Hey everyone, this is Josh McIntyre also known as chain toots Really excited to be a part of DEF CON again this year and some of the great virtual content That's happening as part of the blockchain village. So first, I want to extend my thanks to Ajit, Ron, Nathan, and everybody that's doing all the hard work to put together blockchain village again this year Today, I'm going to be talking about subtle and not so subtle ways to lose your cryptocurrency This is going to be kind of a broad overview talk on some of the most common ways I'm seeing people get stolen from in my work doing tech education in the space So first a little bit about me. I'm giving an idea of a perspective that this talk is coming from. I'm a software engineer by trade So I'm not directly a security professional, but I'm really interested in security and cryptocurrency Because I think you know building secure software and powering people through technologies is a very important thing And on the side, I run a tech education project called chain toots So I build free and open source tech education content around cryptocurrencies, blockchains security and other computer science topics Personally, I'm getting really tired of meeting people after they lost money People that are coming to me through my videos that got scammed or made a mistake and Lost some amount of cryptocurrency. I have a goal of helping more people stay safe Before something bad happens to them in cryptocurrency It's such a young industry and I want to be a part of the education efforts that are going to help people from losing money to scammers and thieves The the reality of this technology that we're all working with is it's a very very powerful technology But it's also very vulnerable in that way if you don't use it carefully Cryptocurrencies have irreversible transactions and that's a really desirable property for us Right. We want money that's not sensorable that can be sent around to anyone in the world That's decentralized and uses secure or public key cryptography The problem is is that thieves and scammers can and do take advantage of this if people aren't careful so what I want you to get out of this talk is kind of an idea of the most common attack vectors and Really basic common sense mitigation techniques This talk isn't really presenting any original research on cryptocurrency security Rather, this is coming from a tech educator perspective What I actually see happen to my viewers and my listeners and people that I interact with doing this work and What I want to give you is Some insights and some new ways of thinking about crypto security that you can take back to the products that you're building Your users your companies your interest in the cryptocurrency space I just want to give everybody kind of a fresh Perspectives and some bullet points that will be helpful in preventing future problems So what's kind of a broad overview of what I want to talk about some of the different classes of attacks that? We are seeing as a crypto industry the first one that we're going to go over is the one that's often the most powerful and Seems to be a very common mechanism and that's of social engineering So that's just tricking people into giving up their cryptocurrency or their keys in some way We're going to talk about some interesting malware threats that are out there in the wild We're going to talk about the unfortunate reality of a user error with a powerful technology We're going to talk about bad security hygiene practices Some of these things are things that carry over a lot to other areas of information security whether it's a crypto exchange account or your email account and We'll talk lastly about a few wallet implementation problems that have happened Some of this may seem like common sense to you the listener right we're industry professionals But I want to hit home the points with this talk that these are always in which very real users real people get Racked with cryptocurrency. I want to talk about fixing that I want to talk about simple common-sense things that may seem like totally obvious to us as people that are computer science Professionals or other professionals working in the crypto space Well, let's talk about ways to make this digestible and easy for everyday people so that as cryptocurrency gets broad adoption We have less and less people getting stolen from in these sort of interesting ways So social engineering number one One of the biggest ways people get stolen from is fake support fake wallet support fake coin based supports social engineering scammers posing as a support channel for a legitimate company These are examples that I found actually out in the wild. These are these are real screenshots of For example a fake keep key watch wallet website. This came up Actually high in the search results for keep key So this type of attack vector is fairly straightforward We know in cryptocurrency that your seed phrase or your private keys are what grant direct access to The coins in the sense that if you have the private key You can sign a new transaction to transfer that cryptocurrency to an address That somebody else controls so that's how you do value transfer at a basic level in the world of Bitcoin So this attack is to trick the user into giving up access to the seed phrase So the attackers can sweep those funds out to a wallet that they control and they do this by Targeting public