All right, you're all set, George. Good morning. Seeing the presence of the quorum, I'm going to call this meeting of GOL to order. It is exactly 10.30 AM, and it is June 2. This meeting is being recorded. And let me just read the usual advisory pursuant to Governor Baker's March 12, 2020 order suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law. This meeting of GOL is being conducted by remote participation. I'm just going to take a moment and make sure that, first of all, committee members of president can be heard. And then I will check with our guests. We have a number of guests this morning to deal with the first two items of business. Mandy Jo. Present. Pat. Present. Darcy. Here. And Sarah. Present. Great. And I'm going to check with our guests. Heather, if you just say hello. Hello, Heather. Great. Thank you, Heather and Irv. OK, I saw the wave. You'll have to unmute at some point maybe, Irv, but we'll see. Oh, no. Oh, good. There you are. Thank you. And Michelle. Present. OK. And it looks like Kathleen Anderson. Kathleen, if you could just check in. Present, present, present. OK. Kathleen is definitely here. Kathleen, if you have your, it looks like you've joined twice, maybe with two different devices. If you have speakers on one of them, you just want to turn the speakers all the way down. I've already done that. Thank you. OK, great. Perfect. Sound great now. That's great. Thank you. All right, I'm going to put the agenda up on the screen. Just for a moment, we're going to begin with the charge, the American Heritage Reparation Coalition Committee charge. And then we'll turn to the resolution in support of HR 40 and Senate 40. But let's just put the agenda up on the screen. If I can find it, there it is. Bear with me for a second. OK. So as I said, we're going to begin with the charge and then turn to the resolution. And we'll put those up on the screen. Then we'll turn to Juneteenth proclamation. And we have, I think, the rest of the business is fairly straightforward. It's all committee business. We have selection guidance with DAB. And we have to declare the pool sufficient. We also do the same for FINCOM. And hopefully, we'll have time to get to item nine. We do have to make a decision about our GOL calendar. I did check out with a check in with everybody. Earlier in the week, and I didn't hear anyone say nay, but we need to agree that we're willing to meet on the 23rd, which would be a special meeting. And then my SOP to you all was to cancel the 30th. Pat. Yes, I wanted to make sure of the resolution, because you told the sixth graders to be here about 1115. That is correct. Thank you, Pat. That's actually under the 48 hour rule. I thought so, but I wanted to check. Thank you. You're welcome. And so at 1115. So for our guests, what we do, this committee, essentially, our mantra is clear, consistent, and actionable. We generally do not discuss the merits or demerits of any particular resolution proclamation or citation, though sometimes we do cross that line. But generally, we're concerned with simply making sure that it is clear, consistent, and actionable. And we send it on to the council. And there it is discussed in full and then voted on. So the hope is that these items that we're going to look at this morning. We'll go to the council at the very next meeting and be voted on by the full council. Here, our job is to be to recommend to the council. And that's what we're going to do. We ask sponsors to be present. They don't have to be, but we really appreciate them coming. Because as we go through it, we often have questions. And we want to make sure that if we make any changes or edits, that it is agreeable to the sponsors. And so that's why we've asked you to be here. So at any point, you may raise your hand if you have a question or concern. And we may ask you directly some questions.  My colleagues are also very good about noting if I'm missing somebody, letting me know. Because my eyes are usually glued on the text and the screen. So that's what we're going to do. So I'm going to put this away and put up. Let me see here. Let's go back for a second. I'll stop sharing for a second. This back where it came from. And so I'm going to start with the charge. And I'm going to share the screen. Whoops. Let's put you away too. So here is the committee charge. Mandy, my understanding is that you've already had a go at this. Is that correct that you? Am I correct in understanding this that you helped the sponsors put this in sort of the formats in right now? Yes, I helped them put it in this format. I did not deal with any sort of language per se. But that's the right legal references and everything. Good, good, good. So what I've asked my committee members to do, and hopefully they had a chance to do that, is look this over in advance. I'll look over all of the items, all four items we have this morning. And if they have any questions or concerns, normally go through it line by line. And that's what I'm going to start to do. But first, let me just see if there are any hands from the committee members. Any concerns? Mandy, Pat, Darcy, or Sarah. And I can't see everybody.  I'm not seeing any hands. I'm not seeing any. Mandy, please. I have questions. But when we get to it, I'll bring them up. OK. Let me, first of all, do something I need to do anyway. I'm going to put track changes on. OK. African Heritage Reparation Coalition, AHRC. This is an ad hoc town committee. And the legal reference is the Amherst Home Rule Charter Section 2.5. Be pointing authorities in town manager per Amherst Charter Section 3.3c. There are seven voting members. There are no non-voting members. It says one or two town counselors. Apparently that's going to be left that way, I guess, one or two. OK. Term of appointments, one year. Special Municipal Employee, yes. And the staff support will be provided either the town manager or it doesn't need a town manager. Any concerns about any of that? And the sponsors are OK with that language. That's exactly what they intend. Michelle, please. The only thing that we sort of realize later, and I'm not sure if it matters, but we have the Human Rights Commission, so the HRC piece. I don't know. Another counselor brought that to my attention, so I just thought I would mention it. You're talking about just the abbreviation, AHRC. Exactly. It's minor, maybe, but I wanted to bring it up. I wanted to bring it up, since someone did mention it to me. So we could change the coalition to a board or working group or something that would get rid of the C? Couldn't we just say coalition, the African Heritage Reparation? Oh, no, never mind. I'm not awake. I totally apologize. That's right. I don't see a problem, but others do. It is a different acronym, and it's quite distinctive. I don't know. How do people feel? Do they feel it? We could really fool with the language, put in working group or something else. But a coalition, I like that. Any thoughts? Michelle has a strong feeling about it, so I think we can leave it. We could change it to assembly instead of coalition, assembly, African American Heritage Assembly. Reparation Assembly, so AHRA. There you go. What did the sponsors think about that? Love it. Is that a yes or a no? I think that's a yes. OK, all right. I'm going to do that for the moment. And we can always come back and change it. So it would be AHRA, AHRA, OK? All right. Any other issues with the technical term? Name for this whole block? I've got a block. I don't know. OK, fine. Thank you. You see, I still have a lot to learn. OK. Composition, seven voting members, six black residents for whom are former or current appointed or elected officials in Amherst. And one representative of reparations for Amherst are for A. Any concerns there? Mandy. So this is one of the things I have a question on. But I was just looking up the community safety working group charge. My question was the fact that it, and I don't want this to imply that I don't support the majority of this committee, if not all of it being black residents, but being a government, I had a concern that can we actively pretty much say this committee can't have any white people on it or Asian people or anything like that. But I looked at the community safety working group charge that says no fewer than six of the nine voting members shall represent black indigenous people of color or other historically marginalized communities. And so while I still have those concerns, I have less of a concern because we've done it all, well, the manager has done it once, but it doesn't go to, I guess, the makeup more as to the, I guess, the actionability part of what we have to vote per se. Darcy. Yeah, I have another substantive comment which is I'm not, I don't have an issue with the six black residents, but I am just wondering about the four of whom are former or current appointed or elected officials. Why I, and so we don't have to discuss that here because we're not supposed to, but I do, I'm wondering why I can't just be six black residents. But like I said, we're only supposed to be looking at the white. So you don't see it as an issue of actionability, but rather you have an issue of just the sort of logic behind it and that's sort of a different question. I'm not clear on the rationale for that, but we don't have to discuss it here. So our referral allows us for this charge to discuss both, just say.   So you're really asking the sponsors for rationale. Yeah. So why four of whom are former or current appointed or elected officials? So if the sponsors wish to respond in there, it's your question. Yeah. Jump in and say that the rationale behind it is that these are people who have been their election, their selection by the community gives them credibility and kind of mandate from the community to serve in this capacity. That's the primary reasoning is that they've been through a process of being selected by the community at large. Well, no, these are people who are stuck town. They can just be town staff. They haven't been, they've been selected by the town manager. It says elected officials. It says elected officials. Right, yeah. So, but I guess I'm more interested in appointed because that's just means people who have been more on the town staff. But yeah, I'm just throwing it out there is. What I'm not clear about in this composition and I guess it's more the methodology, but who is the appointing authority of these seven voting members? Would it be the town council? Would it be the town manager through the town council? How will the seven actually be named to this body? The town manager. So the town manager under our charter has to appoint the seven. Yeah, so appointing authority is a town manager. The town council will have to confirm or approve those appointments. So they will still come through the council for that approval after he has appointed them. In that regards, if the language would be better as just open to six black residents or six African heritage residents, that would be fine. The, as far as the rationale goes, the process we're really trying to create ultimately, and I think this follows further down into the charge itself, is that is to develop a consultative process with the African heritage residents of the town, of Amherst. And they ultimately would be the entity, the group, the will, that would express support for whatever proposals would go forward to be funded by the fund that may emerge from this process. So the actual committee itself is merely a mechanism that would interface with the council and town government to develop the fund, to develop this process, but of itself, it is not the authoritative body that's going to say this is what reparations funding should be spent on or not. If they do, they would only be doing it as expressing the will of this consultative process. So really who is here among those seven voting members to try and develop reparations proposals is doesn't have to go with the language about current elected officials. We organized in that way in terms of reaching out to begin this process, this work of developing a consultative process with the African heritage community by going to those who had held town-wide elected office, not town appointments, not district level, elected positions, but town-wide elected positions. And we thought by getting the six of us who had held town-wide elected positions that it would be the closest to the model of Evanston, Illinois, which had a member on the council. We don't have a member on the council of African heritage. So we were trying to make the closest approximation to begin this process within the African heritage community. And so the idea came, let's go to those who have held town-wide office. And we found six, there were six African heritage people alive in Amherst who have held or currently hold town-wide elected office. And that's how this came about. But whether that language necessarily should persist in the composition I leave to you all, but that's the rationale. Yeah, I would only, I would remove the appointed part of that. So four of whom are former or current elected officials? Is what you're suggesting or? Yes. I'm just gonna strike it for the moment. I'll just add that I think the reason appointed was in there is because one of the six members or maybe two of the six members of the group that Dr. Shavas just spoke about had been, had gone through a process of appointment as opposed