Hi, so I'm Nicholas and I'm going to present our paper on cryptanalytic extraction of neural network models This is joint work with my co-authors Matthew and Elia who worked on this with me when they were at Google So the basic question in our paper is we have some machine learning model which exists in some black box and We're allowed to make queries of this model with arbitrary images and observe the arbitrary outputs And the parameters of this model have already been loaded into it But we don't have direct access to those and so the question is as the adversary if we're given access to make arbitrary image requests and Are aware of the type of model that's being deployed and are able to see the outputs of the model but don't know what the actual parameters are can we Solve for these parameters given these other variables Now the reason this is important is that machine learning models are very very expensive to train So the recently released open AI is GPT-3 model took probably roughly 10 million dollars To obtain these parameters that are loaded into it, but everything else Like the architecture was actually fairly easy to be specified ahead of time And so it's very valuable for companies to be able to protect the intellectual property of their parameters And so the question is can from the adversaries perspective, can we steal them? So we're gonna try and answer this question given query access to a neural network. Can we extract these parameters from the model? Now there are two ways you can view this problem The first way is what most prior work has done and studied this as a machine learning problem Neural networks with types of functions machine learning is good at function approximation So let's treat the neural network that we have access to as some supervisor and Use this to supervise the collection of some new data set We're going to train a new model in this data set and use this in order to solve our problem and that works reasonably well What we're going to try and do is we're going to try and do a different approach and solve this as a direct Mathematical problem treat the neural network as a sequence of functions that we can analyze directly and try and actually recover The weights that way and the reason why we're going to do this is that this is going to let us Actually recover nearly identical models instead of just a similar model that solves a similar task reasonably well So this is our question given query access can we extract a neural network and Basically the answer to our paper is says yes, and we are able to do this with various caveats Okay So in order to understand our work I need to give a little bit of background on how neural networks work for that fortunately just about a minute is sufficient So neural networks are a sequence of linear layers with nonlinear activation functions Each layer has a bunch of neurons. So the way this works is I have some values that go into the input This is maybe the bits of an image and then the neural network will propagate these values through Process them at the neurons apply some nonlinearity Repeat this process layer after layer until finally we end up with some set of values Which give us the final output of the model and this final output of the model is then admitted to the outside world as The result of the neural network evaluation Now if I zoom in on one of these neurons to show you what's going on here The input neurons have some value and the way that I compute the output neurons value is I basically just Take the dot product of these with the weights Now the weights here are a one and a two these are the parameters which we're trying to learn Which we don't have access to but what we can do is provide arbitrary inputs So all we're doing here is just a dot product and taking the sum or if you view the entire layer as one operation a matrix multiply Now if neural networks were completely linear This would be very boring because they would all collapse down to one layer So we have to introduce one single nonlinearity and most often is the value activation function So that's what we study in our paper and the way that this works is literally all you do It's a rectified linear We're just going to take the max of the input and zero and just compute this as the only nonlinearity in the entire neural network So sort of zooming back out We're going to do a dot product and then take the nonlinearity with this value And we're going to do this for every single neuron in the neural network Okay, and that's all the machine learning is for the purpose of this talk It was also independent of anything else about how this model itself was trained. So let's talk about extraction then So the way that we're going to phrase our question is given oracle query access to a neural network Can we extract the exact model and it turns out this is a proof of impossibility here It says we can't hope to achieve this and there are multiple neural networks that compute the same function But have different bit representations So the best we can possibly hope to achieve is what we call functional and equivalent extraction Which means that now what we're going to try and ask is just ask for any one model Which behaves the same at an input output behavior as the model we're trying to steal Turns out again There's another proof of impossibility here that says we can't hope to achieve this for some pathological neural networks And so what we're going to ask instead is in the typical case of a neural network learned with stochastic gradient descent Are we able to achieve functionally equivalent extraction and then the main result of our paper is to say that yes empirically We are able to do this Okay So now let me give you some background on how previous attacks have tried to approach this direct extraction There are two papers here that have done this and they both work for the case of one hidden layer neural networks The visual intuition for these attacks will go something like this Neural networks that have one hidden layer look like this The number of neurons in each layer is arbitrary I've put two input neurons here because that lets us draw them nicely on slides three hidden neurons for simplicity in one output without loss of generality So the neuron exists like this and if we draw the what the neural network actually looks like on the plane It looks like this what I'm showing here is each point here Corresponds to a potential input to the neural network Where along the x-axis we're varying the first neuron and along the y-axis we're varying the second neuron Now each of the colored regions here Corresponds to a linear region within this function. We call that neural networks are piecewise linear functions because of how they're constructed and What you should notice here is not the fact that there are these seven different regions But instead the fact that there are really these three lines that divide this region into spaces Now each of these polytopes has the property that we are in some particular linear region with respect to the neural network So maybe this this first line here might correspond to what we call the critical hyperplane for this middle neuron Where if you're above here, then you're in the positive region And if you're below then you're in the negative region of this particular neuron Similarly for the other neurons. We have this positive and negative side Now what this means is that I can what I can do is I can label each of these polytopes With the nerve with the positive or negative sign assignment of each of these three neurons And if I zoom in on just one of these what this means in particular is that the neuron that work We're actually considering if we're within this one linear region Only has the neurons that are active actually being applied and the other ones are inactive which essentially means they don't exist and We could collapse this again down to just one single linear layer Okay, so that's what's going on in these diagrams, and they'll be important later as well So the basic observation that prior work makes is that the location of these hyperplanes almost completely determines what the function is that the neural network is evaluating and The reason why that's the case is that it turns out that given where these hyperplanes are we can directly learn values of the weights of the neural network So why is that the case? Let's suppose that we had some particular input that was on this critical hyperplane Now if we took a small direction in the red axis I'll call this the x-axis and then asked how far we have to travel in along the y-axis to get back on the hyperplane That allows us to compute essentially the normal vector to this hyperplane And it turns out we can use this to directly learn pieces of information about the weights So how do we do that? Well, let's take a look again at the neural network And let's suppose that we have this value x and y that is at the critical hyperplane Which in particular means that this middle neuron is now zero So we can do is we can say well, what if we go to x plus epsilon? Of course, this is going to change all of the values in the neural network into something We don't necessarily know but what we do know is if we now change y to y plus delta Then we again have the property that this middle neuron is zero And in particular if we now look at the weights going into this neuron that zero, let's call them