Let's get started. So quick agenda review. Does anyone have anything that they want to change, modify, add to the agenda, remove from the agenda? Happy with the agenda. Twice three times. All right. Looks like we're good. So I've decided to, instead of doing full introductions now, just if folks, the first time you talk during the meeting, introduce your just say your name. And then folks can then go to the meeting notes and see like who you're affiliated with. That gives us just a little bit more time because we're always sort of coming up the edge like that. But at least that way people know who is talking. I always laugh because I look at the CNC F videos and they don't have any descriptions. No links to the particular working group that's that's having the meeting. They don't link to their meeting notes and no description of who the people are. So you always have to like dig around and do a search for everything. All right. So jumping into it. Let me share my screen. All right, so folks should see the meeting notes. And again, don't forget to put your name and the attendees there. So the Dean couldn't make it today. So he's got a couple of notes here that he wanted to make us aware of 4.7 stable was released last week. He's focusing on 48 nightlies now the stability on fixing the 47 to 48 upgrade issues to promote 48 to stable. And stuff is tackling that right there, which needs look this up. I see Linux expertise is closed, not a bug. What do we have here after OKD has updated to Fedora. So let's go to SC Linux policy 399 on or two careers to start failing. And in essence. Yeah, it looks like so SC Linux looks like this is a conversation on different perceptions of how it should be implemented for months. So let's get this out. If folks want to have a convert larger conversation about that, we can do so. But Vadim didn't want to bring it to our attention. And Mustafa is that one. Is it something that we need to reach out to Dan wash about he did put that comment in there and I think there was a response, but he hasn't responded yet. So let's let's wait to see what his response is. Sorry, does anyone know who JSA frame is at red hat.com I don't know that recognize that email address. Okay, look at that one up. Timothy says no major notices so no, no updates no major updates seems. Yeah, we don't have anything specific happening. What it's, it's summer so things are going slowly. Yeah, no major opening on the rock west side. And a little bit about Doc stuff. So, let's see. Take a quick look and see who's on here. This Brian on his. Oh yeah, Brian, you want to go ahead and talk a little bit about the path forward that we've decided to take in terms of the new site. Yeah, sure. So, we've been having a number of discussions in the Docs working group about the ok d.io site, what it's for what it should be for. And one of the challenges is it's not easy to update the technology and that's being used means you need to be really a full web front end developer to be able to add content. As the as a community front door, we thought that that's not really where we want to be. So we're exploring a technology called mk docs, which allows you to write pure markdown. And it does allow extensions so you can add sort of richer features, things like tabs, and things like tables that look like the proper tables not with sort of minus and equal sign in an ASCII format. And we can create sort of banners with warnings or information type things. So there are a few extensions that we use to markdown. But the idea is that anybody should be able to pick up the technology within a few minutes. Markdown is a technology that drives get so hopefully everybody should be able to get on board with that. And we've also been looking at using maybe GitHub automation to actually do the do the publishing. And that that's what I do and there are other communities I work with and that's the way we've gone. So just pushing to the main branch will actually publish the updates on to GitHub pages, which we can then use a C name to link to ok d.io. So it becomes a sort of maintenance free front door and then we can then open it up to the community to really make that our own front page where we can actually start putting a lot more information on there. And the idea is that you want to consolidate so we don't have content spread over multiple places and it's a bit of a guess where this got put and competition to find anything. So I did create on my own personal gate, I sort of a proof of technology that I took the working group through last week. And if you go look at the replay, you'll actually see that and probably post the link into the chat after I finished. But the idea is that we're now going to create a beta branch within the okd repo and that will then become a beta. And there's a lot of things that we need to work out in terms of the styling, the colors, how you want the site to look and feel. I think we want it to be a little bit simpler. There's a lot of bootstrap animation in there, which just adds complexity to the actual structure of the site. So we want to just make it a little bit simpler. And I'll just, Brian, I'll let you know that I did talk to the folks who own or control the CNAME and as soon as we're ready, they're quite happy to move the CNAME DNS over. So we just have to pull the trigger when you were ready. They're actually thrilled that we're doing this. So one less website for them to worry about. Brian, can you throw the link in the chat and then I'll put it into the meeting? Yeah, I'm just trying to, I'm just getting it now. And while Brian's doing that, here's a quick link to or quick update on some other things that were added. So I've pushed some changes and some other folks pushed some changes. Community now goes to the discussion functionality of the Git repo for OKD. Recipes is still there, but we talked about sort of merging that into some of the other documentation. I thought we had decided to get rid of recipes completely. Well, there are two there. And so my