to being elected for some reason. That's what I remember hearing. I don't know if maybe that person wants to speak. I think it was at you, Hala. I'm not sure if that's true or not, but. Yes, I took over a seat. So I was technically appointed by the town council's vote, that I wasn't elected. We could potentially say former or current members of elected bodies. Townwide. Yeah, the town wise seems to be important. I'm kind of uncomfortable. Yep, go ahead, Pat. Because I feel like that pool, it was just shared that it's six people's, a very limited pool. And it seems to me, I totally support this committee, absolutely. And I totally understand that it would be all decisions about where reparations were going, what they would be made by residents of African heritage. No problem with that. But it feels like we're saying, okay, here are the people, here's this little special group of the African heritage community, and they're gonna be doing this. And it feels to me, the community is broader than the six of you who've been elected. Ben Harrington has been appointed, not elected. Is he not? And that's why I liked keeping appointed there, I think. Ben was elected. Ben was definitely elected. Oh, I stand corrected. Thank you, Elmucar. I have his side in my backyard. Oh, he's been elected to school committee. I'm thinking about human rights commission. That's why, yeah, but you're right. But it's still then an example, because if he weren't on school committee, he wouldn't be able to be part of this group. And it feels to me too constrained. That's my opinion. And it's up to the sponsors to make a decision here, not me. But remember now that there are seven voting members, six black. Yeah, but the majority is limited to former or current elected officials, which we agree is very limited pool. Oh, I have no problems with recognizing stipulating that it's a limited pool, that it is. And again, because of institutional racism, I understand that, but I'm still uncomfortable with it. I don't think it's broad enough for it for the. Yeah, I think the rationale, if I might just go a little further to say that it was really in order to bring forth people that for the sake of the council and the sake of town government, that these are individuals who would serve in this capacity who are very familiar, who are perhaps some of the more familiar with town government processes, but certainly out of the 2000 plus or more than a thousand African heritage people in Amherst over 18 years or older, you can certainly find more than this group. So I'm not wedded to the language, but I'm just providing the rationale. It was really to provide people that the council could work with and the council could have some sense in the manager, some sense that these were folks who understood certain things like open meeting law, certain things like how government, how town government works, that these would be people readily familiar with some of those processes, as opposed to just picking from that pool of more than a thousand adult residents of Amherst. I'm aware of, I have to go in a minute, but I would agree with you, Amilcar. The language is not necessarily something that we have to stick to. However, I believe that in the charge to the town manager, the town manager can be directed to give preference and selection to the committee to the six people who have been appointed or former appointed or elected officials. You can change all that language and leave it wide open, but underneath that, the town manager can be directed to give special preference to those particular people. All right, Mandy. Oh, Sarah had her hand up, I thought. I'm sorry, Sarah, please. I guess just I wanted to say that through our first term as town counselors, I think one thing that we've found is that there's a large majority of town counselors who are pushing back against all of the rules, even open meeting law, and we don't always say I, and there's been a real pushback to not have those formal ways because many counselors feel that it limits the people that you have that represent you. So, and then it also limits communication. So I just wanted to, just for your consideration, I'm not saying change the wording now, but that's something that you later on, when you're doing something you might think about is that not everyone who is in town government right now agrees with those rules, although I completely understand your rationale. Okay, Mandy. So listening to the conversation, I'm leaning more towards either eliminating that clause or changing it from four to maybe two. For a couple of reasons. One, I think it's actually important to have some experience on a committee that's going to be proposing a municipal reparation plan because you need to have some idea and some, I think there's benefit to having people who have operated within the municipal program and things to give that experience there about what might be able to be done or how might that look or how might that happen? At the same time, as Dr. Chavaz just indicated, there's a huge number of African heritage residents in town that might be interested in this and looking at four of seven, which actually becomes then five of seven if you add a representative of reparations for Amherst in, you've left only two slots open for the rest of the community. And that seems a bit small to me. And then there's also the consideration of sometimes former or current elected officials can for better or worse overwhelm those who have never been in a committee like this and have outsized influence and then to put a majority of that on a committee might not work as well as we had hoped. That doesn't mean it won't. And so maybe dialing that back to allowing four residents who may have never been involved in any community municipal committee onto this committee opening it up to even more might be a, it doesn't mean it will be for, right? It all depends on who applies, but giving that option to the manager to potentially do that, I think is where I'm more leaning to. So I think I'd probably take it down to two if reparations and the proponents here believe we need someone because I do think there's a benefit to that. Well, if you're talking about numbers here and you're taking it down to two, then the suggestion in terms of what we were trying to do wouldn't even have any kind of impact in terms of what you're saying, Mandy. So I would just say, let's have a committee of seven voting members and the town manager is appointing these particular members. But I believe that it would be appropriate that there be some kind of qualifications, some kind of way of determining who would be on this committee to leave it just wide open to me would suggest that, hey, this isn't really an important committee. If it's really important, if it's going to have some impact on the town, then it seems to me that the people on it should be some very serious people. Michelle. The other option would be to increase the number of members from seven to nine, which is something that Mandy and I spoke a little bit about and the pros and cons of that, obviously for scheduling it can be harder. But I really appreciate what everyone has said and what Mandy said about not overwhelming the group with all or most elected officials and also having experience on this particular committee does seem really important. So I would be open to just throw in there that maybe a nine-member composition would work and then the four could stay as is. So it's another suggestion. Darcy. Yeah, I would just add that if that the numbers were taken out the four of whom phrase that it could be replaced with an experience requirement. And I've been involved in some other committee charges and one of the things that we like to add is that the members have a commitment to the purpose of the committee, which I don't think should be assumed. So you just want to have members appointed who have a commitment to the purpose. So we have, I see Dr. Shibas, go ahead. So hearing what's been said, I just would reiterate as one sponsor interested in this that no problem with amending that clause or deleting the clause, I think that the Six Blacks residence is important in a composition that's remaining with the number seven in that it's part of again, expressing that will of the targeted community, the community that this is aimed to address. But it could just after Six Blacks residence, if you want to give any additional guidance in the composition to the appointing authority is to say, as Darcy just mentioned, with experience and municipal governance and supporting the aims of this assembly or supporting the aims of this program, that would be fine for my standpoint. So Dr. Shibas, if I hear you correctly, you're comfortable with the number seven because one suggestion is to raise it to nine. I'm thinking, again, that's still up to debate, but if we keep it at seven, what if language something to be effective at least two of home? So the idea is to give some flexibility to make clear to the town manager that there's an intent here to draw on those who have former or current experience with the town as elected or appointed officials. And I think that's important. And I think that we don't want to lose. You could keep it here, which is where it is right now where you could put it down below. I'd like to keep it here if possible, but it should be in here, I think. But the number is something that people are walking at four seems, but we could leave it up to the town manager, but we could say at least two of home with that sort of find a middle ground between four, which does seem to weight it a certain way, but also give the town manager a clear signal, which I'm sure he'll be aware of, but clearly in the charge that at least some of the members should represent this group who have experience with the town and represent, in a sense, I would think the elders in a way is where I see it through their experience and through their commitment over the years. So with that, be acceptable. Those are very good points. I think that the other thing that I'm hearing that I hadn't really thought about in this process is that if I'm understanding correctly, so upon this being approved by the council, the manager would then put out a call for nomination, self-nomination, see who's interested. People would send in a brief letter describing their background and interest and why they'd like to be on this African Heritage Reparations Assembly. And from there, the manager would go through these different letters. I don't know that he'd need a screening committee like he did with Community Safety Working Group, but whichever way he would go about it, he would then, based upon the applications that came in, would then proceed to select whatever number we're saying. And I'm only saying go with seven for what Michelle mentioned earlier. It's just the reducing the difficulty of scheduling and whatnot for a larger body. And then also the, it's not like, well, we have 13 counselors, but that's representing an entire town. So I think seven is maybe a good enough number for what we're dealing with here. So I just would say recognizing that process, it's really just a matter of trying to give a little guidance to the manager as he would go through all of these applications that would come in. So whether one would say at least two or with preference given to those with municipal government experience, whatever the case may be, it's just providing a little additional guidance. But as you say, these are probably characteristics he would be looking at anyway, but it's so it's just a matter of how much you wanna, in a sense, try to limit or tie his hands and how much is he then free to select based upon the applications he gets and what he thinks would make a good group. So given that I could see either the at least two or preference given to those with municipal government experience would be fine. How about the rest of the sponsors? I would like to move this along. I know, I think Irv may have left us already, but I can't see from the screen, but we have two options here. First, keeping the number seven, unless there's a sense that you'd like to change it. I'm suggesting at least two of whom, the other option would be with preference given to. My only concern about that, which the language is fine, but that could lead to, in theory, at least all six could be chosen. I think the manager would not do that. I think he is very, my experience over the years with him is that he does usually seek advice of others. He doesn't do this by himself. And I think he would certainly strive to have a sort of broad spectrum of age and experience, but this document and the intent it seems of the sponsors is to at least say that some of the people chosen should have this kind of experience. That makes sense to me. I'd like to keep it in. So how about at least two of whom? Is that acceptable to the sponsors? It's really the sponsors right now that I'm worried about because this is your, your charge.  