a one and a two Then we can learn the piece of information that negative epsilon over delta equals a two over a one Because the only way that we could have both x and y leading to zero and x plus epsilon and y plus delta Leading to zero is if this assignment held true so This is good, but there's one thing that we lose and the problem is that while it's true We learn the ratio of these two weights epsilon and delta here What we don't know is the magnitude of this vector We don't know how big it is Now fortunately we can push any positive constants through to the next layer and things will just work themselves out The problem though is that we lose information is we lose whether or not this is pointing up or whether or not this is pointing down and This sign information is actually a critical piece of information that we just lose and can't recover and it turns out that Local information is just insufficient to recover this neuron sign So we need some way to recover it and the way we're going to do this is basically brute force So all we're going to do is we're going to query the neural network on a couple of different random points and Then say we know the weights of all of these now because we know the normal direction We just need to recover the sign So this means that there are eight possible assignments to the sign because we have three neurons in this hidden layer in General to an exponential number of neurons We need to recover the sign for and we're just going to ask for each of these possible sign assignments Could the function have the values that we queried at these points? If the answer is yes, then we've extracted the signs correctly And if the answer is no then we just try the next sign assignment So we might maybe guess initially that all of the signs are positive positive positive And then we check the sign assignment We check that this works and if it doesn't then we try positive positive negative and repeat until we find something that happens to work Now once we have the first layer with the signs extracted correctly Now we can extract the second layer trivially because it's just a linear function We just directly compute with least squares and solve for the second layer Okay So that's how prior work did this up until the point that we need to find these witnesses to these critical points on these hyperplanes So that actually is again a fairly simple procedure and the way that this works is we're going to draw a random line through the input space From maybe u to v and we're just going to sweep across this line and look for discontinuities in the gradient And the reason we can do this is if I plot instead of from like a top-down view of what's happening If I plot the output of the function as we travel from u to v we get a plot that looks something like this and We'll see that now the output of the function has really three different lines at which the gradient is this continuous Corresponding to these four linear regions and the points at which the gradients is discontinued continuous Directly correspond to these critical hyperplanes that let's us very efficiently recover these points Okay So the main contribution of our paper is to do three different things The first thing we do is we show how to extract deep neural networks These prior papers I showed you were able to do this in the case of neural networks that had one hidden layer And we're able to extend this to arbitrary depth The second thing that we do is we show how to do this efficiently One other paper that came out around the same time as us was able to show how to extract deep neural networks And we're roughly a thousand times more query efficient than that paper is and the third thing that we do is we do It's called high fidelity extraction and we can extract neural networks that are basically up to floating point precision identical to the original model okay Because of the limited time in this talk I can only cover one of these so I'm going to cover just the first and Again because of limited time I'm only going to show you what happens in the case of too deep neural networks These are neural networks with just two hidden neural layers So putting aside the stuff that I'm not going to talk about there are two pieces to our attack then As before we're first going to recover the weights and then we're going to recover the signs of the neurons So getting started a too deep neural network looks something like this where now instead of just having one hidden layer We have two So again I can show what the same diagram will look like and again We'll notice the space is partitioned into these polytopes of different regions that I've colored again Where each color again has one complete linear region and now the sign the assignments not are not just for one side of neurons But two sets of neurons neurons on the first layer and neurons on the second layer Now you'll notice that there are these same properties that there are these neurons that exist on The first layer where as straight lines to the input space But now we also have neurons on the second layer and the way those work is these ones are bent a little bit By the first layer hyperplanes if we were able to visualize what was going on with respect to the inputs to this second layer This would look like a straight linear hyperplane But because we're only viewing this with respect to the input space Which is then distorted by the first linear layer what we see here is a bent hyperplane only because the first layer bends it Okay so The first thing we're going to do in our attack is we're going to recover the first layer up to sign as before and The way we're going to do that is we're going to start off by drawing three or in general our arbitrary number of random Lines through the input space and sweeping to find witnesses to these critical points using the same algorithm as identified before And now we're going to do is we're going to try and use this information to not only figure out What what the weights are but like which neuron they correspond to on either the first or the second layer And we do this through a matching algorithm. We're going to start off by pairing all neurons with all of the neurons And we're going to say for each pair Could these neurons be witnesses to the same critical critical neuron being at the same neuron being at its critical point so for these two basically we're asking is Do their neuron do their normal vectors align in such a way that we could have drawn a line through these two and the answer Here is no because their normals don't align we can ask this for the next neuron For the next critical point for the next critical point we can keep on going until finally we end up with now Two points that are witnesses to the same neuron at the same critical point and this means in particular that this is Actually a constant linear region and therefore this is probably a point on the first layer and We can repeat this for each of the other layers Sorry for each of the other neurons in order to identify all of the neurons that are on the first layer Because only neurons on the first layer will match up in this way The problem about this is that it's possible that we could spuriously have a situation where two neurons Where neuron the second layer is accidentally found Because we happened to query it sort of very close to each other and we found something the second layer But in practice this occurs with fairly low probability and if we do this enough times These sort of things will just sort of be filtered out in the noise and the correct things will sort of bubble to the top Okay, so this lets us recover again the three lines that correspond to these to these To the weights of the first layer Now what we need to do is we need to recover the sign for this neuron is pointing up or pointing down For all of these three neurons Now previously what we're able to do is we could just through brute force Enumerate a couple different values and just trial and error check The problem is we can't do that again here because if I were to make some random queries I would have to then completely extract the second layer in order to check if my solution was valid and That's problematic because extracting the second layer actually requires queries So therefore my attack would not only be exponential in time would also be exponential in queries And that's not something we're okay with So we develop a more efficient procedure to do a efficient sign recovery By efficient in queries, but not necessarily in time So the way that we're going to do this is we're going to start off with a single point That's on the hyperplane from the second layer neuron And we know it's a second layer neuron because it's not a first layer neuron because we found all of those and then we're going to trace its path through the input space and Follow everywhere that it goes to in order to identify the line of the path that it takes and Once we've done this now we can again do our same style of argument as before We know that this is the path that it empirically takes So let's try all possible sign assignments of the first layer and ask which of these Could possibly permit the fact that this nine exists in exactly this configuration Because there are only really three variables that determine where this line actually is which are the weights from these three neurons Into the neuron that has now been bent and so