thought was taking, so if you click on this, there's taking these two and then moving them into the guide. Well, both of those, both of those may be stale too. If they are linking back to my GitHub, I had put those there just kind of as an example of how to make it work. Yeah, that's exactly what that is. Yeah, we either need to rally some community folks around reading more of those or. I think the consensus was we're going to just stick with guides and the recipes stuff was there. So I would just chop this off right there and drop that off and and take it off there and just keep it simple. And there you go. Sorry, just to follow up on that. I mean, I'm really interested in getting the RookSafe working on OKD. So it's where do we see that going? I know ideally we'd want a community operator that's in the OKD community operator hub eventually. But I think there are little things like that that will save people a lot of time when they're trying to set up an environment. So what I might do, Charo is E introduce you and your link here to Annette Clouet and Travis Nelson, the two folks behind Rook and that and see if we can get someone from that community to work with us. I'm getting updating it saying, hey, this is obviously out of date and in a little stale. Is there anyone that you know there? If I did that email intro, Charo, can you walk them through what you've done? And then maybe we can get them to convert it into one of the guides rather than they probably have. They've done a ton of demos for me on OCP in the commons and in combination. So I think that might be the route and that would help. And Brian, I can CC you on that too if you're interested in that. And then we can just start a thread with them because they may have a resource in their Rook community who has done it or is willing to do it with us rather than us making up as we go along. Not that we do that, but. So one thing we may want to be mindful of is so this right now and in the new site is installation. And so these are deployment guides for actually deploying. Okay D so we may want to. Somehow modify this connect connection of ideas, because once you start getting into deploying particular apps or particular technologies on the cluster, that's not the same thing as installing the cluster. So we want to tease that out. All right, so we'll be dropping this community was changed blog documentation goes here. Now, does it make sense for us to select the version anymore if latest is always four and three is no longer supported. I mean, we can talk about this at the doxming that I want to run. If you look at the beta site, I do. That page is gone. We just straight them straight to the documentation. That makes sense. Okay, so there's a new guide. Something is that available in the old version still and not on the new version like how can you change ingress controllers and this kind of stuff what you can do about that. Like, like, like, basically diffs between like explaining the differences. Do you mean. No. This, the ingress controller stuff doesn't exist in the okay for that right. If someone wants to change that what should they read. Are you asking about changing out the ingress controller for a different ingress operator. In the docs of the okay before. There's no instructions about the ingress controllers and stuff. Yeah, I think it assumes that you're going to use routes or roots rather than the Kubernetes ingress. Yeah. I think that is the assumption. Yeah, that's true. The official red hat open shift documentation has instructions for using Kubernetes ingress if you choose to. But the preferred method is through the ingress operator was with routes. So, I mean, maybe one thing we could do is create a document and this again could be tackled at the documents meeting but a document that outlines some of these changes for folks to help them. Get over to for and understand for just document where we can throw ideas into it. But I mean, even if you go to straight to the documentation for I don't know whether you can bring it up if the links in the chat to my site. Oh, whoops. Did you put the link in the chat. There we go. It's like looking for one. Okay, so if you go to documentation there. If you land straight on for but if you now hit the documentation for edge Chrome link. You get back to the. So you still do have access to all of the previous versions. It's just that we land you in the for content now directly. That makes sense. And maybe during the docs mean we will have a discussion about maybe we could do a quick little one page. You know, guide for folks coming from three. About things like, you know, Ingress controller. Versus operator and routes and stuff like that. Just little tidbits that might be helpful to help folks make that transition. And they can go back here if they if they want to still needing to work with three reason. All right, so this is, yeah, let me go back here. So this is Brian's example that he provided. He's on the side and it's got search and stuff. If you want the video will be posted down in the next couple days. Folks can watch the video meeting because Brian does like a whole walk through and it's cool. So, um, oh, and so this is I was going to ask this to the larger group because it came up at the docs meeting. And we sort of made an assumption but now I'm wondering if maybe it maybe it wasn't the best assumption. So the idea was, okay, we can put the meeting notes and other working group docs into the okd.io repo. The problem with that is there not problem but a complexity of that mean is that people who maybe have access to the site will also have access to the repo to make changes to meeting related stuff. Do we ever envision a time where there'd be people doing work on the website where we wouldn't necessarily want them fussing about with meeting notes and stuff like that. Or the, you know, any other like actual working group documentation. That's a downside I see. I guess the question is, are we still going to maintain, I mean, I don't know what red hat policy is, but do we still have to maintain the sort of pull request model where a red hat has to, do we want an, an approver to have to approve any changes I think that's probably a safe option. So any changes to okd becomes a pull request. What, what, what you and I have access to do approvals right. Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, maybe we have three people Diane and then like two others, you know, so the co-chairs and then like third person like Brian, and then three people can do approvals on those. Then yeah, then that would avoid any, any issues I think with someone accidentally clobbering stuff. Anyone else have thoughts on that? Issues. So, what's come in in the past couple days, resolved through. Okay, so here's a couple of CRC one suddenly there was a several CRC related issues which relate to build. We got those. Okay, so nothing else new pending in terms of issues and now going to discussion items. Yeah, I feel like we should in discussions we talked about this in the in the docs meeting is in discussions have like templates pop up so when you select a like a q amp a have a template pop up so we'll have to do some discussion on how to get that set up because people really need to include log bundles a lot. Or at least provide some basic, like what version are you using what cloud provider that's a big one like what cloud provider are you. This is john. So, yeah, I've got a question about why this to me would seem to be an issue. I thought it would be open and issues and it's in discussions. I guess I'm kind of confused as how how Vadim is, because I've seen that he's moved a lot of stuff that seem to be issues to me that should be in the issues portion into the discussion side so we kind of lose that issue template type of thing. So, do we have a do we have a rhyme or reason why we're putting issue type things in discussion. I think, and don't quote me on this I'd hate to speak for him but my sense was he was getting a lot of stuff that was, or that in general, the stuff coming into the issues queue was stuff that maybe wasn't an actual issue or people had questions that could be triaged in a way that did not involve modifying code or bug fixes or anything. And then what he's been doing is as I noticed is, if a discussion is is sort of vetted to be something that's an actual issue then he says please file an issue here. So, that's how he's done it but I mean he's one person and we are the working group and so books. Because I've seen that a lot of the issues have been moved to discussions. But it almost seemed to be the default and I'm just wondering if that's how we really want to do it, because to me discussions are a higher level thing. When we're talking about, you know, install processes or your or there's something that's affecting a lot of people, you know, that, you know, we have a lot of discussion on. To me that would, this one would be an issue at least start off as an issue. But I was just curious because I noticed that over the last few weeks that had happened. So, I just wasn't sure if there was a decision made or something that had said we're going to we're going to put a lot of this stuff into discussions. I was just curious. I think that was something that he did he can speak to it more to do folks have thoughts on it in terms of I mean because. So, one of the things we want to do any board or committee needs to do is sort of separate the needs of the group from like, okay, this one individual is to be in this position. Jamie. Yeah. Yeah, I guess one question is. Is issues intended to be bug reports. My sense is that's where he was going with this is that issue bug reports on code. Yeah. Yeah, so in many cases. When something happens to you don't know if it's your fault or. A bug report, you know, so it's reasonable to have a discussion first before you open an issue if issues are intended to be bug reports. And in the past that's often been slack where something like that. And after some discussion Vadim says, okay, open an issue and then you go ahead and open an issue that's not going to be immediately closed. But and I think that we've sort of been moving that more to this discussions group. So I think that's sort of what's going on there. Like either way, no matter where it gets opened, it appears in them in, you know, if you've subscribed and it appears in your inbox. Yeah, I thought one of the ideas we were trying to adopt is that the discussion area is where community members can that that's our initial meeting place so if they want to ask for help. If they want to get clarification of things going away from the support. This is the forum where community end user community members meet to sort of communicate with each other. And then once we've identified that there is a potential bug that then we will move it to the and I think we were we copied that from one of the other open source communities where we saw that they did exactly the same. They put the community link directly to their discussion. So I think that's where the idea came from. Okay, I like I said, I was just curious that I noticed that over the last few weeks that what I what we were seeing as issues before are now are now going to discussions that if that's where we're going to make sense. But maybe that's something that needs to be described or pinned somewhere that says before you open an issue open a discussion first or something. And people don't know that. That's all I got. Okay. Thank you. That's great. Minor follow up thing, would it be worth it creating a separate category on the side there. A lot of people's like sort of support triage when they're q amp a which maybe better serve by having like a support category. No, I didn't get how to let you do that. But we would want different nomenclature because there's a strong. I would say push from red hat folks and the sponsors of okay D to not use the word support, because then it implies that they are entitled to support with with it. If we can come up with a different