And so that's a suggestion, at least two of whom. Okay, I'm seeing nods. Again, we can change this before we vote on it, but I'm going to say at least two of whom are former or current appointed or elected officials in Amherst. And I think we've agreed to keep appointed because that again broadens the net. It's a bit awkward, but I don't mind. It's really captures, I think. I hope it captures the intent of the sponsors and gives guidance to the town manager. Can I also ask that while you're making those edits that you change where it says purpose, you change that to A, R, A. Thank you. As well as under charge. Yep, thank you. That I can do. Okay, for the moment, go ahead, please. If you, in terms of the appointed, I think Kathleen Anderson suggested we could say who formerly or currently held, hold elected positions. Nevermind, I just messed up. There's a way to say like have been in that position without saying appointment or elected if, you know. It was current or former current members of elected bodies. Thank you. Current or former members, I'll put it in. Or former members of elected bodies in Amherst. Is that acceptable? It says six black residents comma at least two of whom are, whoops, that's a different type. Our current or former members of elected bodies in Amherst. That will not, okay, is that acceptable? Okay. Purpose, the AHRA's mission is to study and develop preparation proposals for people of African heritage in Amherst. The charge, the AHRA shall, one, develop and recommend to the town council a municipal reparations plan that includes both a reparations fund and a community wide process of reconciliation and repair for harms against black people. This plan shall include sub one, a plan for developing ongoing funding streams to repair past harms committed by the town against black people. Sub two, an allocation plan, which will be determined and approved by the broader black community through a census and community feedback process. Sub point three, additional means of repair for anti-black structural and communal racism, including public events and activities that prioritize truth telling and reconciliation. Can we stop there for a second? That has a period. Add the period. Thank you. In the non-sub one, develop and recommend, the plan should probably be capitalized the municipal reparations plan. Ah, so in this sentence? In the, no. Up here, right here. Up there. Yes, thank you. And then I have two questions. I think they both fall under number sub two, an allocation plan. First question is, does that plan include eligibility because I know, or is it intended to include eligibility? I know eligibility is always a huge question on these matters. And I didn't totally see anything about the plan coming forward with eligibility requirements. So is that part of number sub two, the allocation plan? I wonder if it's assumed that the under the first heading where it says, can you scroll up please? All the way up. Yes. Black residents in Amherst, the reparations is for residents of Amherst. So doesn't that, doesn't that indicate? It does to a sense. I guess when I've read about reparations plans, the Evanston one goes to people who, I think it's who have, who can document a family member was a resident back in the 60s or earlier.  And I could ask a lot of questions about that. That's more specific, but it's more about does this include the, does the plan include coming up with that eligibility requirements? I think your right subsection two is where those issues would be hammered out. And if you either want to take it that in the carrying out of the charge, the group will address that. But if you want to put in a specific guidance to the committee to address it, I think that would be the area where something to that effect would take place. But I would agree with you that in the development of an allocation plan, what, where those resources would go per the community consultative process would be very directive about where or to whom, who's eligible, who under that for that type of reparations too. By the way, as we've I think elsewhere indicated in here, there are other means regarding it that in terms of the, some of the educational, some of the townwide events, those would be maybe a little less concerned with proving residency or that type of thing. There are things that are just more aimed more generically, I would think to African heritage people. But yes, I think you're right in targeting that in subsection two, that's where that concern would be addressed. Well, one could insert in eligibility requirements. I tend to kind of leave it the way it is and accept as Dr. Shabazz points out that that's where it's gonna be dealt with anyway. I don't know, Manny, do you have a thought on that? I just wanted to make sure it was part of that thinking as that subsection and if it hadn't been thought of as part of that thinking, I just maybe ask that you put eligibility in there somewhere an allocation and eligibility plan. I don't think given Dr. Shabazz's explanation that we need it though. Okay, I can't see all hands. So is there anyone else that? I was just gonna confirm that. Matthew, please. That the allocation plan includes some kind of eligibility criteria. Let's go, it was assumed there and yeah, if it helps to have it articulated, that's fine. I'm just gonna put it in for people to see it. An allocation plan including eligibility criteria, comma, is a suggestion. And then I just had one other question about what was the intent? Well, not the intent, I know what the intent is but what's the thinking about the approved by the broader black community? Both broader meaning Amherst black community or broader beyond Amherst? And is there a thinking about what that would look like? And maybe, and I asked the what that would look like because the way number two is worded, the way I read it is that it would have to be approved that the broader black community would have had to approve that plan prior to the town council receiving the recommendation from this committee on that plan. And that's right, that's exactly right. Okay, is there any idea of how that would happen or is that being left up to the committee? If I might, Kathleen? I would just say that it's the black community's decision how that will happen. We are organizing to look at the reparations proposal for the town of Amherst. So it's our decision as black residents, what the eligibility looks like, we're the broader community, if it helps to make people feel more comfortable to say the broader Amherst black community, then that can be put into it. And it is our intention as a black community of Amherst to call ourselves together as a assembly to make decisions on the reparations. And if I might add to that the real key word in that subsection too is census through a census. The effort that we envision occurring in the community to which this committee would interface with is the determining of those residents similar to the way in which the US census goes out every 10 years and asked under the demographic data who identifies as black or African-American. Well, in a similar way, we're interested in establishing that number with the means to communicate with those identifying as black or African-American residents and that that's where the community consultative process would really emerge. So in some ways eligibility, all of that is linked to the actual census getting a sense of who's here and a communication channel to those who are a voting age or 18 or above that identify as African heritage. We are not drawing distinctions between Africans in that African heritage group. If you were born in Kate Verde and came here 20 years ago, 30 years, whatever moved to Amherst and you've been living here and you're currently an Amherst resident, we don't draw that distinction and say, oh no, you're out or you were born in Jamaica or you were born in Haiti or Nigeria, you're out. We don't, our thinking and the thinking that we will be developing the census around and reaching out to the community on doesn't draw those distinctions of where you're born. It's based upon being resident in the town for a certain period of time and identifying as black or of African heritage. I have a question about how community is being defined. Does it include undocumented people of African heritage? That's important to me that resident doesn't block someone who needs support from receiving it if they're undocumented. So I'm curious how you've thought about that. Good question. We have avoided using terms like citizen for that reason and instead using residents. So again, if for example, I think of our late brother, Benny, brother Benny, the Motown man, he was resident here. He lived here, but the extent to which he maybe had where he was from or where his citizenship was from would not really matter. It's that he was resident. I just, he just comes into my head right now. I'd imagine brother Benny was born in the U.S., but again, that's not really what matters here. Is that your resident here? Thank you for that. Which is a little bit different than the Evanson requirement that family have been resident of the town since the 1960s. And that's one of their requirements. So I need a sense from the... I want to say reparations is only for those people whose families were descendants, who are descendants of the enslaved in the United States. So this is broadening the eligibility to black residents in Amherst. Great. Is the committee, excuse me, is the sponsors accept these changes since sub number two? Michelle? I would just point out that we think about the actual mechanism for funding. So if we follow through with this stabilization fund that the finance committee has proposed, which I'm not sure that all GOL members are aware of at this point, but we have to think about how the process by which these reparations proposals will be funded. So I don't know if that's part of the work of the committee to sort of interface and town manager Backelman will be hopefully, or I don't know if town manager Backelman will be working with us like he did with the community safety working group. I think what we talked about is working with the town council directly. So I just wanna make sure we consider that we wanna be able to understand the legal scope of how to actually fund these proposals as they are created. I need to do a time check from, I'm sorry, I just need to do a time check for the committee. We also have, I believe our guests present now who were scheduled to be at 1115. It is now 1123. I need some help from everyone to get us through this if we can. I asked the indulgence of our, actually I should check with our other guests because I know they are at school and I don't know how much time they have because this, we still have one other item to get through. So I have not asked our guests to wait to introduce themselves and I don't have your names in front of me, I apologize because I don't have your document in front of me. But could you unmute for a moment and just say hello and tell us what your timeframe is? Hey, can you hear us? Yes, we can. We're pretty open about the timeframe. Yeah, we're pretty open. All right, so if you don't mind, we still have a fair amount of work to do. I'd say hopefully within the next 15 or 20 minutes we can get through this and we would turn directly to you. So you have at least 15 or 20 minutes. That's perfect. All right, thank you. Well, you're going to see GOL in action. Thank you, Macy. So again, Pat, can you actually, could the two students introduce themselves to the rest of the audience? So it's Macy, could you introduce yourself please? Yes, let me just kind of go in really quick. Hi, I'm Macy Parasau and yeah, I'm Eleanor Rash. Okay, great, Eleanor and Macy and I believe your teacher Tim Austin is also perhaps somewhere present, but... Yeah, he's right next to us. I thought he might be, but welcome to you all and we hope to be with you in a few minutes. So I'm sorry to the rest of you, but I needed to just do that. If you would mute then, Macy and please and so item, sub-item two, are people acceptable with this language? Do they want to change it, alter it? I'm looking for hands. Please speak up or someone tell me. I'm just, I see Dr. Shabazz. So only to catch what Michelle had offered, I think that would go toward sub-one, a plan for developing ongoing funding streams to repair past harms committed by the town against black people. I'm not sure whether the update, the information you were providing would affect any of that language or add to it or not, but it would seem to me that would go toward that area. As far as the question about sub-two, the only thing I would say is you had put in, including eligibility criteria as just as a placeholder at that point for consideration, I just would say revisiting this if the counselors feel that the information shared about the census and the community feedback process and as well as adding in Amherst in front of it is sufficient that we don't need to have that additional language of including eligibility criteria. But if not, then I'd imagine we'd leave it in. I think it's a decision for the sponsors. I could take the language out and it could be inserted at the council. If some counselors raise a concern or we could leave it in. Again, I just need guidance from the sponsors and or the committee. Right now the language is there but it could easily be taken out. Any thoughts from anyone? Generally speaking, when language is in a charge like this, it will probably tend to stay. So if there's any uncomfortable sense about this you might wanna take it out and then wait to see if something, we obviously have five counselors present today. So if any one of them wanted to raise it they could at the council and then the discussion would take place. So if you leave the language