. But you're not yet fluent in the language, not skilled in the language. So it seems contradictory to me. Could you respond to that? Yes, the other side of that is this, that the people who are skilled in the language don't have to ask any questions about it. It's like duck soup to them. I mean, it's their natural environment and you don't ask a lot of pertinent questions about things that are going well. You know the story about the kid that never spoke until he was about five years old? He wasn't deaf or anything, but he just sat there in the kitchen and ate his meals and went to bed and around the house. One night, right in the middle of supper, he said, hmm, this food is wonderful, this food is terrible. And his parents said, what, you can talk, you can talk. He said, sure I can talk. But why didn't you talk before? I said the food was always fine before. Another way of answering your question, I am very conscious myself because I don't have enough contact with it anymore. Some of my skills that I did have in signing and in receiving signs are declining because I'm not with deaf people as much as I should be. But it's also true that looking into a system, it's sometimes better to be outside it. I mean, after all, as the person said who was criticizing, was criticized for criticizing poetry or something, he said, well, you're not a poet, how can you criticize that? He says, I'm not a hen either, but I can tell whether an egg is a good one or a bad one. I guess another answer to your question is that language is language. And when I say language is language, I mean sign language is language, just the spoken language is our language. And you find that out by finding out what makes languages tick, how they're put together. I've been working at that for the last 50, 60 years and you heard this morning about as far as I've got, if it's not far enough, take over and carry this idea further. All of you. My time is up. I want to thank you. And thank you in the audience. Our next presentation will be next Friday. Dr. Christine Monikowski will present on assessing ASL with a closure test. I hope you'll be able to come next Friday at noon here. Thank you very much.


So we're pushing it on like this, and then if you're sideways, you can also use this technique to push it forward. You're going to strike this area. You're not going to try to strike the groin area. Drop it down. Don't stop on it. Make it flat.


Item Number – SCP-194 Object Class – SAFE Special Containment Procedures – SCP-194 is contained in a standard anomalous vehicle containment unit. Description – SCP-194 is a red-painted robot designed to seat two people. Addendum 194.A-194.C Documentation of SCP-194-Z Addendum 194.A Object Class – Euclid Addendum 194.B Special Containment Procedures – The object presently designated SCP-194 is contained in a concrete mausoleum located in a New Orleans cemetery, the location of which is included in attached file 194-LOC-A. The mausoleum is to be checked for damage or deterioration once every 30 days. Any reality restructuring effects of SCP-194 which appear to impact the space outside of it should be reported to containment staff. Due to the effects of SCP-194-Z upon the SCP-194 designation, the acting documentation of SCP-194-Z is presented in the form of various addendum to the acting SCP-194 designation. Any secondary classifications are to be assigned in reverse alphabetical order, i.e. SCP-194-Z, and all addendum are to be designated alphabetically rather than numerically, i.e. addendum 194.A. This is to prevent conflict with documentation applied to the SCP-194 designation. Any changes to the SCP-194 designation, addendum 194.A through 194.C describe the true nature of SCP-194-Z and will remain unaltered regardless of other edits. Addendum 194.C Description SCP-194-Z refers to a phenomenon surrounding the SCP-194 designation. These objects are assigned to the SCP-194 designation at various times, causing the SCP-194 file to be altered based on the affected object. Only one object can be assigned to the SCP-194 slot at any time, causing minor retroactive alterations to support the containment of each object in Foundation custody. Notably, most affected objects assigned to the SCP-194 designation are non-anomalous in nature. No known connection between these items exists, and how they came to be in Foundation custody is unknown. All associated objects exhibit high levels of dimensional instability. Addendum 194.D CCTV footage The following is a transcript of CCTV recording 139-DC-732 taken 04-23-2019 in Site-139. No relevant video was recorded, only audio.  Subject 2 Something came up. Subject 1 Well, okay, would you like to? Subject 2 You know, I'm really busy these days. It makes it kinda tough to, you know, be social. Subject 1 Uh-huh Subject 2 So like, I appreciate it. Like, I appreciate you. My co-worker wanting to socialize with me as co-workers outside of work, but sometimes it's just not going to happen. You get that, right? Subject 1 Well, I mean, I guess I'd thought. Subject 2 We are co-workers, Garth. I was under the impression this was going to be a friendly after-work chit-chat. And your texts. Subject 1 Oh, I was just playing around, you know. Subject 2 No, it's not really. Subject 3 Excuse me, Laura, do you have a second? Subject 2 Yeah, footsteps. Addendum 194.e Testing logs. Item number SCP-194 Object Class Safe Special Containment Procedures SCP-194 is contained in a standard anomalous object locker. Description SCP-194 is an artist's easel with four paintbrushes and a small cup attached to its side. Addendum 194.f Relevant Emails To Richard G From Human Resources Subject Complaint This email is to inform you that a personnel complaint has been filed against you for recent behavior. You are required to meet with our office within the next seven days. Please respond to this email with at least three dates and times you are available for a one-hour meeting. Thank you for your cooperation. 