word challenges. Help. Help. Someone needs it. Yeah, help, maybe just help help help versus support support sounds like there's a backing organization. That's, you know, technical support help. Help is good. We do like community help. Like that. Something like that. Yeah. All right, well, we'll throw that around a little bit more and see where it goes. Is anyone opposed to the idea of stuff going to discussion. And then issues getting filed afterward is that's determined to be. An actual code issue anyone have any. Anyone not think it's a good idea. Feel free to share an opposing point of view. You know, open a discussion about it. No. Well, not hearing anything. So let's, let's, and we'll have the Dean at the next meeting, maybe flesh out his thinking more, but pretty sure that's where he was going is trying to keep that as issues as just actual bugs. Okay. So, did we miss any, by the way, I should go back here and see, okay, do you install fail yesterday. And they're asking you to debug their log file. Yes. All right. Well, what we're going to, can you go on to that person's profile. Just for a quick click through to see where this is their very first there's probably a student, I think it looks like it with study. Yeah. I know. Okay. All right. Well, we'll, I'll take a look and other folks should take a look at as well. Vadim's been like really strapped for time. And if we can get more community members tackling these, that would be awesome. I mean, and if you don't have time to dig through someone's log. That's understandable, but if it has some time, you know, Jamie, there may need to be a gentle reminder in the Slack channels about calling people out directly. There's been a few over the last few days directly to Vadim again. Yeah. And Vadim is sort of sometimes he'll respond and just go with the flow. I think it's if he knows the person maybe but other times he'll be like, you know, it's rude to tag me. I will post something again, and we should maybe can put something in the description about that. Oh, this is the same person. Both of these are the same discussion item. Why is he doing it? Okay, 45 at some point are we going to say we don't support 45 and 46 anymore? We haven't really had that discussion actually I had that on here before I knew that Vadim was going to be coming was a migration path outline and support outline and since he's not here. I don't know that we'd be able to have a technically informed discussion about it. I do think that that's a good idea. I think it's probably a pretty easy answer isn't it and that we don't technically support any releases. We, we will help with something we're familiar with but you know, I think it would be fair. I recommend that they at least try it with a more recent release. When was the first GA wasn't the first GA 46 or was it 45? I don't remember or 4.4 or 4.3 was the first GA 4.4 maybe was 4.4. But even then like, there's no concept like of like separate release channels or anything like that. You just get a release on the train whenever Vadim puts it out and you upgrade to it. So, yeah, I'm kind of a charo on this. I don't think we should. We should encourage people to think that, oh, they're separate parallel supported release branches. I do think it would be helpful to have a migration path because there are some people who are on like very early, earlier, earlier versions of OKD4 that want to be able to go to 4.7. And there are certain versions of 4.6 that do not go to 4.7, etc. And so I think having that matrix laid out would be helpful for folks that do want to get to the latest. But in some versions there are blockers that don't allow you to go directly. So, generally, what happens, but you material here speaking from the federal court side. Generally what happens on OCP is that you update from one major to the next measure don't skip major releases. Unless I'm completely missing something that also applies to OKD. So I would recommend users move from 4.5 to 4.6 and then for 4.6 to 4.7, then for 7 to 4.8 and that gets released. The general idea that when you move from one release to the other, you have some you move essentially from one communities release to the next one. Which means that some APIs get deprecated, some gets updated, some gets removed. So you have to make sure that everything works and you do that. And the HCD version changes and things like that. So the configuration may change. You want to make sure that every time you move from one release to the next one, you've fully updated all your configuration and everything until before you move even further to the next one. You don't really, there's no support anywhere. We don't test that moving from one OCP release directly to another one, like skipping releases. So I would not recommend users do that. And on the other side of support, even though we don't, it's not support anything below 4.6 is completely even unsupported on the red out side. So we're talking about anything supporting anything below 4.6 in OCD is I'll say completely not happening, most probably. Awesome. Thank you. All right. Also, by the way, yeah, no, just just that. This is a 4.5 install fail, not an upgrade fail. So I think you could reasonably, you know, like. If the person is going off some blog post. It is installing 4.5 a reasonable rejoinder would be to say. Don't install that one. You know, you have to install at least.  