in it's, I would say probably likely it will stay. It's my thought. So any thoughts from the sponsors? I think it's fine to leave it in just as it is. We're just speaking of sub two right now, right? I'm sorry? You're just talking about sub two, right? Yes, I am. I think sub two is fine as is. Okay, all right. Sub three, additional means of repair for antibiotic structural and communal racism including public events. Again, I've read this so I'm not gonna read it again. Sub four, coordinate with other groups working toward racial equity in Amherst to ensure collaboration. I think that one's supposed to be a main two. It just needs, it was, on my copy it was a number two in the one higher on the outline. So what you're suggesting is, I'm not sure I can do this. Yeah, it would be the equivalent of the, that like that. Yes. That's a miracle folks. Anyway, the sponsors, is that what you actually intended? So this was actually, that's still not quite right. But I'll fix that. I'll fix it later. One, two, okay, thank you. Might be able to do this. All right. All right, sorry. Anyway, that is what these sponsors intended. That should be a separate. All right, I'll fix that later. How about, so this began becomes three? That would be a three, yeah. Okay. And my only comment on this one, well, two comments. One's easy. The library trustees are not extra municipal. They are part of the municipality. So I would get rid of the library trustees and et cetera, put an and between bid and chamber of commerce. So engage as appropriate communities, stakeholders, such as the bid and chamber of commerce is how I would do it and delete library trustees, et cetera. Cause the library's trustees are not extra municipal. Mandy, would you say in this spot that faith organizations would be included? Okay. I mean, and you could add bid and then you could get rid of the and bid comma chamber of commerce and faith organizations comma to develop would work. I'd prefer faith communities. I'd prefer faith communities works. But that's just me again, speak up right now and Steve, we should just pick up. Yeah, I think that there's a whole long list of possible stakeholders beyond what we're saying here, including nonprofits, et cetera, you know, so I wouldn't limit it. So it just says such as, so it's just, these are, I've already mentioned too, and that's what, so engage as appropriate communities, stakeholders, such as the bid, chamber of commerce and faith, faith communities. And wait, wait, you could, you could put a comma after, remove the and put a comma. Yeah. So it would read the bid, chamber of commerce, faith communities and others, other organizations as deemed appropriate or just other organizations. Otherwise we'd have appropriate in there twice. We don't need appropriate in there twice. Yeah. Okay. As appropriate. So it reads engage as appropriate community stakeholders, such as the bid, chamber of commerce, faith communities and other organizations to develop actually municipal reparations efforts that align with and compliment the towns, municipal reparations plan. And I would just capitalize municipal reparations plan, initial caps them all for consistency. I think the M needs capitalized too. Yeah. Okay. My next comments are on reports. Yep, please go ahead. I've deleted everything up to the in writing because this is a one year appointment. So I think annually is redundant. So. So reports in writing to the town council. So in writing to the town council, did we want to put an end date on it by a certain time? That's a question from Michelle. Exactly. That's a question. Usually, usually a charge has some kind of, it actually can be extended as we know. Right. But it does. Great. That's what I was going to say is that they all get some sense of what would be a reasonable time from the sponsor's perspective, given the realities and given what's going on. Six months, three months. What? I mean, I would, I would like to see us get somewhere in three months and I think that we will. But, you know, in writing to the town council, I would say to put maybe four months. I don't know. What about Kathleen, Matthew and male car, Hala, what do you think? How's September? What does that give us? June, July, August, September, it gives us four months. September 30. It'll take at least a month to pass it and get appointments made. So the work will begin in July, realistically, right? So July, August, that will give us three months. So we could do October 31st or September 30, either one of those. October, let's do October. Okay. Right into the town council by October 31st. 2021. Okay. And I think we just have to delete the thing under action and just write none. All right. So we have made a number of changes. Give people a moment to just look one last time. Obviously, it's governor errors can be corrected, but I think we've gotten everything. So essentially at least two of whom are current or former members of elected bodies in Amherst and including eligibility criteria and starting the word Amherst. We've changed two and three that hopefully will be corrected. And then chamber of commerce, comma, faith communities, that should be comma, excuse me, and other organizations to develop. No, there's no comma after faith communities. Well, we have the Oxford commas. We use the Oxford commas. Don't ask me why. I know. Don't ask me. Mandy, explain this please. We use the Oxford comma before the word and is our standard use. Why? It's just what we do. The legal attorney in me says it's much more clearer than if not, it does indicate what the end of the section is. Imagine if there were phrases instead of words that required commas within the phrase, then this allows it to be a little more clearer. Anyway, it's just a peculiarity, Kathleen, of our committee, I'm afraid. All right. I apologize for that, but that's just what we do. And if we don't do it, we all just get really... We need a period after 2021, George. I was gonna ask, I guess, yes. Okay. And just one other thing. I know we're on a time crunch here, but I was thinking about the resolution, the resolution that the town council approved on December 7th and just wondering in terms of the charge, if there's any language that should be added that references that resolution and the town's commitment to engaging in a path of remedy. Is that appropriate here or is it not necessary? It should be added into the purpose. Yeah, that seems right. So something like in accordance with or to further the goals of the resolution adopted on December 7th, 2020? I don't know if others agree, but that seems to keep us connecting all the dots here. It seems like that would be a good thing to add into our purpose. So the language, suggested language would be AHRA's mission is to study and develop preparation proposals for people of African heritage in Amherst, in light of, or in... To further the goals of the resolution adopted by the town council on December 7th, 2020? So again, Manny, to further... The goals of the resolution adopted by the town council on December 7th, 2020? We should go back. I don't have the time now. If you know the title of that resolution, we should add in. I have it right here. If you want it, I can read it quickly. Okay. A resolution affirming the town of Amherst's commitment. Yeah, hang on for a second. I'm sorry. Sure, no. I just wanna see where it's gonna go. It would go after the word resolution to goals of the resolution affirming whatever Michelle's reading. I'm gonna put it in quotes for the moment. Go ahead, Michelle. Affirming the town of Amherst's commitment to end structural racism and achieve racial equity for black residents. Okay. So Amherst, so AHRA's mission is to study and I will fix the, right. To further the goals of the resolution affirming the town of Amherst's commitment to end structural racism and achieve racial equity for black residents adopted by the town council on December 7th, 2020. Okay. All right. Are we ready for a motion? I just have a quick question. Go ahead. Timeline, if the report is due on October 31st, and the life of the committee is one year, what is the work of the committee gonna be done by October 31st? Well, I don't think that's mandated by this charge. Well, if we're reporting to the town council what are you reporting back to? I saw the report being the plan by October 31st and then two and three continuing on through. Yeah. Maybe that should be specified. Okay, yeah. In writing the municipal reparations plan, that's really what you're expecting here in terms of report. Yeah. I don't know. Usually at the end, there's also a final report that sort of summarizes everything that was accomplished, but perhaps, I mean, so what is it that is most? It can it just be a status report? And so it's left open more broadly. It sounds like it might work to say proposed municipal reparations plan will be submitted to the town council by October 31st and a final report will be submitted at the termination of the charge. That's good. That's good. I like it. So a proposed. Thank you, Matthew. A proposed municipal reparations plan will be submitted in writing. I think you just have to say proposed municipal reparations plan to the town council by October 31st, 2021. Right, obviously it'll be in writing. Bye, go ahead. But you got it all in there, just delete it. So a proposed municipal reparations plan to the town council by October 31st, 2021. And sorry, Matthew, go ahead. And a final, yeah. Yeah, a final report at the term, I don't know if the right wording is at the end of the charge. Determination. And a final report at the termination of the charge. Or at the termination. I'm sorry, Matthew, I'm sorry, Mandy. Work, charge, yeah. And the committee's work, no, no. Proposed municipal reparations plan to the town council by October 31 and a final report at the termination of the. Assembly's work. And what about completion instead of termination or? Like that. That's a better word. Yeah. Okay. Sixth, spelling of municipal. Oh, it's close enough, isn't it? Municipal, I can't spell anymore. Municipal, that looks good. Okay. Anything else? Darcy, your hand's still raised. Oh, no, sorry. All right, I'm willing to entertain a motion. I'll make a motion to recommend the council adopt the African heritage reparation assembly charge and to declare the charge as modified, clear, consistent and actionable. Second DeAngelis. Second by Pat. All right. I don't see. We go directly to vote. I'm gonna start with Sarah. Aye. Darcy. Yes. Mandy. Aye. Pat. Aye. The chairs and I, so the vote is unanimous by zero. Let me, oh boy, save that. Let me stop sharing for a moment. Let me put that over here. And we now have the draft resolution. Let me share that. Go ahead, Pat. I think the girls think it's theirs No, I know they do, but it isn't, I'm afraid. And Let them know that it's a different one, please. Yeah, I apologize. Again, there are two items we have to deal with and we are and this is the resolution. I've tried to put it into a format. It's going to look a little different than what you submitted to the committee, but hopefully it is what you wished. This is the format in which we put these sorts of resolutions. I don't have a council sponsor Anyone know who the council sponsor is or will be? I'd be happy to sponsor it. Sorry, let me, first of all. Okay, hang on for a second, folks. I'm sure we'll see the changes. Community sponsors, Amherst, African Heritage, Residence for Reparations. Is that correct? Okay. Again, please just speak up because I can't at this point. I really can't see hands. Kathleen, is that the name that you all landed on? African American Heritage Residence for Reparations. I believe so. Okay. African American. I'm missing. I'm sorry. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. So Amherst African American Heritage Residence for Reparations. All right. Otherwise, I have not made any changes. Nor would I to the language. I've just put it into the format, which are peculiar format that we follow. I've asked my colleagues to look at this in advance. Anyone have any concerns or comments about the draft resolution as it's presented here? And again, please just speak up because I cannot see hands. Do you want me to go through it section by section? The second to last whereas. Yep. This one whereas HR 40. Yep. I think it needs a that before acknowledges to make it. So HR 40 is a bill pending before the U.S. House of Representatives. S 40 in the Senate. That acknowledges. Yeah. Yeah. The fundamental injustice in humanity is slavery. Establishes a commission to study slavery at subsequent racial and economic discrimination against free people and the impact of those forces on living African Americans today. And makes recommendations to Congress on appropriate remedies. Okay. Now I had two questions about the very end, but I want to make sure people are happy with the whereas as I've not changed the language at all, except here now we inserted that. So hopefully the sponsors are happy with the language they presented. And my colleagues are happy with the language that they have hopefully looked at. I did have two questions about the therefore is now therefore be it resolved that should it be the town council of Amherst? Yes. Yes. Yes. Hereby recognizes the date of February 25th of each year as National Reparations Awareness Day and be it further resolved that the town council of Amherst or the town of Amherst? So that would be the town council. We normally resolutions like this normally say the town council urges the Congress and Senate to pass HR 40 S 40. And then there's a third be it further resolved that the clerk of the town council send this resolution off to the president and all of that. That's a that that third be it resolved that's missing as standard and it would be the president the our how our McGovern. Right, exactly. I could copy that from a previous resolution. I can't do that right now. But that would be a further be it for right further resolved that would be inserted as boilerplate. But you also make the point that this probably should state that we urge right so that language should put in I would take it here. I think every part of the second be it further resolved that the town council of Amherst urges senators and representative to support. HR 40, although this one talks about educational activities related to it, but it's senators and representatives to support. The passage of HR slash S 40. And urges the community urges this residents of Amherst urges the residents whoops typing was a requirement for this job and urges the residents of Amherst and one of needed to engage. Again, this is this is just suggested language to engage in supportive activities to educate about the concept of parishes. I wonder whether is this something we are. Yeah. Okay. So that's what we have at the moment. And then there would be a further books and I'm just going to leave this. We just insert the standard language and I'm just going to leave it like that for the moment. But I want to go back to this that the town council of Amherst urges its senators and representatives to support the passage of HR slash S 40. And urges the residents of Amherst or is it and commits itself to are we committing ourselves to engage in supportive activities to educate about the concept of reparations and advocate for the passage. Actually, we've just advocated for it. So that would not be appropriate. So are we urging the residents of Amherst? This is what the sponsors had originally. Um, that the residents of Amherst engage in. So that's the language Mandy has suggested here. Is that acceptable? Give people a moment to look at it and think about it. Any thoughts? And again, please speak up because I'm really not seeing many hands. Not missing a few faces. Again, in a sense, people are accepted. Accept this change. You need to take off the end of the sentence there, George. Which, okay, to engage as part of this, educate about the concept of reparations and advocate. But we're urging the residents to advocate for passage. So I think it still works. Oh, well, let's see. So it could be a separate, be it for the resolve that the town council urged the residents of Amherst to engage in as part of activities that you cable. And so that could be a separate be it for the result. That's okay. Separating it is combined. Okay. I'm hearing two voices here. One says combined. One says separate. Separate is easier in a sense. Whatever, whatever as fast as. I understand and urges residents of Amherst to engage in supportive activities to educate about the concept of reparations and advocate for the passage of these two bills. And be it for the result. And then we've put in the boilerplate language, which I don't have handy. I'm afraid and I'm not going to try and find right now. How do the sponsors feel about this? Is this what you had hoped pretty much? Now that we've gone through and mangled it for you. I think it's pretty much what you wrote. Seeing no concerns raised. I'm going to entertain a motion. I'll make the motion to declare the, can you move up so I can see the title resolution in support of HR 40 slash S 40 bills in Congress. Clear consistent and actionable as amended. Is there a second? Second to answer us. Thank you. If I may relative. Please go ahead. You're moving to a vote. Just a point out that I've gone and currently the Senate co-sponsors to S 40 is at 21. In addition to Senator Cory Booker and both of our Massachusetts senators, Markey and Warren, are among those co-sponsors. And in the house HR 40 has gotten up to 188 co-sponsors. That was introduced by representative Sheila Jackson Lee of Houston. And it's currently, I'm sorry, at 188 co-sponsors. And all of our Massachusetts delegation, including Richard Neil is all on board for that. So I think this really strengthens the solidarity of our Massachusetts delegation and hopefully will spur support for this moving through Congress. Thank you. Any further comments? And I'm going to proceed to a vote. I don't see any hands. Mandy. Pat. Aye. Darcy. Yes. Sarah. Aye. And the chair is an aye. So again, unanimous to declare resolution in support of HR 40, S 40 bills in Congress to be clear, consistent and actionable. And I just want to add that there are a number of people working on a state proposal for reparations. So I want to make people aware of that and to be, stay tuned for your support of HD 51 40. It hasn't yet been brought into, into the house, but I mean, it will be soon. Thank you, Kathleen. And I think we'll let these good people get onto their next item of business. Just before you do, there's one thing I have to say. I, it was brought to my attention. I wasn't there at the beginning of the meeting, but it's brought to my attention that the chair used a, like what's it called a mode of speech about cracking the whip. And I just, given the content of what we're talking about today, I didn't feel like I could let the moment pass without acknowledging that that's really not an appropriate use of that type of speech in, in this context or really in any context. So I know it was probably not intentional. No, it was not intentional, obviously, but I point well taken. I agree. Thanks. All right. So I'd like to move on to the next item of business, which is to bring in our two guests and say thank you to the other guests who have been with us for the last hour plus. So we're going to turn to, if I can find it quickly, take a moment. Sorry to interrupt. George, I need to step away.  Do you want me to make Mandy a co-host? Please, would you do so? That would be appreciated. Thank you. You're welcome. I just want to start by thanking Eleanor and Macy for their patience. The government should always run on time, and we thank you for making the time out of your day to be patient. Governments never run on time. Let's get real. All right. So let me put this up on the screen. Let me get that out of the way. So Eleanor and Macy, welcome. Here is the resolution that the two of you, I think with the help of your teacher, have brought to us and asked us to review prior to sending it on to the town council where it would be voted by the council. The hope is that this would go on the next council agenda, but that is decided by the council president. So we have here in front of us, everyone can see it. I take it. Everyone is clearing everyone's screen. Draft resolution, we would actually take that out. So let me, first of all, resolution in support of H912, an act relative to forest protection and H1002, an act to increase protection of wildlife management areas. Do those need quotes? That's a question. I don't, I mean, you can put them in. I'm not sure it needs it. Okay, then we won't do it. Resident sponsors, Eleanor Rash, make sure your names are spelled correctly because the chair is known to misspell things, and Macy Parasau. And the council sponsor is Pat DeAngelo. All right. I've asked my colleagues to look at this in advance. I have done so. I have no changes or concerns, but I need to hear from my colleagues and the way we work. Macy and Eleanor is that we solicit, our job is not to discuss the merits. Generally speaking of this, though I think it has excellent merits, but simply to declare it clear, consistent, and actionable. And then we, and that is our task. And then we send this onto the council, where the council then votes on it. And at that point, if there is a matter of substance or issue about the merits or demerits, then that's normally where it's discussed. So here we're more concerned, essentially, that this document be clear, consistent, and actionable. Those are the three criteria that we use. And my colleagues on the committee review it with that in mind. And sometimes they make suggestions. I think you've just seen in painful detail, how we work. So I don't think I'll go through that again. Any concerns, questions, edits, issues, typos from committee members with this document. Mandy. I'll start with some edits, and then I have some questions. The first in the first wear ad, I think we capitalize commonwealth. As we certainly do. Thank you. The stylistic. That's fine. And any others of that nature? Of that nature, the last wear ads, I think we need a because. So where is our understanding of climate change, science moves quickly, and we constantly find out new things. Many Massachusetts public land use policies are out of date regarding climate change. I thought the because at the beginning, because our understanding of climate change science moves quickly, and we constantly find out new things, many Massachusetts lands land use policies are out of date. Sponsors, what do you think of that? Whereas means because doesn't it? I'm sorry. Whereas means because. Right. Through. In other words, look at the others because trees absorb carbon dioxide because of our understanding, right? So I think Darcy makes a very good point. Yeah, I think Mandy, it's covered. Okay. It just read weird to me. That's all. Okay. Well, let's read it one last time. One more time. Whereas our understanding of climate change, science moves quickly, comma. And we constantly find out new things, comma. Many Massachusetts public land use policies are out of date regarding climate change. Sounds good to me. Okay. That's just me. Okay. Are you concerned to guess? Go ahead. So the fourth whereas this is where I have questions because I did a little bit of changing of stuff for this is beginning. There are many. There are many endangered threatened or species that have earned special concern status in Massachusetts. I reworded that. I'm not sure it needs to be endangered, threatened or special concern status species because everything's a species. But question the bills themselves. So questions for, you know, Eleanor and Macy. In the end, you say the forests are cut down that which will be impacted if forests are cut down ordinary plants, animals and insects will be destroyed as well. The two acts themselves, what are they doing? I just don't know anything about these bills. So I was wondering if you could tell me what the relative, what each of these bills goals are? Well, so one of them, the act to increase protection of wildlife management areas, that one is about adding more nature reserves on Massachusetts public lands. Both of these bills are specifically about that. And the act to increase protection is a more general, it updates a lot of policies about our public forest. So that's the idea of them. That's the state parks and forests as opposed to wildlife. Okay. And so they're aiming to plant more trees and just better protect those areas? Not to plant more trees to protect older trees to protect older trees more. A curious thing I learned from Eleanor and Macy was that a lot of our land use laws are over 100 years old, so they really aren't. We could even add that into the last whereas instead of just out of date. That would be up to the sponsors. Yeah. So you're suggesting, I'm sorry, the last whereas you're suggesting what? I just thought if Pat found it fascinating and learned a lot that the out of date is because they're 100 or more years old that that might be worth mentioning in that way. I think that would be worth mentioning. I think that'll be good. So let's look at this. Our understanding of climate change science moves quickly and we constantly find out new things. Many master's public land use policies are over 100 years old. Yeah, they're serious. The many land use policies regarding climate change are over. Yes. Many land use policies are over 100 years old and out of date regarding climate change. Yes. Are over 100 years old and out of date regarding climate change. Go ahead. We don't believe we don't believe the 100 years old thing is accurate. But a lot of them are from the era of like World War II. Okay. So that's 70. 