channels by which people often interact with crypto companies. So for example, Twitter or reddits Where companies like shapeshift have a presence These scammers will try to pretend to be a support official from one of those companies and Get them into giving up access To their seed phrase if this is some kind of non custodial wallet So for example, keep key hardware wallet or atomic mobile wallet or sometimes to trick them into giving up two factor codes So they can initiate a password reset and take over an exchange account I see this really commonly on for example the coinbase subreddit If you post that you're having trouble with your coinbase account You will like immediately get a bunch of dms from fake coinbase support people Trying to trick you into giving access to your exchange account so they can clean out whatever is there Buy more with your bank account send it to themselves So what are some simple counter measures for this? We need to warn a people that interact with crypto services on a regular basis that no Legitimate support is going to ask for something like two FA codes or seed phrases So if you're building a crypto wallet, if you're building an exchange service, whether it's decentralized or centralized We should have common sense warnings like this as part of our normal UX interaction social engineering number two which is a very popular thing that I encounter because I interact with a lot of crypto accounts on social media is impersonation so somebody pretends to be andreus antinopolis or Roger dear or the crypto tutor or even I have seen chain toots trying to get them in some way to Either give up access to keys or exchange accounts or more generally at leading users to fake Investment websites and trying to get them to send cryptocurrency directly to a scam or control to the dress a Lot of times these websites They're very easy to spot if you're somebody with experience in the space, but they are very convincing So somebody like fake Roger will send you to this great new trading algorithm website that he is building and Really, it's just a front to get you to send cryptocurrency. They're just modern look and feel UX websites That at the end of the day are displaying a Bitcoin or Ethereum address and trying to get you to send an irreversible transaction to that address again Countermeasures here fairly straightforward. It's Awareness spreading awareness of the irreversibility of crypto transactions. So knowing that if you send coins off to somebody that transaction can't be taken back and Awareness of what these types of common scams look like an impersonation tactics a really simple But really powerful example of this is Andreas Antonopoulos's Twitter bio which says Beware of giveaway scams So someone that's new to the space that's coming to interact with someone like Andreas Sees very clearly a warning about a common type of scam, right? This warning has probably saved real people from being stolen from It's a simple message, but it goes a long way These kinds of social engineering like doubling scams right Elon Musk is giving way Bitcoin send half a Bitcoin here And you'll get double back if we as People in the space that are you know, maybe some of the first people that a newcomer interacts with Have these types of warnings on our bios or things like that. That's a really useful way of warning people That these scams occur and again, so I think just making people aware that one of the powerful but Potentially dangerous parts of cryptocurrency is the fact that Transactions are irreversible, right? This is not your credit card. There is no charge back so make sure that you are aware of that and Know that when you send crypto to somebody you have no recourse So you need to be really careful before you send off that transaction So now we're getting into some of the more subtle ways that people lose cryptocurrency And I think this one is really really fascinating. These are malware threats right so computer viruses are just about as old as computers themselves and one of the new and interesting ways that people will try to steal is to Not only gain access to identity information like credit cards or social security numbers, but better yet Get direct access to cryptocurrency, which is a very sort of Liquid thing that you can take from somebody and they will have no recourse to get it back One of the interesting ways and this is happening is something called a clipboard swaps or copy-paste buffer swaps So this is a piece of malware that could get on your Device like your computer through any number of means right file sharing You know clicking on sketchy links and emails and what this type of malware will do is it will detect a Bitcoin or Ethereum or another cryptocurrency address in the clipboard buffer So crypto addresses are a little bit unwieldy at this stage right there, you know 30 to 50 character Addresses they're not something that you can type out really it's cumbersome to deal with and so one of the most common Ways to send yourself cryptocurrency here to send somebody else cryptocurrency Besides using a QR code is to just copy and paste an address if I want to send cryptocurrency from a Exchange account to my cold storage wallet, you know, I'm going to go into some user interface for that wallet and Copy and paste that address into Coinbase to create that transaction And what this type of malware will do is it will use