Yeah, I can. So for example, we have a in the open shift users. There's a question that came in yesterday morning that is, is it correct that there is currently no migration path from current OCD 4.6 to a current 4.7. The last working migration seems to have been for 6 to 14 2021. I don't know that that's true. I'm pretty sure that more recent versions. Upgrade. Yeah, I think there might have been issues with certificates and stuff that broke at a certain point. Yeah, that was exactly when that wasn't, you had to do a force. I know that's what I've had to do. I haven't had to do in a while. But I know there were a couple of versions where because of tagging or church. And that was early or late winter, basically early spring, but that was fixed within like. It was like four weeks or so or five weeks that was all cleared out with a new release of. Let me look into that and then I'll chat with the demon as well and see if we can't. I don't know if there's a clear answer on that and I'll look back on some of the notes, just so that we can respond to this question. That's I mean, yeah. And I seem to recall, I seem to recall. Working with people like in may, you know, that had issues with with doing certificates. You know, because they weren't they weren't tagged right or whatever, but maybe it was before that time kind of compresses a little bit. Yeah, I think it was the upgrade issue with that was earlier than that. Yeah. All right. Very cool. Moving on now to code ready container status so just to lay the foundation for this discussion. We got two tickets in on code ready containers. There's some things that need updating at the box meeting. There was a discussion. And actually at the last, I think full group meeting discussion about getting code ready containers up to snuff and having multiple people who can help with it to make sure that there's always a updated release and that there's good documentation whatever. So Charo has been awesome. Just like beyond belief and his supportive CRC stuff. But his time is getting taken by other great things. And so it seems like something the community to handle. I sent out an email. So reach out to Charo Charo responded to me hey get round up any people who are interested. And you know we can do a show and tell type thing. I said something out we got an initial like eight people that are folks that are sort of in and out of the working group. Like in terms of participation and then we just in the past two days got eight responses from people that haven't really participated in the working group. Because this was posted. I posted my email on the Google group. And so there's eight people who aren't really affiliated with the working group in terms of contributing to it or maintaining anything. So the thought is maybe this could be their entry point. But I think what we'll do is maybe take the first because that's like 16 people take the first eight, which includes like myself, Mike McHugh. So it's sort of the regulars that are here at this meeting and whatnot. We'll work with Charo and then from there, educate outward and and come up with something so that this doesn't become something that Charo is burdened with. And that's the foundation Charo. Go ahead and take it away from there and talking about what you want to do. Excellent. Okay, so I. I'm preparing documentation. How I build code ready containers. For OKD. It's actually in the one of the links that I just posted. There's very little documentation there it's at this point just a bash barf of what I run through to build it. What I'd like to do with the interested folks, maybe if Amy and Diane, if you guys could help coordinate like an ask me anything session with those folks. We can we can take like an hour hour and a half. I'll find some to carve out. The one walk through how it works. It's it's very automatable. I just don't have a place to automate it, except in my home lab. And it is. In that when the downstream, the sidestream project for red hat code ready containers makes code changes. It often breaks the OKD bill and so like for instance, I have a new release to push out this afternoon after I test the executables make sure they work. But I had to make code changes to both the SNC project and the CRC project. Get it to work again. So I'm going to submit a pull request. Yeah, I'm to, you know, so that it's refreshed for working with OKD. One of the things we're going to need to do as a community is get in tighter association with the engineers. They're building red hat CRC. They're great guys. Easy to work with. So they're not they're not going to have any problem with that. In fact, they'll welcome help because I've actually. Cross a few bugs that we're going to bite them. Red hat coro it so that they'll definitely be very welcoming of any additional help. But do you want to do this? So. I mean, there's there's a lot of ways we can do this 1 it might what but what helps for the the documentation process. The best so that like that core group that Jamie was talking about. We can host this as by by John. I have 1 quick question for John before you go. If you have a 2nd. Or is he gone? He might be gone. Well, get them later. So what I was hoping. Was a just to facilitate this like we can do this as an Openshift Commons briefing and you can walk through what you've done. The other question I have is when. Where you get the code from the Red Hatters, how public is the code to do these builds? Like, are you being gifted? No, it's totally it's totally open source here. I'll post it. Actually, I think if you roll roll down just a little bit. Let's see no scroll up. I'm sorry. Find the get clones. Right there. The last 2 lines in the section above. The 2 get clones. That's where that's where the code is so. S and C builds the single node cluster. That you then tear down and build a queue cow. Disc image out of and then you and then you compile CRC CRC is written and go. You compile CRC and embed the queue cow image in CRC. That's how you get code ready containers. It's basically a stripped down disk image of a single node cluster virtual machine that's been shut down. And then bundled with that with the CRC executable that allows you to start it and stop it. Magic was it. Yeah, so. So to do and this is for Jamie too. So if we were going to. We could do an AMA on this where and I don't know when you'd be ready for any Friday like we would do for a community office hour. We could do this any Friday at 9am and we could also live streaming on Twitch and invite everybody to it, but I could host it sort of as.  