60. So we could say are over 70 or over 60 years old and out of date or we could just keep your language as you originally had it. So there's no fault with that. So it's really up to the sponsors. I understand you want to be accurate and your point is that 100 years is actually not accurate. Oh, that's not true. But anyway. Oh, Councillor D'Angelo says agrees. No, I'm being quiet. I'm sorry. I thought I heard your voice, but maybe that was just an echo. Would you like the over 60 years old in there, Macy and Eleanor? Yeah, I think that would be a really nice add. Could it be over 70? Because I was born in the 40s when the war was happening. So what year, what number would you like over 60 maybe? We'll go with that. So many Massachusetts public land use policies are over 60 years old and out of date. So we want regarding climate change. So that really should be many Massachusetts public land use policies regarding climate change. Yes. Are over 60 years old and out of date. And I think that makes that point very strongly. And that's so what do the sponsors think? Is that acceptable? I think it's good. Can I go back to the fourth whereas? All right. Fourth whereas, yes. Are the blue spotted salamander and little brown bat special concern species threatened or endangered or each? One second, please. We are just checking. I'm just trying to make sense of this whereas. Yeah, I'm wondering if you could say, where is there many danger or threatened species that have earned special concern status? Well, I think special concern status is a different status completely. Well, surely your special concern because you're either endangered or threatened, right? Or is it just because they like the name? No, I think it's I think it's like a third tier. So how? Okay. So you're not threatened and you're not endangered, but you're you're of special concern. Because you're close to threatened. There's probably different policies or different rules, right? So if you're if something's endangered, then the probably the laws are more strict. If you're a special concern, maybe they're a little bit more lax, right? So it's okay. So good. This is a question for our sponsors. And it seems the consensus of my of the expert members of my committee is that these are three different statuses. Yes. Is that your understanding? Sponsors that these are three very distinct categories. We did find out both species are endangered. Okay. All right. So you could say, where is there many different status than endangered? So special concern a category in addition to threatened and yes. Sorry, that sounded like Pat DeAngelis' voice, but I'm sure it wasn't. The question was addressed to the sponsors. Could you repeat the question, please? Sure. I can understand it's hard sometimes to hear on this committee because voices come from all over the place. The question is whether these we have endangered, threatened and special concern. These are three distinct categories in your understanding. They're both endangered species. This is a different question. I'm sorry. I'm not clear. A different question. They are different categories. Thank you. Thank you. Good. So each of these three, so that helps us. Could we think about a rewording to read endangered, threatened or special concern status species? A mildly concerned, I don't mind the language, but you have like the blue spotted salamander and the little brown bat, which I believe you just told me, but I can't remember, are actually considered endangered. Correct? That is correct. So this makes it sound like they're special concern and that's not what you want. So I like mentioning them. I think that's a nice touch. But the way it's wording right now, it makes it sound, at least to my ear, like they're belonging to the special concern category or status, but in fact, they belong to the endangered status. So could we reorganize it to say there are many special concern threatened or endangered species? Yeah, I don't know. It's also possible just to leave it the way it is. Yeah, and if people could, yeah, it's not right. I like mentioning it. I like to mention, I was just curious which one of the three they were. Right, and the answer is they're the first one. They're the first one. Right, and that you could just leave it that way if the sponsors are okay with that or if they have a suggestion as to how to arrange it so that it's a little bit clearer where the blue spotted salamander and the little brown bat belong. Could they maybe put their many endangered threatened or species that have earned special concern status in Massachusetts period of special note or... We don't like putting periods in these, I'm afraid, Sarah, but that's okay. I hear you. I think we're going to leave it the way it is. And if someone reads this and thinks which category do these two belong in, that would be all for the better. But I think I'm going to leave it unless I hear objection from either my colleagues or from the sponsors. Hearing none, any other concerned changes, edits, questions for our sponsors or my colleagues. So now therefore be it resolved that the Amherstown Council supports the passage of both H912 and ACT relative to forest protection and H1,002. Oh, that H needs a period after it. And the dash needs to come out. There it is. Be it further resolved, and this is the language actually that perhaps I should copy now. If it's the clerk of the Amherstown Council supports a copy of this resolution to be sent to Governor Baker, President of the Senate, Karen Spilka, Massachusetts Speaker of the House, Ronald Mariano, members of the Joint Committee on Environment, Natural Resources and Agriculture, State Senator Joanne and Cumberford, and State Representative Minnie Dunn. That's excellent. That's exactly it. Can our resident sponsors confirm that both bills are in front of that Joint Committee? Do we know? It is. Okay. Thank you.  That's what I wanted to make sure. So we have before us the resolution as amended with the agreement of the sponsors. Any further concerns, questions from either the sponsors or my colleagues? If not, I'm going to entertain a motion. I would know I would like to make the motion. Please go ahead. I move we declare the resolution in support of H912, an act relative to Forest Protection and H1002, an act to increase protection of wildlife management areas clear, consistent, and actionable. Is there a second? I second it. Okay. Darcy, seconds. I will move immediately to a vote. This time I'm going to start with Mandy. Aye. Pat. Aye. Darcy. Yes. Sarah. Aye. And the chair is an aye. That is unanimous 5-0. Thank you very much to our patient, very patient sponsors. I'm sorry we didn't get to as soon as I thought, but I appreciate you staying. Do you have any questions for us? Any further thoughts? I don't think we have any questions. We just want to say thank you for listening to our ideas and reading through all this with us. That's fine. That's our job and it's our pleasure. And this will go to the council and I will request that the council president reach out to you and to your teacher letting you know when it will come before the council and inviting you to attend. Our custom has been recently and I think we're going to continue. Even though these are past on what's called the consent agenda, we nonetheless, fairly early in the meeting, mercifully for you, we bring each of these resolutions or proclamations forward. Usually the council sponsor, in this case, would like to be Pat, would briefly describe it. She wouldn't read the whole thing, but she'd really describe it and she'd probably read the therefore clauses, the resolve clauses. And if you were president in the audience, you certainly don't have to be, but if you're president, she would acknowledge you. And that's what we're doing at least at the moment. Joan, I would like to make a suggestion in this instance that the girls describe it and read and that I not do that. Well, I think that's problematic, Pat, but we'll talk about this elsewhere. And it has nothing to do with the young ladies. It has to do with people speaking in town council, who are not actually counselors in that kind of setting. So I've talked with Lynn about this and she agrees with me that it should be the council sponsor who speaks, but that we hopefully can ensure it acknowledged the sponsor is being present. And so anyway, that's what we're doing. Could I mention that if Eleanor and Macy would like to speak to it at public comment, they're always welcome to it too. So you may come, which comes before we actually vote on it, believe it or not. So the public comment will become before the consent agenda on this. So we would welcome you speaking to it at that point in time. It's an excellent suggestion, Mandy. And you just simply have to raise your hand when it comes when you're recognized. Just introduce yourself by name and then just briefly state that you're excited by or support this and excited that the council is going to vote on it and express your approval or support of it. So that's probably the best way to do it. That allows you to speak. And so I will make sure that you are notified in advance which meeting this will be. I can't promise right now because I don't know. The agenda is already pretty full, but if it is on this coming agenda, I will make sure that you're notified and invite you both to come and speak during public comment. That is at the beginning of the meeting. All right. Okay, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. All right, guys. We still have Juneteenth. Thank you, everyone. We've got a time check. We're in big trouble, but I don't know what else I can do. I'm going to have to stay and hopefully I can get at least two members to stay with me. We do have to declare at least the DAB to be clear, excuse me, declare the pool sufficient so I can begin that process. And we really also have to do the same for FinCom. Though in theory we could push FinCom off but I'd rather not. So we do have to deal with Juneteenth, however, I have not heard from Jen, so I don't know what to do with this. I think it is timely. We have to get to it. So can I make a suggestion? Please, Maddie, go ahead. I've just indicated that she wanted to, that the Juneteenth proclamation needed work in the past we've done where once she does it, it goes to you for review and then directly to the council with the waiver of the rule that GOL needs to see it. I would be hesitant to declare something clear, consistent and actionable that our community participation officer has said needs reviewed. Okay, I mean, she was told in advance, many days in advance that this is coming. She was told again today that it's on the committee agenda. So I guess my, I think we're just declaring, doing the two committees that we need to declare a pool sufficient. So we'll leave this to the side and if it does get to us, we'll use the rule that allows us to do it without formal review. Okay, all right. I'm going to start with DAB and we need to, first we need to declare the pool sufficient so you have, I sent you, I believe demographic information on the pool. We have currently, what is it, 18 applicants, every district except one, unfortunately, one district only has one applicant and so that's district four. So despite my best efforts, that one district has only one but I think at this stage we really don't have much choice. I don't think we should hold district four out. We should just declare the pool sufficient as it exists but I'm open to thoughts on that but at the moment we have what I say 18 and so all the other, excuse me, all the other districts have multiple candidates. In other words, three at least and some have five but district four only has one and we have one student so student doesn't really belong to a district at least at the moment. Mandy made the point and I believe she is right that I had argued that you should, you should tell me where you live so I can put you in either district one, two, three or four or five but a student could very well obviously be resident Amherst for nine months or eight months but their legal residence could be somewhere else and surely they should not be excluded from this pool so I only have one in that category and so their legal residence or the residence they gave me is not Amherst but they are a student at UMass and I assume will be a student at UMass in the fall so they are included in this pool. Go ahead. You're absolutely right on the districts, it's unfortunate district four isn't quite sufficient but I think it would be weird to hold out district four otherwise by numbers I think we have the minimal sufficiency for a few of the districts and more than a minimal sufficiency for a few of the districts you know gender representation, age representation age is really good looking at this we've got a wide span of ages here genders not as great but definitely I'm going to put this up on the screen I realize people don't know what I have in front of them so this is the demographic info as usual our racial and ethnic diversity is lacking at the same time I think we need to move forward and get this committee appointed so I would despite some concerns about district four in particular and the racial ethnic diversity I would be willing to declare it sufficient thoughts of other members of the committee I think Mandy sometimes it's we strive for diversity and sometimes we're not we don't quite I agree and I think we should move forward okay so I'm going to then make a motion to declare the pool for the district advisory board to be sufficient is there a second I'll second okay the motion is made and seconded any further thoughts or discussions and I'm going to move to vote I'm going to start this time with Thirsty yes yes thank you sorry Pat aye Mandy aye Sarah aye the chair is against so the vote is five zero we declare the pool sufficient okay I'm going to put that away and now we need to look at the selection guidance I'll put that up on the screen and ask you to bear with me so the current selection guidance that we've adopted reads as follows selection of voting members shall be based on the following diversity of residency experience on past redistricting committees consistent availability for meetings particularly in light of the type timeline and summer vacations mix of perspectives skills ages and occupations and maybe you should say demographic diversity what do you think I'm going to edit this unless people I think the