by enumerating all of the signs in the previous layer We can check for a valid solution with an efficient number of queries even if we have to do exponential compute Okay, so the question now is then how do we actually do this hyperplane following algorithm? And that again is fairly simple from an ideas perspective, but in practice has lots of implementation problems So the way we do this is at some point in time We're going to have a point on the hyperplane And what we need to do is we need to figure out how to follow this point To make sure we stay on the same hyperplane and don't accidentally go somewhere else So let's suppose that we had this point here And we follow it along and following along is fairly easy We just make sure we move Not sort of dot product zero with the normal Now we're at this point. That's a multiple intersection point We need to figure what to do and ideally we want to make sure that we move in sort of the correct direction What we want to make sure we don't do is when we get from here to this multiple intersection point We want to make sure that we don't end up and Accidentally go along a first layer hyperplane or back where we came from Fortunately, both of those are relatively easy to prevent because we know where all of the first lane layer hyperplanes are and so we Can just not travel on those and we know which direction we just came from so our process of elimination We can make sure we travel in the correct direction Then We have all of the weights and the signs recovered from the first layer And so we can just peel off the first layer and completely rerun our attack exactly as before Starting from the second layer working on Now there are actually a couple more details, of course that I'm not going to be able to get into In particular the two most important of these is that in practice We have bounded floating point precision and the GPUs like to do all sorts of things that mess with us and so all of our algorithms have to be numerically stable and in general When extracting deep layers not all of the hidden states are completely accessible for example I can't feed a negative number Into a neuron on the second layer because all neurons on the first layer have values And so this is just not possible and this complicates our attack somewhat for inner layers to extract a deep So extract deep inner layers of the neural network Okay, so to briefly summarize our results then Here's sort of the main table from our paper. We're on the left. We have the architecture This is the number of neurons in each layer This is the number of parameters the total number of weights in the neural network And then what we have here are the number of queries We need to make of the model and then various ways of measuring how well we extracted it where lower numbers are better So if you compare it to prior work that was able to do extraction for one layer neural networks Our paper requires roughly twice as many queries But has the benefit that it's maybe two to the 30th times more precise Which in particular means that the worst case error between our local copy and the remote model is at most two to the minus 30th in most settings In the case when we compared to prior work who was able to do deep extraction of neural networks with two or more layers Not only are we now much more query efficient again? We can extract models that are much more precise in how we extract them to briefly conclude There are a couple conclusions. I think are important the first of these is To say that this direct analysis of neural networks is a really Useful way of thinking about machine learning. We don't need to care about the atom optimizer Or if we're using RMS prop or exactly why batch normalization does or does not work We just need to know that they're mathematical functions and we can analyze them directly The second consequence of our paper is that the field of secure inference maybe isn't so secure So it's secure inference is a field that takes together secure multi-party computation into neural network evaluation In order to evaluate f of x when f is held by one party x is held by the other And they don't want to reveal their inputs to each other As a result of our attack it means that revealing the value of f of x is as good as Revealing the function of f if given enough queries And so the field of secure inference is going to have to take into our tax into account in order to design Mechanisms to prevent these kinds of attacks so that people can't just query a model even in this NPC Setting and still learn the parameters More broadly there's a talk by Matthew who's the intern who who was with us at Google when we did this doing this work Called don't put neural networks in your ideal functionalities and the basic idea behind this is to say that We in crypto like to think of maybe AES as if it was some perfect block cipher And broadly speaking it is and we can do that but neural networks Don't really fit well into any ideal environment and are incredibly leaky abstractions And so for the time being it really is not advisable to try and idealize neural networks in any reasonable way So with that on Friday, we're going to have a live Q&A at 8 a.m. Pacific If you're watching this after the fact in a non-pandemic world I'd be happy to take any questions over email and the code to reproduce some our experiments on our paper is available online Thank you very much, and I'd be happy to take questions in one of these two formats


Good morning and welcome to this week's edition of Encompass Live. I am your host, Krista Burns, here at the Nebraska Library Commission. Encompass Live is the Commission's weekly online event where we cover anything that may be of interest to librarians across the state and across the country. We do these sessions live every Wednesday morning at 10 a.m. Central Time and they are recorded so if you're unable to join us on Wednesday mornings you can always watch any of the recordings you have on the website. We cover all sorts of different things. We do training sessions, interviews, book talks, whatever presentations, anything we think about, think of. If it's related to libraries, that's really the only criteria we'll put it on the show. And we have people from outside community, we have guest speakers, we also have commission staff to presentations and that's what we have today. Then we have Michael, Sally, and Laura here and I'm gonna let you guys do your own introductions and whatnot. They're gonna show us how to do video book talks and put them up on our website and all sorts of fun things. So I'll just hand it over to you guys and you can introduce yourselves if you want to say who you are and what you're doing and you guys have a thing to prepare for anything. We introduce this direction because Laura's gonna kind of pick it up with the beginning. So I'm Michael Sowers on the Technology Innovation Library and here at the Nebraska Library Commission and as part of this show I'll be kind of picking up the last portion and doing the kind of the technical aspects of creating the video and editing the video. I'm Sally Snyder, I'm the Children and Adult Library Services Coordinator and I'll be talking about how to write book talks. And I'm Laura Johnson and I'm here because this is my big bad idea. We had a really good time this summer when we did our tech rodeo at Dome College and one of the things we did there was to make videos and we kind of wanted to keep the momentum going. We think that this is something that could be very useful for people. It's something you can put on your website, it's something you could do with your patrons, with your city officials, with your teens. And so we just thought you know this might be fun and it's a fun. It's a fun thing to do. So first I think Sally's gonna talk about how to do book talks and then we're gonna talk about a few tips about doing a video and then we're actually going to show you. We are in real time going to create this video. So bear with us because who knows what will happen. Sally take it away. That is exciting. It'll be wonderful, even if it's a disaster. I wouldn't go perfect. Well first off I'd like to say that book talks are different from book reviews. Book reviews are designed to evaluate a book and let people know what are the positives and negatives about that book that they may want to purchase for their library or for their home. Book talks are designed to entice someone to want to read the book. So while if you're giving a book review you might give away a major plot point because you feel it's important to let people know that. In a book talk, you definitely do not want to give anything like that away. Joni Bodard who's a well-known name in the field, she has some unbreakable rules for book talking. First off she says don't tell the end of the story. So don't do that. Second don't talk about a book that you have not read. Now there are some caveats about that. You can get away with that if you're careful but really it's better to have read the book. And she says only talk about books that you personally love because that comes through the book talk. And if you just are maybe over about the book you're not going to have that same energy level that you will if it's a book you love and you're trying to convince people to give it a try. So how do you write a book talk? Well first off I would say to write your main points ahead of time. Write