something as simple as a regular expression to detect that and Replace the legitimate address that you the user are trying to send to with the attackers address So what will happen then is when you send off that cryptocurrency instead of it going to my cold storage wallet It's going to go into the attackers wallet because I copy and pasted an address and didn't think about Double triple checking that address This example on the screen here is a homebrew Example educational demo of one of these clipboard swabbing Types of viruses that I cooked up in about 30 minutes, right? This is not a complex piece of software To develop but it can be really really powerful if you get it on somebody's machine You know mine was meant to be educational was written in a language that you normally wouldn't use to write actual malware It's called Adderjack and it's available on my github if you want to kind of take a look at what this sort of code looks like Now this other example here this on the screen is a screenshot of a virus scan that a real client that reached out to me Gave me Somebody that I met online actually had this happen to them Where they were trying to send cryptocurrency? Which is some kind of a theorem token to their own wallet and they ended up sending off about $2,000 worth at the time of crypto to the attacker And it looks to me like he got that malware on his computer through file sharing so he wasn't careful about the health of his Daily driver device that he was using to send an access cryptocurrency and it resulted in him losing money Through one of these clipboard scams. So again, as I said, I made a Educational demo of this in about half an hour and have even added on a little bit of sophistication to it But the real ones are much more sophisticated The real ones will even do things where they will take a bunch of addresses from the HD wallet tree and try to get one that the first couple of characters closely resemble The address that the user originally copied So this really hit hits home as a countermeasure The importance of double and triple checking that your addresses match the intended recipients So especially if you're sending off a high value transaction, you should really check the whole address But you know at the very minimum Check the first five or six characters and even more importantly check the last couple characters because with a lot of cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin Bitcoin cash and litecoin the last few characters include a Cryptographically secure hash check some That it would take much much more work for the attacker to generate that although it's only a few bits mind you so it's not impossible To make sure that that address is is correct And again high value transactions or cryptocurrencies that don't have check sums like Ethereum Make sure you check the whole address make sure you check beginning middle and end so that you know the Intended recipients including yourself is going to get the cryptocurrency and not some attacker and another thing that I don't have on this Slide here is of course just Device health right you should have some type of antivirus protection on Your devices that you're using to access crypto You don't have to have one that's a resource hog that like live scans all the time But like make sure you keep up with Your device health right consider if you're doing a lot of high value crypto transactions having a dedicated device Just for cryptocurrency so if you do perhaps encounter a Websites or a file that ends up on your machine that has this kind of malware in it. It won't affect your crypto device So just think about these things and be careful We should again educate users that crypto transactions are irreversible and you must be careful to double triple check what you're doing So user error this one is always a bummer because people make mistakes We're human beings even those of us that have been in this space forever screw up sometimes and It's fairly common that I meet individuals that have made a mistake such as sending cryptocurrency to the wrong cryptocurrency address a very common one that I see is Bitcoin to Bitcoin cash or more commonly the reverse Somebody sends Bitcoin cash to a Bitcoin address In some wallet this does not support Bitcoin cash such as the cash app There's also further complications in the fact that although Bitcoin cash and Bitcoin because Bitcoin cash is a fork They share an address format But there are some versions of addresses now in Bitcoin such as segregated witness addresses that are not compatible with the Bitcoin cash network So even if the user does something like they send Bitcoin cash from their coinbase account To their cold storage Bitcoin wallet address if they grabbed a segway address from their cold storage wallet Even though they have the private key they may not be able to get the money back without the help of a Bitcoin cash minor and The ability to even do that has kind of been off and on as Bitcoin cash has made changes to their protocol In a lot of cases that I see Somebody will send Bitcoin cash from their wallet to a Bitcoin address on a custodial exchange Like coinbase or cash app and they are completely screwed in that case Right not only is it maybe a segway address, but if cash out and coinbase are doing what they should be doing as Custodial exchanges nobody there is going to have direct access to the keys needed