vote just disappears and just starts with demographic diversity exactly demographic diversity including racial economic gender and generational diversity obviously that's right in addition to chair of GOL or designee shall solicit from the town clerk input as to whether there is any preferred knowledge expertise perspectives or qualifications that the board might require to better assist it in its work now I did do that I did include the documents I received from Suadette including her email and also a flyer if you wish to call it that that was sent to her from the state and I think I made in my email communication to you simply the observation that you can see that Amherst approach to this is an outlier it's my sense is very much an outlier that the state does not does not expect this degree of citizen participation so the flyer specifies things like engineer and I think that was the only I don't recall Sue's email in detail right now that I could bring it up she really didn't have anything specific to add other than engineering background and I'm not really I don't know that that's I don't know if anyone has that in front of them but I did put it in the packet Sue's contribution was essentially that you know some of the suggestions in the from the state were not applicable to this body for instance a counselor or government official and the other recommendations were highly technical we do have the IT person which the state will probably support but the only other one was someone with engineering background why I don't know I do not know let's not take that on because we don't you know that yeah I think it's so I would suggest that this just be deleted and that because I have to send this to understand this gets sent to the candidates to the people who applied I'm wondering if diversity of residency could be a little bit clear in the sense of you know represents the five districts or some of the diversity of residency essentially means members chosen from all five districts yeah change it to five just the district well but I just how do we want to phrase you could just say diversity of district residency yeah okay okay so I'm okay with the leaton the whole paragraph you had highlighted at some point yeah I think really you it doesn't tell them anything and so I'm going to delete it and what I'm asking you when we when we approve this if we approve it I would this is going to be sent to them along with the SOI document which we'll look at very briefly in a moment so experience on past redistricting committees I think that's legitimate I don't know that anyone of these candidates actually has it but I guess what this is saying is if you've had experience and it doesn't necessarily say where you should mention it okay availability seems appropriate the SOI actually asks them to explicitly acknowledge that they are available Darcy yeah I was going back and forth as to whether to even mention this but really speaking it doesn't seem like it seems like it would be nice to have maybe one at least one person who's done this before but this seems to say that anyone who does have experience would definitely have a preference so I it's fine to leave it but I generally speaking it feels like you know like if you were in before you're in now I don't think so Darcy I understand it but there are the we have one two three four other criteria right and I think I could easily say Smith has done this before and that's really valuable but when we look I mean in most cases we're probably looking at a pool of four or five people we might just see that that and we only can say choose to we might I mean I think we have enough room here to go either way I don't think this I don't read this is saying that you've done this before you're in right it certainly is a preference I think we'd certainly perk up if we had somebody like that but we'd also look at the other candidates and and with these criteria in mind and and we just talk about it we discuss it I mean in the end we will make a vote we will vote on each one of these so the other thing I would say is this at least gives someone you know an idea of what to talk about in their statement of interest you know and so hey if you've been on a redistricting committee at a state level or a local level tell us you know like let us know what your occupation is and how that might or you know or skills that you have that might help you draw maps you know and consider neighborhoods and stuff like that so I think it's more of a guidance on what to write in your statement of interest okay any other further thoughts I'd like to vote on this if we can but again I don't see but please raise your hand or speak up if you have other concerns I'm not seeing any I'm going to make a motion to adopt this this selection guidance for the district advisory board a second and many seconds any further thoughts or discussion that I'm going to go to vote the chair is going to begin this time the chair votes yes Mindy hi Sarah hi Pat hi Darcy thank you okay I'm going to save that and I'm going to put it back where it came from now we're going to look at the SOI description which is in and I am not making any recommended changes to this but I might look at it briefly and make sure you're excuse me okay with it the other thing I will send them is this description of what we expected the SOI it's a bit wordy I apologize but this is our boilerplate we have to not exceed 700 words we could change that to like 400 words or 300 words but at the moment it's 700 words the SOI shall describe why the applicant is interested in serving on the body and the relevant skills experiences they will bring to the body that align with the adopted selection guidance now this is the it shall include an explicit acknowledgement of the timeline and their availability is that clear enough maybe that's a little you know basically just what it's supposed to mean is we're asking them to we can take this out but what I felt was we should have everyone acknowledge the timeline that essentially it's from July through mid-October and that they're available now somebody doesn't acknowledge that in their SOI that doesn't mean we're going to throw them out but it does that means I have to reach out to them and confirm it what do people feel about that do they want it in do they want it out I think it's fine to keep it in George but I wonder if we want to use the word like commitment to the timeline or instead of just acknowledging it because or you just think acknowledging is fine because acknowledging means you got to be there right acknowledging means I'm aware that this is from mid-July through from July through mid-october it's it's not a year it's it's just those four months and I'm acknowledging that and I'm saying that I'm available and I understand that some people may very well not do that they may just you know just forget and that what we agree is that I would reach out to them just to confirm that you know in your SOI we asked you to do X but you didn't can you just confirm that we felt it was important so that's why it's here resumes and attachments are not being accepted I will establish a deadline the deadline I will give you in a moment but it's like it's they have like 12 or 14 12 days at least to do this unlike FinCon which we'll get to in a minute where they'll have six days because of the schedule so they will have ample time to do it but it is made clear that if they don't um is it stated in here or is it stated maybe it's not stated in here it is any so um and then it just tells them it's going to be posted and so they know and so any thoughts on this any changes any concerns again we don't need to vote on this but I just need to have your consent because I'm going to send this to them along with the other materials okay so no changes were made to that let's quickly look at the timeline here okay and then we'll be done with this I'm sorry I got so many things in front of me right now okay so this is what we're looking at um we've adopted the selection guidance we declared the pool sufficient um I'm going to send this out probably not today or tomorrow because I'm going to do FinCon today but I will send it out the next day or two um they will have until um June 14th to complete the SOI and my understanding is that anyone who um we're not closing applications so people can still apply and if they apply I would simply send them the relevant including the SOI stuff and tell them the debt that's all I'll do so we could get some more applicants um but the deadline for everybody is the date that the SOIs do which is June 14th okay I would post the SOIs and CAFs on uh June 15th is that correct CAFs also get posted is that correct Mandy that's right okay see it do not get posted to the public packet they get distributed to counselors the counselors already have copies of them so that is a mistake I post the SOIs but not the CAFs and CAFs distributed let me see two counselors I made that mistake before the committee members I guess is what it is um well no the CAFs go to the council too right now counselors need to see the CAFs they already have the CAFs um well they often I think Darcy made this point that often they don't I mean it's understandable I get so much I put for for CRC I put the CAFs in a separate folder in the SharePoint packet just collect them but they don't they don't get posted online so maybe post SOIs and CAFs well distributed counsel in this case on SharePoint what do you think again anyone speak up but this is partly for me so I don't just do what I probably would have done which is just the I think actually um Athena caught me actually the last time I did this she said excuse me Mr. Chair but CAFs are not public that is correct yes SOIs will be made public and my would be to send them to the counselors as well so they would be but man did you feel that just making the public is sufficient or do you feel like we should send them to that's a lot of SOIs coming to everybody's mailbox but so it's supposed to I think just send the packet notice I think the packet notice to the town counselor and then counselors can go and find it and they can go find them in the packet yeah June 23rd I'd like to have a special meeting just for this now we could do other business if we have time you've seen how things went today um but this would be the sole agenda item we would start with it and if we had time for anything else we would do it but this is the only thing we do we would have to discuss and go through and make a voting recommendation are you open to a June 23rd meeting I think the answer is yes but please pick up if not and then I would cancel June 30th to try at least um go ahead why cancel it we have three two meetings in a row so we'd have three weeks in a row and it just seems a bit much I agree Darcy if we have business that well for instance you might make the point appropriately that we're still working on the OCAP document and so you may feel that we should meet on the 30th um to devote ourselves to that um and so you would like to meet on the 30th well I would like to take yeah go ahead meetings in order to get through all this stuff because this is the third meeting this is the second meeting where we haven't gotten to the OCAP appointment process and it's the third meeting and that we had since starting and we were going to get back in two meetings so if it is always at the end of the agenda then we're never going to get to it well hopefully you agree with me today that I had no choice oh yeah no I get I'm sorry but yeah good so your point is you would like to meet on the 30th and that you would like the agenda item to be essentially um the OCAP process that we're reviewing thoughts on that in my college I'm going to support unfortunately meeting on the 30th um because it's not just something like that that needs done um CRC is going to be sending at least two bylaws one of which is already ready to come to GL for its clarity review which is the moratorium another one's going to come in the next two weeks which is and and those have hard deadlines for getting to the council for votes because of state law so might need to address some of that during some of these meetings too so I have two voices already saying they'd like to meet on the 30th anyone else uh I will survive it and I see the need for it okay so good I'm not going to cancel the 30th um we will meet on that date and okay uh anything else with related to this I think that's so let me just save that for myself I'm going to close that and now we need to do that I'm sorry I apologize to all of you but we need to do the same for FinCon this should hopefully go a little bit easier um because let's take a look let's see how we shouldn't speak too soon can I do that right can you make it a little bigger uh can you see that a tad bigger would be helpful I've read it that's all right let me see if I can make it better I gotta get my dog I'll be right back all right how's that the finance pool sufficient uh no we haven't okay so we have to do that and I thank you man that really probably should be done first um the pool now has six members in it um we've gotten a couple people who um when they filled out the uh the council CAF put all bodies down so I had no choice but to include them they've all been contacted um so we have six applicants we in theory we'll have to interview six people we'll talk about that in just a