it down and use bullet points because you don't want to be reading from a piece of paper like this and even though I do that for my book reviews it's not good. You're not really having a conversation with people and that's what you want to do. This is like if someone came in the library and said well that's good what should I be looking at and you pull some books off the shelf and you tell them a little bit about it. You are doing book talks right then. Okay so that's not as comfortable maybe sometimes because you can't quite remember is a carry well for kids they want to know it's a character 8 or 12 that's important for kids. For adults you know not the same thing. So you can talk in first person or third person most of the time people do book talks in third person because too much first person is kind of pretentious so use it sparingly. If you're going to do several book talks to put up on your website then think of that about that but really it comes down to what you're comfortable with and what works for the book you're talking about and sometimes first person will be perfect other times about this just isn't working. For each book you need to think about the hook what is that big thing that you're going to leave the person with that makes them really want to take a look at that book. So find that figure that out first and it's usually pretty obvious so you don't have to dig deeply probably and if you do choose a different book would be my recommendation. So find your hook and jot that down and then start thinking about okay what are the other things that I need to tell people about this book to give them a framework for this hook so it might be something like the main characters of 15 year old boy or it might be that the setting is the near future if that's important to the story tell them a few things about the story jot them down rearrange them work through them and then when you have that written down set it aside and go do something else come back later look at it again because I always put too much information down because I like this little quirky thing and that little quirky thing and I want to tell everybody all about it well no that's too much pick one quirky thing at the most if that's really important to you but but find those things that are key to conveying what the books about then you're going to want to practice so practice looking in the mirror practice sitting at your desk practice with a friend any of those to get comfortable you need to be comfortable and if you've never done book talking before it'll take a little bit of practice I would also recommend practice writing book talks and practice giving the book talks let's do a few you know or five so that you're more comfortable with the whole process and then start to record some of your book talks and you might use some books that as it turns out just aren't the right choices and that's okay because while you might like the book and think it's fun if it's not the right one for you to talk about let it go pick a different book because I'm sure there's plenty of books that you have really enjoyed we also want to talk about how long should the book talk be and that again is up to you and the book you're talking about so I'm throwing all this back on you I know but it really does depend on you what you're comfortable with and how complicated the book is you can talk about a complicated book but you have to pick those particular items to talk about that will convey the most information that you want to give people to give them a sense of the book so that's again practice and think about it write it down put it down go away come back those are the main points I wanted to make so well what we're gonna do is yeah we're gonna talk about video but I do want to start out by saying that at this point we're using book talks is kind of to to to frame this but this is also about video creation so a lot of what Laura's gonna talk about now and then what I'll do afterwards is actually going to apply kind of regardless whether you're doing a book talk video or a review or just that it's something of an event at the library yeah we just wanted to give you a couple tips that these things help make your videos a little bit better if you've never done a video before and I think the first thing is though jump in and try it because it's all digital if it's rotten you can just forget dump the file it doesn't take that long it's just like all those bad camera pictures on your digital camera yeah so you know just go ahead and try it out but don't give up if it's bad don't give up keep practicing but then you know then the next thing we say is well you might want to plan it just a tiny bit which is to say you know if you have someone who's gonna make the video of you doing the book talk perhaps you want to have discussed how you're gonna hold up the book and what's gonna happen just so you all kind of know one of the really important things is the lighting which you can see from us we have terrible lighting here I feel like I'm kind of in the witness protection program because you can hardly see me so what you really want if you can manage it is to have you want the light to be shining on the book talker's face the worst thing you can do is have the light behind that person he really will look like this witness protection at that point so you want light shining on his face and if you can you want it slightly above his face and a 45 degree angle coming in and then you want another light at another angle so that it sort of takes the shadows out from the first one if that makes any sense anyway you kind of want to light sources and they say don't mix up your kinds of light so don't have fluorescent and incandescent one or the other this is what this is what everybody says try to have a plain background when when something behind you it might sound like a really good idea to stand in front of a bookshelf when you're doing this because people will be wanting to read the signs of the books behind you I do that yeah so I have that book and I have that book and I have that book and I've read that one yeah so you really something really playing behind you if you can and you want to kind of be playing this is not the time to wear something with flowers or a big print oh big really important thing that I think Michael will probably talk about is you do want to use a tripod or something else that will hold the camera steady there's nothing that's going to make you look more amateurish than having a bouncy a bouncy video so you do want a tripod they say until you get good at this do not zoom or pan your camera will have those capabilities because all the cameras do that now in fact your phone probably doesn't but don't do it they say that doesn't that doesn't look good um record extra at the beginning in the end in other words turn your camera on and get a few frames before the person starts talking and when the person's done leave the camera on for you know 10 15 more seconds this gives you a little bit of leeway when you're editing frame things very tight which means you want to get pretty close to the person's head don't cut off their head yeah you know you want it you want to have some room above his head but at the same time you don't want to really be able to see the person's features and oh what's the other thing oh composing the shot if you think about what's going to be on your screen as a you know kind of a square and then you put a grid on it like a tic-tac-toe grid you want the person's head yeah to be at the cross of the tic-tac-toe so he's not right in the middle he's slightly to one side but it's going it's just going to look better they say so those are some of the things that will kind of help you out just think about a few of those things yep when you're making a video for those of you who want to do more or find out maybe a little more detail lighting just google search video lighting oh just find out yeah the other one would be the grid that war was just talking about it's called the rule of thirds so if you google rule of thirds photography video things like that you'll be able to pull that up and in any level of minimal detail to hold books on just that topic so that's available and so as Laura said and so I'll rephrase as as do as we say not as we do yeah because ultimately all these suggestions are wonderful suggestions but then you still got to work with what you've got yes so yeah so we've got this room and as you can see my head is kind of in these windows back here and there's not much of a flat plane wall in the room in fact we just took over here we're gonna record Sally in just a moment and we actually took something off the wall which you can't see from from the what you're looking at right now but you'll see in the video we create because it was a framed painting wonderful painting but the problem is the glass was causing reflections of the light from the ceiling and that just would have caused weird spots in the video in our video so you've still got to work with what you've got to work with so we're going to do the best we can here so what I've got is a couple of things one is we have a flip cam here so little hd video camera they don't make these anymore but you can get similar from other companies I was just kind of shopping on behalf of somebody for about 120 bucks also check with TechSoup for deals for for libraries the system systems have