to work in manual recovery So that money is effectively gone forever and locked So this isn't an attack right, but this is a very common way in which I see people make irreversible mistakes and Of course the countermeasures are again very similar to the malware issue Which is you should be double triple checking that the address and the intended cryptocurrency are correct Before you finalize a transaction before you hit send sign that transaction and broadcast it to The crypto network that applies you should make sure that you have the right cryptocurrency in the right address one of the things that Bothers me about a lot of wallets is they do nothing in their user experience to educate users about this Wallets are pretty good these days about saying hey here's your 12 to 24 words seed phrase Make sure you back it up and keep it somewhere safe and never give it to anybody Because you must have this to restore access if you drop your phone in the toilet or you know You know your car burns down with your hardware wallet in it, but something I see almost no Wallets do is warn their users About the irreversible nature of transactions and about double triple checking that the address and cryptocurrency are correct I think in my opinion as a software developer Every wallet UI UX should have a warning like this Especially for really common ones like Bitcoin cash to Bitcoin right Bitcoin cash now has a different address format called cash Adder that's the most commonly used it still of course retains backward compatibility with normal base 58 check Bitcoin addresses because that address format isn't even really Reflected at the protocol level. It's it's a wallet UX thing and how the public key hash is encoded I think it would be really great If wallet makers wallet software developers started saying a warning if you try to send Bitcoin cash to a non-cash Adder address. Hey user. Are you intending to send this money to a? Bitcoin cash address that looks like this, right? It's a very common Issue that happens that people send it to the wrong type of address. Make sure that this is correct This is a simple UI thing that's just really just like a text box or a Dialogue box that could help save people from making this costly and irreversible mistake So let's talk Security hygiene practices. This is something in the information security world that is Constantly evolving right I may be saying something here that is not entirely correct based on the latest professional guidance So, you know always listen to your friendly neighborhood information security professional But this is a big big issue in the cryptocurrency space particularly with exchange accounts It's one thing if you screw up and you have a bad reused password that gets leaked in a data breach and accidentally give someone access to your Facebook or Instagram accounts It's another thing entirely when your password or 2FA hygiene is bad and somebody is able to get into Potentially your crypto life savings sitting in Coinbase or Binance or Gemini So this is something that not only should people do for their entire digital lives It should be especially cognizant of when it comes to cryptocurrency. I have a couple demos that I'm linking to here One is called entrapal, which is just a nice little hardware demo and a little command line utility as well For generating diceware passwords, which is a way of getting much easier to type passwords that also have a high degree of entropy to them and Passperms, which is really just a basic demo of the math behind password cracking and in general shows why Length is better than complexity such as adding a bunch of symbols to a password And the effect that increased length has on password cracking times in the event of a data breach so I hope perhaps these could be useful tools that you could reuse and Show people when you're doing infosec education So this type of attack is something like the user reuses an insecure password So something that's short and easy to break with a password cracking utility like hash cat or John the Ripper and It's being reused between Different accounts on the internet So in exchange like Coinbase a web wallet like blockchain.com Some breach of some other website exposes this password that the attacker then cracks So the countermeasures for this it's really really important to not reuse passwords This is something that we talk about all the time as tech professionals Every website that you visit should have a unique password which prevents one breach from affecting other websites The other thing is is you should use long Passphrases that are comprised of things like sentences random words or better yet Completely randomly generated, you know alphanumeric Maybe with symbols if you want to pass phrases and the use of secure password managers to store all this information The reason most people reuse passwords is because we as people can't remember Passwords for 50 websites, right? If you're a tech nerd like me, you might have upwards of a hundred different websites that you visit with varying degrees of frequency So encouraging people to use things like encrypted password managers prevents password reuse and it also allows people to have Really strong high entropy randomly generated pass phrases that would be a complete pain to remember or even type and Just have those things be auto-filled through the password manager if you own a crypto related