2 Richard G From Site-139 Security Supervisor Subject Questions Hello. I am emailing concerning a recent audit of clearance logs for SCP-194. It appears you, or someone with your credentials, may have utilized your credentials to gain access to SCP-194. Please contact our office immediately. Thank you for your cooperation. JR 2 Richard G From Personnel Director Subject Notice Due to recent events, I would like to inform you that you are being transferred to Site-402, effective this coming Friday. Please resolve all pending matters before this date. Replies to this email will go unanswered. Thanks for your cooperation. Jim Addendum 194.g Field Operations Log Item Number SCP-194 Object Class Safe Special Containment Procedures SCP-194 is contained in a standard anomalous object locker. Description SCP-194 is a regulation-sized volleyball. Addendum 194.h Inserted Data On 04-23-2019, SCP-194 document underwent a period of accelerated flux before returning to normal stabilization. The following text was found in a digital document inserted into the SCP-194 file. SCP-194 Note Dear Laura, I still like you and I want something to happen between us. I know you think I don't care and that I don't think about people, but I really, really do. And I care about you most of all. To prove it, I'm going to make something for you. A collage of all the amazing things about you to show what a unique and amazing person you are. Addendum 194.i SMS Text It's never going to happen, Garth.  Please. Please don't make me take drastic action. Addendum 194.j Police Record Case Number Addendum 194.173 Subject Richard G Date 08-22-2016 Reporting Officer Carter Jerem Incident Subject entered a shopping center around 11 a.m. and entered Sears Department Store. At around 12 o'clock noon, the individual was seen running out of the store, being chased by a member of the store's security team. Carter apprehended the suspect, who was carrying jewelry, art supplies, and a volleyball on his person. Suspect was unable to provide proof of purchase and was held for questioning and in the store's security office. Actions Taken Suspect has been given a court summons for 11 a.m. on 09-02-2016. As he was cooperative to officers, suspect was not taken into custody. Addendum 194.k Item Number SCP-194 Object Class Safe Special Containment Procedures SCP-194 is contained in a standard computer file. Description SCP-194 is a document with various mathematical equations and symbols written upon it. Addendum 194.l Reconnaissance Report Excerpt Field agents designated Zulu-Niner and Bravo Delta were dispatched to Our Lady of Repentance Cemetery in Orleans Parish due to a radio signal emanating from the location. On arrival, agents found the mausoleum in the attached report open. Inside, they discovered the mummified remains of a human male in contemporary clothing. Identification cards identified him as Garth Richard, but no records of said person can be found. Subjects wallet also included contact information for Foundation researcher Laura Cain, but after questioning, she indicates she has no recollection of the deceased subject. Addendum 194.m Hypothesized Effects Audio Transcript Researcher, Laura Cain, regarding SCP-194-04-23-2019. The restructuring effects of the object appear to have caused a change in baseline reality configuration. SCP-194 appears otherwise unchanged, and its anomalous effects have returned to normal. I am currently researching what triggered the effect. Addendum 194.n Transmission from 194-LOC-A Richard, G. Knew you'd come back to check on it. Cain, L. You don't have authorization to be here. I heard yours got revoked. Richard, G. Well... Cain, L. Oh my God. Did you steal my authorization code? Richard, G. It was the only way to... Cain, L. Get away from me, Garth. Richard, G. No, wait, listen! Cain, L. No, stop! A brief thump is heard. Cain, L. Oh no. And transmission. Addendum 194.o Debrief Excerpt Interviewer Internal Affairs Agent Number 01-2204 Subject Cain Laura Date 04-24-2019 Interviewer And you've listened to the audio of 194-LOC-A, right? Subject I did. Interviewer In your opinion, whose voice? Subject Mine Interviewer What is your opinion on what happened? Subject I... She was cornered and reacted. She, um... Defended herself. Interviewer Killed him, you mean. Subject Yes Interviewer With the only things available to her at the time. Subject Yes Interviewer Which would have been... Subject SCP-194 Interviewer And what are your thoughts on the matter? Long pause. Subject You want me to say that she Or I made the wrong decision. But I don't think that. Interviewer What do you think? Subject That whatever reality Garth is from doesn't have him in it. And neither does ours. Interviewer Alright, that about wraps this up. Thank you for your cooperation. Subject What? Interviewer Hm? Subject Sorry, nothing. Lesson complete. If you missed the previous orientation Go watch SCP-193 The tissue snail Right now Or for the complete course Watch this playlist.