purchased flip cans and they have them ready for you tomorrow right so if you're in Nebraska and you want to borrow one to play with it call your system administrator I have attached mine to a little video tripod so let's see here just a little tiny tripod yeah there we go if I hold it in front of my shirt it's a little more viewable there so that's just going to add our stability so we can set it there and I can point it at selling and the tripod was like 14 yeah 14 something like that 14 dollars and actually most of these video cameras are the the tripod attachment that this where you screw the tripod in is standard so we've got a hundred dollar tripod on our big camera there we could actually attach this little dinky camera to the 18 pound super steel tripod if we wanted um yeah it's it's it's pretty much a standard now the other thing and maybe you can see here from where the camera is is at this height and Sally's at this height okay and so we could you know shoot up at Sally if we wanted to but as we were practicing yesterday uh Sally was not thrilled with that idea so I got one more prop this is the super high tech stack of books you probably got one of these lying around in your library somewhere yeah and so we just kind of set that up there and now as you can see our excuse me as I fall off my chair our height's a little better off so what we're going to do here improvisation is yeah I mean you know we've we've done this we've we've used the stack of books many a time in this room for various things um so I'm going to go ahead and turn this on and Sally has got a book talk prepared for us so I'm going to get this on and I'm going to frame with Sally and we're going to have Laura just kind of move out of my frame here and I'm going to get this set up about there because I know where Sally's going to hold the book and so I'm going to hit record she's going to wait a couple of seconds and then she's going to give her book talk and then when we're all done I'll kind of take it from there with the software involved so we're hitting record now ungifted by Gordon Corman Donovan is well known for playing pranks in the school as a matter of fact he has zero impulse control and a couple of friends usually are encouraging him to do things but it was a complete accident the day that he and we have to cut for a second um we have a slight problem the battery just died on her camera oh that is a slight problem um shoot we thought of everything else we did um so let me see here this is a kind with double a so they're not rechargeable um so um what are we gonna do here really quick I I will go get some or Chris did you want to go get some we can talk about things yeah um to uh Diane has them so we've already uh lesson number one make sure all of your equipment is fully charged and ready to be used because that is probably the one thing I didn't actually get it yesterday so i'm going to take complete and full responsibility for this one um so um what can we talk about if you have questions you can take them into the questions area and we'll happily do this uh Laura why don't you talk a little bit more about what we were doing at the rodeo and and and how we we started this up how did that go um okay um our tech rodeo this summer we brought a group of people together many of them were scholarship students from the um the IMLS grant scholarships that we have um and we tried to do a couple of um technology things doing videos was one of them um we had we put people who were in groups of five or six um they'd never seen these cameras before they had really less than less than 48 hours yeah and they came up with finished videos um they took the video they edited the video and we showed the videos they were a hoot they are on you they are on youtube if you'd like to see them um and one of the big points of this really was that just getting in there and doing it sometimes will teach you as much about it sure there are things you can learn there are tips that help make it easier there's uh you might want to read about it but you know it's not something to be scared of this is very low risk the worst thing that's going to happen is that you're going to get a really bad video and then you know try again your next one will be better yep so um our tech rodeo we uh we did some we did some work on live presentation we did some work on screen capture and we did some work on video um we hoped that everybody everybody seemed to be having a good time and i think they were very polite people um all right so but i think we did make the point that you just have to try it um i'll also throw in as as i was kind of shuffling around there for things um chances are if you have a smartphone yeah you have a video camera these days fully high definition um i i for half a second thought i'll just immediately switch to my phone and record the video but i don't have the right cable to get the video off of the phone in the room or even in my office so that's why i ended up saying let's just go find some batteries have that yourself there's an option for you yes i want to try this out and don't even want to go and buy a camera yet just do a little experiment with your phone right yeah and i'm going to have Sally before you start again hold up the book again to make sure it's in okay that'll be perfect all right so we're going to hit record and we'll do a take two ungifted by Gordon Corman Donovan is well known for playing pranks around the school he has zero impulse control and actually he's also encouraged by a couple of friends but it was a complete accident the evening that he destroyed the high the middle school uh see that i went okay is this a flume yes this would be a flume okay so i need to start back it was a complete accident okay while we're messing around it was a complete accident the evening that he destroyed the front of the junior high school gym and interrupted the big important basketball game he's called into the superintendent's office immediately and the superintendent writes out his name in his school and then is called away for another emergency Donovan is off the hook just briefly he knows it's going to come anytime imagine his surprise when a letter arrives at his home and his family is informed that he has been selected to attend the academy of scholastic distinction Donovan knows that he is not gifted he barely passes his class at the junior high so he knows he has no chance at the academy however the superintendent will never think to look for him there I'm gifted by Gordon Corman all right great okay so um as you could as you were watching me there I was kind of keeping an eye there's a little LCD screen on the back of this so I was kind of making sure she stayed in shot she did that I didn't do any zooming or panning that's you know it's the total width with the flubs in the backup was about a minute and 46 seconds so we got under our two minutes and you may have noticed I was writing something down if you do have flubs you can edit them out and we're gonna I'm gonna do my best to do that so what I did was I kind of wrote down a little piece of paper about where that happened so I know in the video where I'm gonna have to get to now one thing you want to think about in this case it was only about 20 seconds in probably we could have just started over and just edited the whole thing out but we want to show you what what editing is like just a little bit here so I'm gonna disconnect it from my tripod and we're gonna kind of switch the view here as to what's going on so give us just a sec to share our whole desktop and what I'm going to do here is I'm just this USB cable in the flip cam so I'm just going to go ahead and plug that in to our USB cable and what should come up momentarily is the flip cam software now how you get the video off of your device is going to vary based on your device some devices will be a USB connection and it is now acting like a flash drive some will have their own software that will then take over as as flipshare is loading up here if I was doing this on my phone I would probably also connect to USB cable or if I actually you can ignore these error messages with our software if I was doing this with my phone I could take the micro SD card out of the device and pull it in and plug it into my computer I connected via USB cable etc now in this case you can see I just noticing there are actually three videos on this camera this is the one that we did yesterday just a little task we won't be showing that thank you this is the one we started that is really really short 14 seconds because that's when our battery ran out so we're not going to get that one off here and here this one's is a minute 26 so this is the video we want and I'm going to go ahead and save this one to my computer and it says it's going to put it on the in a particular folder and do I want to erase it off the camera for now we're just going to leave everything there we really just want it off the camera and on to the computer so you look in the bottom left here it's doing our transfer we should only take a couple of seconds more things you want to keep in mind the longer the video the longer everything's going to take now there's going to be a couple stages one stage is getting it off the camera itself so you know minute 26 video looks like it took about 30 seconds here to do that all right so we're going ahead and we are done with this program