Girls, whoever we can coerce being the presenters and then there's a Q and a queue so that they can ask questions and you can answer them as you go. And that's I think that's a better facility for this. It's actually better than the zoom because it actually lets you queue up the questions and ask them and records the questions and answers. If I mean, even this Friday, I could do it at 9am if you were ready to do it and we could invite everybody who came and then maybe what we do is make the core group of people that Jamie was referring to. As co presenters so that they their faces could be on stream and everybody else who asked about it. Just invite them to come and watch as you went through it. If you're ready for this Friday or the following Friday, whenever. Let's tentatively plan for the following Friday. I'm actually taking off work from my day job. Thursday and Friday I had to defer my recharge day. So I'm actually taking off from from my day job Thursday and Friday and Monday. The 27th you're thinking. Yeah, so I'm actually planning to the reason I went ahead and posted this in my new blog site was to go ahead and get it out there for a few people that have been asking me directly about it. My plan over the weekend is to finish documenting it. So that it's, it's a little more polished. I'm actually going to drop it as a blog post as well. Next Friday then we. Why don't we try for the following Friday and I can put it on the calendar as an Open Shift Commons briefing. Okay, D working group. Whatever thing so it'll get some other eyeballs as well. And then the group of people Jamie, if you can send me that list, I will make them co presenters or you and Mike and everybody else in the event. So that you can be on screen and you can add your two cents. It's not all Charo talking all the time. And just work it through it and if you need to take more than an hour, like if it takes two hours to do it. That's fine too. Does it does it have to be nine Eastern. Right. No, it's that would be noon Eastern. Oh, I live in Pacific Standard Time me and Bruce over here. Where are the. I was wondering when you said nine, I was thinking you're not. I can do noon Eastern, but I have to be done. I will have to drop it one even if you're not done. I can actually. Yeah, it's good if you could try and do it in an hour, but that's, that's fine with me and I'll book it and do that so. That's cool. I am putting it on my. You, you're going in. Shortly. I've also got actually another internal red hat. Who is that so that we can. Name is Brett just a minute. Brett TOEFL. T O FEL. He's a. He's 1 of the senior software engineers is actually working on. O L M stuff. So I also talked to him about.  Get them to start building the operators with the container images as manifests instead of tags. Cool.  Eventually look at. And this is definitely looking this over. This is definitely very easily automatable. And I think if we just find a. Server or even a cluster, this could be done on a cluster. That's willing to host it and I may be able to do that. Then we could just have this automatically.  You know, this is going to break okay. Yeah, it's actually, it's a it's a 3 step process. The 1 piece that I haven't added to it yet is kind of a sanity check in between the 2 steps to ensure that the cluster is healthy. And actually, if we if we get this running somewhere with a with a CI CD process, hey pause for just a minute because if you at the very top of this code block that you're on, see that curl command. That's actually grabbing as a and setting as an environment variable because passing as an argument the current release of okay D so this this thing running would actually be be running continuous build tests. So, you know, it's not testing AWS or GCD or that, but it still would be a good sanity check of a current or an upcoming okay D release to ensure that it can build all the way up to a running single node cluster. I like this. This is good. Thank you, Charles. This is great. All right. Looks like we've got our work cut out for us. We've got 10 minutes left in the meeting. So let's see if there's anything else. One more thing on the agenda. I'm just because I'm just curious if anybody who's on the call or anybody's watching this afterwards is going to planning on attending Kubecon. If you're going to be willing or interested in giving an end user case study talk at commons on the day before Kubecon at the same location it's co located there. Please ping me. I'm looking for more folks to chat and to share their stories so if you have one and you're planning on going. And then to be a hybrid event. So, just in case they they close us down and we can't be in person in LA I'm I am going to host it on hop in so if you have a story that you want to share. Let me know reach out to me my emails there. I'd be happy to have a an OKD another OKD story on the menu at that event trying to close the agenda by the end of this month so let me know soon. So Jamie, if you've got one or Bruce or Brian or I know you guys are homelabby kind of folks for a large part but and that's what I was going to hit John Fortin about. See if we can get market America on stage so somebody we got rode in Schwartz last time but then he disappeared from the working group afterwards because he got too busy so I'm not sure that's the right thing to do. But anyways that was my ask so if you have or you know of somebody who might be willing in your travels Charo. That's we're up and we're on the hunt again and it's it's it's looking like it will happen in person. Good gone so get your seatbelts ready and your travel packs and we'll see if Canada lets me out of the country. Excellent. All right. The other thing that we sort of skipped over is. Operator catalogs. What I wanted to find out is what the status was of the internal effort to there's like a handful of operators actually that there's an internal effort to put into a community version. Such as serverless and pipelines and whatnot. I don't know what the status of that is. I was going to ask but it'd be good to find out. And then also where the