website if you're a developer Insist on whatever the industry standard is for user passwords Like just do not allow people to you know have hunter to is their password Enforced password length requirements and again, you know, I'm not an information security professional necessarily So what I'm saying is is find out what the industry standard guidance is and enforce it And if I had to come up with a general rule myself I would say make sure passwords are at least 16 to 20 characters and preferably as random as possible Don't allow your users to mess this up if you're building a crypto related service It's going to make it that much more secure for them If they have the designer of the websites or the designer of the wallet looking out for them and saying hey It's really important that your password is long enough unique and not stored somewhere in plain text Security hygiene number two and this is another big one is two-factor authentication Sim swaps have been a plague in the cryptocurrency space So this type of attack is one an attacker knows that a user of some exchange account or service like a blockchain.com web wallet Has SMS text message base two-factor auth and some exposed phone number So attackers will work to try and get Information on a target's phone number Once they have that information They will socially engineer the phone company such as AT&T or Verizon or Sprint into porting that number to a new device that they control Once they have that phone number under their control in the form of a SIM card They will initiate a password reset against the target service So Coinbase or Gemini or Binance They can then intercept the two-factor auth code and do the password reset Because the two-facode has been used to prove the identity of what should have been the legitimate user that forgot their password So countermeasures for this and this is already starting to be implemented across the industry is only allowing app-based such as TOTP. So this is your Microsoft Google Duo Authenticator apps or better yet security key base two-factor authentication So using something like this a Yuba key device or even a lot of hardware wallets like the keep key will act as U2F or FIDO to FA devices So if you own a profile related website Don't even make SMS two-factor authentication an option It's honestly easier as a web developer to enable something like TOTP anyway Because you're just managing a seed rather than having to deal with how you you know send text messages to somebody like some subscription service or Server infrastructure to do that. Just don't allow SMS to FA Really encourage people to use app-based to FA and to use security keys Also, you know be the coolest by enabling Again hardware token to FA on your websites Not only is this more secure for the end user than even app-based to FA. It's also easier I hate going to websites where I have to pull out my phone and manually type in codes Like I got to unlock my authenticator unlock my phone type in a six-digit code with this thing I go to the website. I my password manager auto fills the password and then I tap this and I'm in and I have a very secure setup in doing so So we as an industry would need to really encourage people To have good hygiene when it comes to their two factor So the last interesting topic we'll talk about I would say is the most subtle and the most Difficult as an end user to prevent type of attack or compromise and this is poor wallet implementations I should say some of these are very complex and subtle attacks and some of these actually are pretty to avoid it like the Issue of brain wallets so Examples of this that have happened for real in the crypto currency space are the electrum phishing attack where attackers Exploded a vulnerability in the electrum Bitcoin desktop wallets and trick users into installing a malicious version of electrum from the attacker servers instead of the legitimate electrum servers so so the end user at some point had a legitimate electrum wallet on their device they were tricked via this exploit into installing a Backdoor version of electrum which was able to read the private keys and sweep the funds to attack or control wallets So this is something is an end user right especially if you're a non-technical person. How do I avoid this? well Unfortunately, although this is difficult for folks that aren't technical The use of well audited and reputable software is one thing that's that's a step Right, like use what other people in the community are using if a brand new Bitcoin wallet Just popped up on the app store today and has 30 downloads But maybe avoid that one for now, right? It could be a great new product.  