moment but um the pool has six it's more than adequate in terms of size one of them as you know is um up for is someone seeking my appointment so I'd like to make the motion that the pool for FinCon is sufficient till second thank you Mandy um I'm going to go to a vote the chair is a yes Mandy hi Darcy yes Sarah hi Pat hi it's unanimous we declare this the pool sufficient then com guidance um this is what we've used in the past excuse me selection guidance everyone can see it okay um the only thing I would only concern I have is changing term limits or should we use the phrase term limits and just say reappointments or should we just could we could we just delete the phrase that that those two words completely and just start the paragraph with generally I think that would be good okay I'm not against that I'm just I want to catch the eye of the reader who may or may not read this I'm I'm asking them to read it carefully um for obvious reasons but um maybe that's so if we do this we can just sorry so what we're suggesting is that George go ahead Darcy is there anything in the materials or the vacancy notice or anything that gives applicants the information that that a position in question is um that is a reappointment no um I feel that we really can't given our our policy we really can't do that um all we can do is um this open discussion that my feeling is all we can do is urge people to read the selection guidance and and hopefully they will read the part that we just highlight and just talk about so they're aware but what they don't you make good point Darcy what they don't know and I don't know how we can tell them is that one of the applicants is someone seeking reappointment and I guess it's a question can we is it permissible it's a statement of fact um but does it violate yeah go ahead isn't that public already it's it's not no it's not it really isn't um it only becomes public when um you know we post the uh the SOIs applicant names are never made public until SOIs are posted so until the SOIs are due there is no there's only a chair who has information that a potential a person who might be seeking reappointment has indicated they might seek reappointment that doesn't mean they'll actually submit the statement of interest until they do um our applicant pool is not closed until the due date of the statements of interest so I think it's inappropriate to say to any applicant who's expressed interest hey we know someone else's expressed interest that might be seeking reappointment but they haven't actually submitted anything yet so you know we can't say they have it or not like it just doesn't seem appropriate to me but is there there's only one person whose term is expiring right that's correct so and that's public because that person's going to actually submit an application is not public until that person until we post the SOIs right and I think it's just I hear you Darcy I know it's painful um because you well well I mean I guess what I mean is Pat that we will be interviewing yeah I guess the answer is what and the answer is no that's just the way it is and we interview as many people as present themselves and we follow our procedure I think that's what we have to do so I have to draw the painful part so um can we declare I guess I just need your agreement here we're not going to vote on this but you'd be a selection actually we do vote on selection guidance don't we sorry apologize is this acceptable to you are you ready to move to a motion and a vote or is there any other changes or concerns you have with this statement so my only other thing is in the second actual paragraph under the bullet points the first paragraph for the bullet points in addition the chair shall solicit from the chair of the finance committee input we haven't added any input from the chair should we then be deleting that whole paragraph that whole set uh is in fact the chair has not done that and that's because the chair is an idiot um well actually chairs I'm gonna I'm gonna refute that the chair is not an idiot the chair is overwhelmed with everything that needs done I completely understand hello I know I know but I also we could argue that you shouldn't do anything until he has your approval so and we haven't approved this yet so if you were to say that you wanted this then I would have to reach out I would reach out to the chair of finance and solicit but I think here we have so here what you're suggesting is deleting that sentence yeah let me just put a moment strike it I'm gonna delete it in a second but maybe yeah I think other members of the committee have expressed concern about this in the past or and I think for somewhat valid reason because the selection guidance is fairly explicit and we're talking about three individuals who are non voting members so I think the the concern was raised was that why should the chair of this committee have special input which this would seem to give them um with planning and with zoning it seems somehow different but maybe that's maybe I'm just splitting hairs but if we take this out this would be I mean this would be the selection guidance going forward until the next time we do this I don't have a problem with it do others have I mean especially in this context where I don't really have the time to do this a and b what guidance we've given in the past is already captured in this document and c in the future going forward why should the chair of this committee be given special input beyond what's already been given so I'm going to delete it is that acceptable I'm going to make a motion that we adopt selection guidance as amended is there a second second Swartz thank you Sarah any further discussion I'm going to go meet her to a vote start with Mandy hi Pat hi hi Darcy Sarah hi and the chair is yes so we have adopted this selection guidance and I'm going to put it away I'm going to now look at the schedule because this is going to be dicey I want you to be understand what we're doing and get your input so this is the schedule as it stands you see it all we have voter installation guidance we have determined the pool is sufficient my plan is and I need your approval my plan is to send this out later today um we include selection guidance and instructions how to complete the SOI the deadline would actually be June 8th we're doing that because so I'm giving them basically six days from today until Tuesday June 8th um so the deadline would be June 8th after that no one we considered um on because it's because of the ninth I have to post uh the SOIs and distribute I'm gonna get this right remember I'm gonna do this again George are you sending this to the candidates in one email uh each one gets a separate email I could send separate I could send you know multiple emails to the same person but generally I send one email saying you know I can show you the language that I've drafted essentially says we met today declared the pool sufficient we're not prepared to go to solicit SOIs and attach our X Y and Z namely the committee charge um you know a description of the committee and the description of SOI and you must get this back to me by June 8th no later than June 8th is there do you think that it makes sense to require them to confirm that they received it so that if they don't do that you'll know that there's a problem I'm just you know the problem being that um I mean the only problem yeah I mean in other words that they just don't get the email at all in other words I sent yeah and they just um if I could put in this I don't have it right now but I could have a send he says please confirm that you have received something to that effect that seems like it would be good plus a really good topic line for both this and the DAP you know to you know either all caps or something no I understand right especially for this one because the timeline is tight so another option instead of just confirming receipt of the email is ask them to confirm their availability um for at least for finance their availability for interviews on June 9th or um that they'll decline to be interviewed something like that yeah I that is in the document as the draft email um and so I guess Darcy that would be the other way to deal with this I do tell them that we're actually doing actually doing the interviews on the 16th all right so um and it's during our this again I need your approval as a committee but I'm hoping that we will do them during our regular uh committee meeting and that the 16th meeting will be devoted probably exclusively to Fincom I don't see how we can get around that so 16th would be Fincom we have uh six interviews could be more if um anyone else gets in under the deadline I hope not but at the moment it could be six depending on if people fill out the SOI or not it's possible that someone reading the selection guidance and doing their due diligence would say oh you know but if whatever so we have potentially six interviews 15 minutes each and then a uh discussion and vote after that on the 16th and it's this and the 16th is as soon as we can do it because I can only post the SOIs on the 9th and so I guess answer your question Darcy the thought would be I would in there I would say um we do interviews they will be done on soon they will be done on the 16th during our regular um council you know during our regular meeting please notify me that well actually I just tell them that Mandy um the state of emergency ends June 15th and if Governor Baker's emergency legislation to extend the waiver of the open meeting laws does not pass we have to do them in person so I would not guarantee I think you need to talk to Lynn and Paul about how you notice this meeting that's supposed to be up well in advance without knowing uh I don't know what to do with that I mean I hear you I'm gonna have to do that I think you need to talk to Paul yeah okay I mean I don't know what he can tell me except I mean I would just do meetings in person if people can attend in person because then you don't have to worry about legislation getting passed or not um because if you notice it for zoom and the legislation doesn't pass we move to in person yeah and I think this is the other thing we need to consider I don't have a problem with that we could just make it in person um but if someone can't make it and I understand people working etc etc I don't see I don't see how we can um say oh I'm too bad well so we we might have to be in person as a committee we could always accept someone to call in for the interview but we the committee might ourselves have to be in a room together due to when okay all right because I don't think it's been extended yet I know he's filed legislation to do so but that actually needs some votes and the hearings were today all right I will check with Paul on this um oh Athena's better hand raise go ahead Athena please hey no they haven't had a vote on the um legislation to extend the remote participation through September 1st yet um but we could I and things are like you said Mandy kind of still up in the air but we can we can update those locations just like if a meeting were changed from one room to another we could update that the posting to a different location if we needed to so I don't want that to hold you up um I'm more concerned about the poor interviewees um who I just you know can I do this from my home on zoom and the answer seems to be no matter what the state decides the answer could be yes we might have to be in in person in town hall but they could still do it remote is that correct um so everything is up in here it is is working really hard I've been working with them a little bit about doing a hybrid um that's definitely the plan for council meetings if we have to be in person starting on the 15th I don't know for sure that we're going to have dedicated IT staff to help us do every committee meeting as a hybrid because it's a little bit more staff intensive than um than these fully remote meetings and I'm sorry I also have to let you folks know to please wrap up I need the room okay sorry like in like like yesterday you need the yes please okay do my best here um I'm sorry I apologize I apologize to our note taker as well um all right so that's something I'm going to have to deal with thank you very much thank you um so stop share we have done everything that we do not have the main 19 minutes I do not think um but that's not a problem we want to we've agreed to meet on the 30th so that's been settled any questions from the committee about what's transpiring next the next time we meet we'll be interviews for the uh income okay I'll be sending out materials and hopefully my only last thought my only concern is if we have someone who simply cannot meet during the 10 30 12 30 slot either remotely or in person we probably would be obligated to arrange some kind of evening session right but why don't we leave that open just let you know just that's a possibility I do everything in my power to prevent it but that's a possibility okay I would just make note that we don't have public for public comment thank you um I don't know if anyone remembers but the last meeting I actually forgot I don't know if anyone remembers that I did afterwards I thought oh my goodness we just got asked to leave the rooms thank you all thank you Athena thank you Emily thanks everybody bye bye if I close out as co-host I'm not going to kick you out am I oh no I no I'll have to reopen