community can start. So the idea is that if we go to the tagged issue up here the wish list. You know these are the ones that are currently unavailable and when I asked about he mentioned that there's an internal effort on these. It'd be nice to know where that's at and who we might need to bug to get that moving forward because there's a lot of requests for these. You know, and you can do the install from scratch, but it's nice to be able to have it show up in your list of operators. I also think that's the key inhibitor to people adopting OKD because with OCP. If I can go instead of my full cloud native environment in a blessing an hour. I've not yet managed that on OKD because every operator I hit it's it's a little bit of a challenge and I'm gradually trying to work through things and but it's. I think it was as easy. It was an OCP. I think we get a lot more usage of OKD. So here's a good example, right? Like if you've got a production cluster or even a true, you know, dev cluster where you really want to monitor stuff or QA or anything. You're going to want persistent logging through the operators. You need these two to get open shift logging going, right? You need the elastic search in the cluster logging operator together installed. And again, you can do it manually, but it's it's a big difference being able to go through the hub and the catalog and be able to get those in serverless. Same thing. The GitLab operator as well. So, alright, let's put that on the agenda for next meeting and we'll get an update on that and see who we can talk to about parking a little fire to get those done. Other thing that I wanted to get a sense of it from Vadim or whomever Christian isn't here either, but what can we do to start these ones that need to get need to be made available like pipelines and stuff like that. Like, do we just select a handful of people to tackle it. And, and this group, I think needs to think about what we can do to start a process of roping people in or getting people to be violent, getting people to volunteer to get these operators built and into catalogs. I think, I think one of the challenges that the diamond countering is the build process seems to be this sort of mythical thing within red hat that it's not easy to find out from an outside in point of view of how they build them. And, and often there are secondary sort of containers that are in the entitled registry. So I'm looking at the GT, someone has actually gone and done a great GT operator, and it works on OCP, but it uses the RBAC proxy from registry.redhat.com. So I can't put it on a KD because it's got that entitled registry container and it's then I've now got to go and work out how to recompile that and do it. So I think there's a lot of cases like that where there is some internal dependency within red hat. I don't know whether it's intentional, but we sort of hit that sort of. The challenge that I'm saying as I've worked with a few of the operator communities is that I think it's less that there's an internal process and more that there isn't. Each of, because each of the operators start, you know, start their lives as an upstream project and the way they're built doesn't follow a. Inch and much less a standard. And so if, you know, if the person that started working on like, for example, the get to operator, if, if they were in a entitlement base and they're pulling from registry. They just didn't realize they were hard locking it and it required a sub set of using the the quay.io version of the exact same container. But I've had to do surgery on a few and then open issues to say, hey, you might want to use this image instead of that one. And I think the Tecton operator would be one that we'd really want to get, you know, pipelines actually working. Because that's something that's sort of fundamental, right, is getting that pipeline working. When that says available in the upstream catalog, does that does that literally mean there is an upstream catalog you can enable and go get it or does that mean go to this. Go to this get hub. It means you need to have the entire board. Right. Okay, I'll. I'll post it. It's actually really easy to build the Tecton operator for OpenShift and install it. You can do it in just a few commands with a with a few dependencies if you have a go development environment setup on your Linux or MacBook. I haven't read it from Windows because I don't have any Windows. So I can at least people that are waiting for Tecton, I can close that get pretty quickly because I've been running it for a while and. That'll be really helpful. I will. Yeah, actually I was waiting until next week for my weekly blog post to get Tecton running and. Those actually look pretty straightforward. Yeah, it is. There's, there's a couple of undocumented steps that you need to do to set some. Variables, but it will actually build and then push it. It'll push the images to whatever registry you want it to push them to and then it will apply the the CRDs and manifest to your OpenShift cluster. So, Charo, can you make a pull request or log an issue against this document to add in those things that are. Yeah, yeah, I'm going to. Okay, I want to be mindful of folks time because we're at the hour. So let's call it and then we've we've got our homework set out for us. We'll be right back up until the next meeting and Charo. Thank you so much for helping with CRC and helping with operators and doing that legwork for us. Very much appreciate it. I've definitely got one last thing. Oh yeah. Diane, can we update the Slack headers to stop pointing people at the Google mailing list. What link do you want me to replace if you could. If you go through the Slack communities, you added in that block at the top as part of the channel description. Technical support go to the Google groups. What would you what would you like it to read? Let's let's come up with something on the mailing list or in chat and then we'll we'll hack at that. Give me something to cut and paste and I will cut and paste and we'll just do that. All right, I have a couple of things I have to do for you guys right away. So look for those the blue jeans thing to come out, Charo with you and Jamie and I'll include Fred TOEFL in there too. Just to scare him. I told him it was coming because I talked to him this morning. All right. I like scaring our red headers. Thanks again, Jamie for doing this and it's always a pleasure. Take care guys.