so I'm going to go ahead and close that up and we're also going to minimize this video here and then we're going to switch over to our video editing software and in this case our video editing software is Windows Live Movie Maker this is a free program for anybody using Windows the other option would be um oh shoot what's the Mac program I just liked iMovie it would be the the the program that comes with the Mac so what I'm going to do here is I want to import a video and so I am going to actually just a second here I'm going to go into my documents folder and I want to go into my videos folder I've I've basically figured out ahead of time where I put that video I copied over there so there are videos and here's my video okay I'm going to go ahead and drag that right over into my video editing program and it's going to pull that in and basically what I've got here is kind of a film strip now that I can use to work with and you'll notice that imported very quickly if you have a much bigger video it may take a few minutes when we record super high definition video off of the big camera that we use in this room it can pull that in and then it could take you know 20 minutes to kind of make the video editable and then so keep in mind we're keeping it short here and everything's going to run hopefully pretty darn quickly okay there's several things I can do with this video here and one of the things I definitely want to keep in mind is about 15 to 20 seconds in Sally Sally had a little bit of a flub so what I'm going to do just to start is go ahead and kind of find that point and because I know was so short into the video I'm just going to hit play and kind of get to that point here okay so what we're going to do here is we're going to pay attention a little bit and we're going to figure out where Sally kind of uh wanted to back up too okay so okay okay so I'm going to back this up just a little bit I'm going to find that point just before she starts up again okay and what I'm going to do here is I'm going to do what's called a split okay so what I've done now is I've got everything up until that point and then the rest of the video okay and so she's going to start with it was a complete accident okay so now what we need to do is start finding where it was a complete accident was said the first time okay so I'm going to pause it there I'm going to split again so what we've got now is the beginning up to the end of that one sentence we've got that flubbed area and then we've got where she picked back up again so what I'm going to actually do is I'm now going to delete that bit out of the middle wait that's all it took that's all it took okay I'm also going to save my work as we're going on here because let's call it my movie yes we'll replace that so you know program crashes the machine starts smoking whatever you know we can we can get up actually if the machine starts smoking we might have a bigger problem but anyway okay now what's going to happen here is a couple of things I've now got a cut in here and if I play it back we want to see kind of how well that works so let's let's see what happens if I if I don't do anything that's not bad she jumps a little bit I think you know but what we can do if we want in between there is we can add an animation and kind of change how it goes from one to the other and in this case we've got lots of options and think of let's try this one see what happens here so let's play that back again he has zero impulse control and actually he's also encouraged by it was a complete accident the evening that he destroyed I don't know if I'm liking it kind of mediocre yeah kind of mediocre let's try one more just for fun and then decide if we want to keep that or or go through he has zero impulse control and actually he's also encouraged by it was a complete accident the evening that he destroyed maybe a little better but you know what let's let's just go ahead and not do any at all it was a complete out we'll just do a jump cut okay all right all right so now what we're going to do is we need to add some stuff to the beginning and to the end we want to have a little bit of it at titles and we want to have some credits so I'm going to put my cursor here at the beginning of the video and I'm going to go back home and find a little button here that is at a title and it says okay so we're going to go uh I'm going to pull over the here ungifted by Gordon Corman type picking keyboard uh oh what's happening to my keyboard no keyboard is on and turn it off and turn it back on again we're just having a grand old time today are we little things happen don't they well I like Gordon um there we go I don't know and a wireless keyboard had to reset it there uh a book talk Sally Snyder of the Nebraska library commission okay that looks good and then you know do we want it to let's let's have it you know we can do it star wars style maybe star wars styles in here somewhere let's just let's just do a regular old scroll so if we play this um you know it's just scrolling up but I I believe there is a kind of scroll into the distance sort of star wars style okay now definitely what we want though between the credits and Sally's speaking here is one of those animations so let's go ahead and we get all sorts of styles here let's let's let's bring her in with pixels that looks fun okay so we'll play this back again I'm gifted by Gordon okay and does that come in through Kristen for her okay now I'm gonna jump to the end of my video and go back home here and add some credits and so um presented by Sally Snyder did the everybody some credit here and again how to how do we want those credits to scroll here and I'm gonna let's let's pick this oh I like this one okay and you know we we can also do things like make the text bigger and all sorts of things really let your creativity oh yeah this this this can go nuts here so let's go ahead and watch our end oh and we want it we want to also put a transition into our credits so let's go back to our animations and since we pixelated in the one way let's go ahead and pixelate out again to keep some consistency going on there so we go ahead and click play and then we've got our credits and I am just barely touching on the things that this program will do but you kind of get the idea of what's going on you can add text over the video so if you want to provide information about the book kind of at the bottom of the screen if you want to make everything back in white or see be atoned or there's all sorts of stuff you can do built in here especially under visual effects where you can change the look of the video and things can you for instance um import say the logo of the library yes um you can add if I go back home here there's this snapshot so if you have a graphic a static graphic you can insert that into your video and and say I want it to play for five seconds after the credits but before Sally started speaking something like that or at the end or things like that so yeah well that's just I think that's something that they want to do we do want to remember that we were editing probably the rest is more yes well and for example you might want to put in a the logo of the library at the beginning yeah fade into Sally when Sally's all done fade out to just a static image of the book yes and then fade into the credits you know there's lots of things you can do here we're kind of not doing some of this stuff in interest of time basically at this point okay so a lot of fun oh yeah all right so i've saved my work now that what i have to do though is what i've done is i've saved a project in this program i now actually have to take the results of all the editing i've done it save it as an actual a video file right so that's where over here it's a save movie now you've got all sorts of options as to how large and what aspect ratio and all these other things we're going to keep it nice and simple and i'm just going to do recommended for this project right and i'm going to go ahead and save that uh in my videos folder so i need to go to documents sorry actually i'm just going to save it on the desktop and we're going to call it ungifted book talk and we're going to save that now here is another instance where how big your video file is how long your video file is um whether it's hd or standard definition that sort of thing this is going to take longer so kind of get the impression here about how long this our video is one minute and 17 seconds long and it's going to export out it's going to take about a minute to save that video file if we were to record a live speaker on our large video camera at full high definition this can literally take you know if it's a one hour talk it can literally take two hours to do this step right here yeah now you can continue working on your computer it's not going to take up the whole thing but i generally try to set this and walk away because the more processing power the computer has to do it the faster it will do it um also the more powerful your computer so you want you know if you're going to do video editing you probably don't want one of the computers that you let the public use you may want to actually you know one of the staff machines one of the more high powerful power powered machines you're going to do a lot of heavy video editing you might want to buy an actual computer just to do this it's not required i'm just saying the further you get into