This study investigates the effects of chitosan on sweet basal growth and physiological parameters under salinity stress, revealing that chitosan improves sweet basal tolerance to salinity by influencing genes involved in the phenylpropanoid pathway to produce secondary metabolites. This article was authored by Nastron Rashidi, Ramazan Ali Qavari Nijad, Parvin Ramak and others.


I'm Joey from Augur at Pantera, and we're going to go through Augur B2 in Yon. So the idea behind Augur really is to provide, oh this is actually going forward on its own, okay. So the idea behind Augur is to provide, you know, universal access to tools that increase the tech wealth through financing that. And so this really goes back to this concept of anybody, anywhere in the world should be able to create a financial market, and on whatever they want. So that could be anything from a force race to a soccer match, whether Trump will be impeached, or the price of Tesla, the Friday Closing Bell. And so our mission, the way we're going to actually do that, is by creating the world's most accessible, no-limit betting platform. And this really goes back to when I was in middle school, I was betting on these force races. I bet 25 to 30 races a day. And I kind of said, if you're good at it, you'll actually get cut down, so your limits get reduced. And all of a sudden, you can't bet very much. And so that's really the problem we're trying to solve. The limits problem and the accessibility problem. So Augur B1 was really a proof of concept. It wasn't really a great user experience. You had to download an app, took hours, sometimes days to sync. You had to get this kind of big landing page. You connect the wallet, you had to download MetaMask. And once you got there, you know, the markets were really wide. You couldn't really see that much. The trading page was kind of indecipherable.  And it was a pretty bad experience. We just wanted to prove out that it was actually possible. We were doing a lot of things. People were super crazy. People said that, you know, if it was possible to do all this stuff, we wanted to prove that you could do it even if it had a really bad user experience. And so the original plan was, to be one of those functional but not usable, then add zero X to allow off-chain trading so you can get off-chain order of placements, cancellations, and modifications. That's really important because it allows market makers to actually market make and be priced at a lot, especially in events that move quickly. Then add die, add maker. And the reason for that is if you're betting on ETH, you need to be confident on the ETH price up or down over a time ago in the event you're betting on, which is really difficult. And then finally, release the version 3 that you put in low latency even on order fills. And at that point, it should be no different than a regular betting or trading site, except it allows you to access it from anywhere with no limits and it's mobile and it's just a great user experience. And so in Q1 2020, we're going to release all of it. V1.5 is zero X, V2 with die, and then shortly after, V3 with fast trading. And so here's kind of a preview of Agra V2. So the market's much more condensed as much easier to browse. If you log in, there's a sign-in option where you can log in with an email, a Google phone number, and that mask as well. So it's a really simple sign-in process. If you want to add funds, you can add them in with a credit card, eventually credit cards. It's a much more seamless process. Actually, using the notice of the state will be able to use die only. So you don't need to own ETH at all on any other part of this process. You never even really need to know if it's up here. You can see someone's betting on whether Trump will win there and then out they want to buy the price. And then we actually show that it's pending. V1 is just kind of magically appeared like 30 seconds to a minute later. Here it actually gives you kind of real-time updates based on what's happening on-chain. Your order is placed, and that's kind of a trade in Agra V2. Don't really even know if you know you're getting ETH. And so what's next for Agra is really kind of the master plan part too, because all these UIs, we sort of designed the mobile first. Starting with the mobile experience, that's where about 60% of betting takes place and then working backwards through desktop experience. Making tools that make it really easy to market make because having the clarity is super important. Focusing on user acquisition growth and also bringing sort of the offline social betting experience online. We're going to have some features coming up pretty soon that do that. And then there's one more thing we're going to do, which is we're going to release a betting UI. So this looks pretty similar to something like Betfair. It's a little bit more modern, and it allows you to back in-lay individual events. The numbers there are how much money you'll win if you bet, so 6.3 extra money, how many dollars you can bet. And then we're going to eventually release an even simpler version of this that's just really easy to lose. And that's basically what we're working on. It's one really final thing. It takes like 10 seconds. It's an Agra V1, 14% of markets that were created or unveiled. And this is a huge problem in people that store and place those in the order. After we implemented changes in the end of June to alleviate those problems, of the most recent 140 free markets created in the order, only one of them was invalid. And we had even more changes to try to lower that even farther. Thanks.