this you start buying equipment specifically for it okay but you can do fine yes yes this is not a top of the line machine we're working on right now you know and we're broadcasting live while we're doing it so i mean this is we're we're taxing this machine pretty well and it's handling it just fine okay so uh we can now play our video back uh or we can open our folder i'm gonna go ahead and click uh open folder here just to have it available and it is on my desktop and there it is it is a windows media uh video file and let's just go ahead and play this back and make sure it kind of looks okay you you prepared for this sally you're ready okay whatever it is i'll i'll be okay i'm gonna shrink this down just a bit to make it a little easier for everybody to see unmitted by gordon cormin gordon is a problem for playing out of school he has zero impulse control and actually he's also encouraged by a couple of friends it was a complete accident the evening that he destroyed the fact of the junior high school gym and interrupted the big important basketball game he's called into the superintendent's office immediately and the superintendent writes down his name in his school and then is called away for another emergency donovan is off the hook just crazy he knows it's going to come anytime imagine his supplies when a letter arrives at his home and his family is informed that he has been selected to attend the academy of scholastic distinction donovan knows that he is not gifted he barely passes his class at the junior high so he knows he has no chance at the academy however the superintendent will never think to look for himself i'm gifted by gordon all right now see and and i'm already critiquing myself on this um well you know just just real real quick let's let me just point out one or two things here uh so we can do just pause on this uh well let's let's pause with sales eyes open there you go um it's a little dark but like here's the two hooks on the wall where we took the the framed artwork down i didn't even see right um and then over here you notice we have this this kind of beige colored wall and then we have this great thing on the wall over here so again like we said we're working with what we got yeah and so this is not bad oh this could be way worse but i'm just looking at the stuff kind of in in the background or whatever um to do that so these are just things you think about you know but hey this good video all right well and we want to mention that sally held up the book and did not uh obscure the title or author's game yes very careful about the way she held up the book might want to think about that yeah yeah don't hold your hand over the title and the author which would be easy to do right all right so next step okay let me close some of my programs here and um do this all right so next step is we're going to upload this to youtube so for everybody to see why not so all right sally's excited okay so we're in our youtube account we have already logged in as you can see her account name is nebraska access so for those who haven't done this before this is a very straightforward process we're gonna go ahead and click upload and depending on your account you may be limited to 15 minute videos our account is not to be honest we're not sure why uh they just keep telling us congratulations your account is now enabled for upload longer 15 minutes all right book talk though if you're doing a 15 minute book talk it's probably hopefully you're covering a lot of books all right so we're gonna select files from our computer and i'm going to go ahead and scroll down to our ungifted book talk click open and notice that uploaded almost instantaneously now very short way a it's one minute and 17 second video b we have a very fast connection here in the building so that's really what what what kind of happened there and so it is still however processing it but it says now processing your video it will be live at this url but there's a couple things you want to consider here for example what do you want to title it well by default it's titling it the same as the file name but we don't need that dot w m v on the end so we're gonna go ahead and do that um in a description sally snider of the nebraska library commission talks about i'll fix that spelling error in a minute ungifted by gordon foreman ungifted is a word commission however is misspelled so we'll do that and corvin is correct uh tags book talk books uh nlc ya you know whatever tags you want to add to that i'm gonna go ahead and choose a category and you can see things are happening kind of as i'm doing this the thumbnail has been picked i think that's a great thumbnail um but you can choose those well we'll put this under education we're gonna go ahead and make this public and we're gonna get a creative comments license real quick public means anybody can find it and view it unlisted means anybody can view it but they have to know what the url is of the video okay um if you search for it you won't find it you have to know it's there and then private means only uh as as we're the people who uploaded it i have to provide a list of email addresses of youtube account holders who are allowed to see it okay so you can you can say you know create videos and share them just with your family for example this case public is is definitely our option there okay uh and so i can pick different thumbnails here i kind of like this thumbnail actually we're sadly a little tippy overhead and and do that so we're going to go ahead and set that and then we've saved everything and it gives us this little url right here so if we click on that we will actually see our video has been uploaded and is now available on youtube right now one more stage okay because the library commission has a website we have a blog uh so what we want to do is we actually want to post this video on our website we're going to do it on our blog now at this point how you do it for your library is going to vary okay we use wordpress to run our blog so we're going to be showing you wordpress but there are some consistent things that will pretty much apply regardless of how you do this so i'm going to go ahead and open up our commission blog website here and it's nlc blog and i'm going to log into it to actually create a new blog post yeah as far as we know we're in less sally really really asked nicely uh no it's a good example no yeah i know we're going to leave it up yeah this is all going live yeah this is a good example but i was going to include it in um as some of you may know when we do recordings of our income slideshows we include links to anything mentioned yes i've already added interglacious account text for libraries url and has been to add this link as well so you have to see a video example of one that's been done um here before all right so i'm going to go ahead and create a new post on our blog and here we go and now we're going to call it uh ungifted unfitted that would be a different book okay and now what i have to do here and this is probably the part that's going to be consistent almost regardless of how you do this i'm going to go back to the video i on youtube i'm going to right click and i'm going to select your copy embed html copy that i'm going to make sure i'm on the html editing portion and then i'm going to go ahead and select paste and what this is going to do is this is basically written the code for me all right uh so we're going to select our category here which let's say youth services and there's also our books and reading and i'm going to go ahead and click publish give that a couple of seconds to work and now if i actually view the post on our live website there is our video with sally's lovely looks right there on the screen so what we've done here is we've talked about what is a book talk what's important some basic tips on video we actually recorded a book talk flubs and all yes we edited our book talk we added some titles and some credits and ended the the editing of the flub in the middle we have then saved that as our newly created video we uploaded it to youtube so anybody can now watch it and find it on youtube and then we've taken that youtube video and we've embedded it in our website in our blog in this case so think about how this could dress up your website or your your your blog if you did this and we've been going for 50 minutes here this hasn't even taken an hour to do all of this including getting new batteries yes so this wasn't this wasn't hard it was kind of fun you had fun didn't you i had fun oh good and i would like to encourage you to ask your teams if they would like to do some video book talks because i bet they'll run with that i bet they will but your mayor may also yes it's 50 great and this again is something that you could do with the bestsellers with new books in your library you know you you could do this regularly every week or every month decide that you were going to have book talks i i think this is something that would really enhance your library practice um just want to throw in a couple of their examples here specifically to book talks this is reading rooster recommends from the south carolina state library and and i believe she does one about one a week um i do not actually know the genesis of the whole rooster part of it um i i will leave that to you to kind of figure out what what the story is there uh and um basically they're doing exactly what we just did is walk off the camera talk about some books they have a prop they have the rooster um they edit it save it publish it to you too and then embed it in their website so i mean that's this this is not hard now you want to go a little further um i'm going to pull up one here called library you this is from the escondido public library and i just heard a presentation from them at internet library yeah they're actually creating videos these are not book talks but they're videos done with members of the public now uh the first one was with the uh uh uh someone from the genealogical society uh that i believe meets in the library uh they have done other ones uh grief management through artistic expression lessons we can learn from bees as far as i know he's a local beekeeper and so he wanted to do a presentation uh there's cooking ones there's a color therapy uh with a color therapist and here's here's how to make optimist crime on balloons so we have a balloon artist in town now and and here's uh introduction to natural cleaning in some of these cases these people do all local businesses yes and they're not really advertising their business per se it's kind of like pbs sponsorship you know they're doing a little video they're allowed to mention their um they're that they have a business but they're really to teach you how to do something in the library does this filming and sometimes it's at the library sometimes it's out in the field that i know there's at least one gardener one but then they've also um there's a holocaust survivor uh video that they have somebody who lives there locally and they've they've become popular enough that people are coming in and saying can i do a video that's neat and it's called library you so kind of this would be like the next stage beyond what we're doing here you know staff doing a book talk maybe the teens or your members of the public doing a book talk this is now members of the public doing other things that they usually do but tying the library back into it um so there's lots of ideas of what you can do with video uh that that doesn't necessarily take a lot of time or a lot of effort no and um you'll be fun and is a reason for people to come to your website yes um and that's really you know kind of what you're doing here is trying to um offer people a service that they like to the point where they keep coming back for more so it doesn't have to be complicated um it doesn't have to take a lot of time i know that some of the ins and outs of oh this software and now we're going to move it over here might have been a little confusing you know if you really want to do this uh just give us a call yeah and we'll be happy to kind of run through it with you um and if you do do this would you let us know yeah we would really love to see this on your website and we would really love to know that you did it so let us know and oh we hope you have fun yeah i want to stress one more thing too i've been doing this for a couple of years i am by no means a video editing expert i i kind of know enough to get it done um but i know we have some things coming up where we're actually considering setting up two cameras and then editing content from two cameras into a single piece of video so that one camera is facing the speaker one camera is facing the audience so instead of what somebody asked a question we pan over to the audience and then pan back to the speaker we actually just insert the content from the other camera and i'm both looking forward to doing that and scare it out of my gourd uh as to how much time it's going to take because that's going to that's going to be an extra level of skill that i will be learning by doing and i i hope it turns out well we'll we'll find out that's in december isn't it yeah yeah that's next month actually you know the best projects are the ones where you're scared out of your gourd yes oh yeah no i'll i'll i'll get into it but i'm gonna be i'm gonna be setting aside some time to be doing that editing i mean that's but i know i know people in libraries who are very busy um i still think that this is something they can do without a huge investment of time there's as you saw our equipment um the flip cam you can borrow it um the software is a free download so not expensive not time consuming um i think you're going to get a lot of bang for your buck on this one i really do and well we have a suggestion from someone in the audience um ellie um riesig who's from actually a moral public library here in avrespa said that first for a suggestion she has for the background is to throw a piece of fabric over a portable projector screen so you have something behind you you know fabric so you can either use the screen itself or if you want some sort of a color instead of just plain white it's a solid color of some sort um you can just throw that over and that's your flat you know your background behind you yeah i i keep threatening to bring in a sheet to cover the windows behind us uh and you know just tack it to the ceiling and just let it drape um that's great um some libraries have gone as far to actually paint a wall that green color for doing green screen that's not something we've we've done here yeah but um yeah so there's all sorts of possibilities you can get into that's a great suggestion very simple things that you probably have laying around so cool all right uh anything else from the audience if anybody has any questions comments suggestions type them into the question section of your um interface and we can answer them here that's the one that came through during the session but if anybody does have anything yeah now i gotta get sally to do this once a week oh she's laughing at me this this is not a good sign well yeah i i think what i suggested was uh when you do one a week one a month is video see and then it's still what sally's reading but one of them is a video and that's a good way to do it if this is something that you're like intimidated by out there and saying oh my gosh how are we gonna do this regularly don't think like if you do do a newsletter or a regular um blog post about what i'm reading i know some library directors do that is like just on their websites as well do this yeah once a month do the video or every other month say let's try and do a video one this time and see how it goes and then you just get used to it slowly you don't have to totally jump into it you know head first and say every week is kind of do something i'm feeling if you get the teens involved yeah yeah video then you know what to do it get the teens into it yeah but they're very creative and and they have a lot of energy and this is a great project for them yeah they have enthusiasm and technical knowledge more than me i know for sure but that's a great idea and and i like the idea of having the mayor come and do one too yeah i know a lot of libraries have used that um the read software the read posters and brought in your local officials to do supposed for a poster they could do this as well a local band just filmed a music video in our mayor's office really yes oh really yes i watched um i can't remember the name of the band but they and then he's on the drums at the end yeah so you know hey maybe you know talk to your mayor do want have him do one at his desk you know or in the library anyways okay i'm off to do anything else any last minute uh comments for you guys i'm good yeah i hope you had fun we had fun have fun yes and let us know we really want to hear about this yep um okay no last minute urgent earth shattering questions came in so i think we will wrap it up for today thank you michael sally and laura that was yeah a lot of fun and very cool to see all the actual of an in an hour from start sort of start to finish me had to think about what book you're gonna do ahead of time there's a little prep work ahead of time there but the actual doing of it and getting it out on the internet for people to watch it's done um so thank you very much for attending this week and i hope you'll join us next week when our topic is um 17 things to soak up can click on it um you know as many of you hopefully know we do here on Nebraska Learns 2.0 a 23 things type program where you learn some new service or tool every month and um this is uh Westside High School i know i remember it um did a version of it for their teachers so you can this is going to talk about kary's going to talk about how she um reworked it to do a thing specifically for teachers in the school um so not just for librarians so they can use the kind of program for anything so she's going to be on the show with us next week and if you are interested in following Encompass Live you can see right there at the top of the screen i know the change um you can click on that and we do have a facebook page there we go um that you can um follow just like the page and we post on there uh anything whenever we have uh sessions i got reminded this morning right before this session started join us right now for this session when the recordings are ready we post them up on here any new sessions to put up anything related to sessions so um definitely uh follow us on facebook if that is where you get your information from you can see what we're all doing there there we go okay it doesn't look like anything has come in yet so thank you very much for uh joining us this week and i hope you join us next time bye bye