That's not foolproof But it is one step better than downloading a random APK off of some website. That's like, hey Bitcoin wallet. It's free You know use that Never use brain wallets or paper wallets You know brain wallets are the practice of hashing some user-generated password into a key Those have been proven for many years now to be really insecure Ryan Castellucci who's that infosec professional has done a really awesome Def Con talk on cracking brain wallets And it is super super easy to steal from people that try and generate their own key entropy Like don't do that the one that's a little bit more difficult and I I say difficult and that people still insist This is an okay practice is paper wallets So you visit some website like bid address or like coin address, you know dot org or whatever And it generates a key for you in the web browser and you print out a piece of paper that has the Public key hash, which is the address and the private key for it So many people have been stolen from By malicious versions of these websites that were backdoor into generating, you know keys that the attackers control So they're just constantly sweeping out attacker, you know a sweeping out user funds basically And you know, there's also pitfalls like potentially Poor cartography used in JavaScript websites. That's a thing that happens And I have gotten into arguments with people on Twitter that insist Bro, it's better for you to generate a paper wallet on like coin address calm Then it is to keep coins in exchange and in my professional opinion. That's just not true Like you are better off keeping your hundred dollars of like coin or Bitcoin in a legitimate exchange with good password and 2FA hygiene that you are Generating a key off of some website like take 10 minutes to install Koynomi or Exodus Or Bitcoin calm or any other reputable mobile wallet to control your own keys before you generate a single key pair Wallet, there's just so many things that can go wrong with change with key generation Don't do it. And I think you know, we should kindly and professionally slap people online that still promote Paper wallets is a practice. It's just it's it's not something we should be doing anymore so some final thoughts again as Tech professionals watching this and attending DEF CON a lot of this probably isn't news to you and That's kind of the point that I wanted to make with this talk is These are common ways that very real people lose money in this new Technology in this new ecosystem every single day The people that steal cryptocurrency using these techniques do so because it is very effective and profitable for them and Most of these attacks again are mitigated by common sense relatively non-technical countermeasures So, you know, you may have not learned something really cool today about the latest in password cracking technology But I think yeah, you probably have learned a Good set of bullet points that you can take back to your companies Your open source wallet projects whatever you're building out there. I want to encourage people to take Education like this and to think about new ways of making security information digestible to everyday people. I think we especially in this Incredible new industry with this super empowering technology We have kind of a professional duty to educate users to implement sound user experiences to build secure software and develop new best practices Cryptocurrency is 10 years young at this point So not only can we kind of share things that have emerged in the last few years from these common exploits Like everybody that's watching this talk. I think even myself included we have some opportunities to create new best practices Whether it be through software security through user experiences through tech education content Any innumerable ways that you can participate in the blockchain ecosystem? We can do a part to build better security So as more and more people as mass adoption comes in to our ecosystem, we're ready to help people Embrace this technology without fear and the way that now, you know people Everyday people can go on the internet and buy something off of Amazon without having to worry about their credit card being compromised We're not there yet as an industry, but we can be if we put in a solid effort to make this happen So again, if you're watching this Take these bullet points back home to whatever you're building You know build a new security ecosystem for cryptocurrency We don't want People like Senator Elizabeth Warren to say that this is all the shadowy underground built by shadowy supercoders, right? We want to show the world What this technology can do in a positive way so go out build secure experiences and able to FA please and I want to thank you guys very very much for watching this talk So of course this talk is pre-recorded this year I want to encourage folks to reach out to me with questions You know, I'm not just saying we would love to hear from you in the corporate way I genuinely love when people reach out to me and talk to me with feedback Anything you think I can do better as an educator questions that you have for me about what I've seen in blockchain security or you know if you have ideas for Other things that we can be doing together to help build out this ecosystem. I'm on Twitter at chain toots That's a great place to reach me My website chain toots.com has a contact form and I'm pretty good about getting emails out folks quickly And I will be hanging out on the deaf core discord deaf con discord this weekend To watch talks interact answer questions last points all of my educational content code videos articles slides are License under creative commons and permissive open-source software licenses So not only is reuse of this content allowed Yeah, I would take it as a huge compliment if you take anything that I'm building and Remix it share it get it out to people just with you know credit to me as the original author Thanks again, and as always I hope you learn something new with me today


So let's talk about completing the square algebraically. So this is one of the more useful algebraic skills and the basic idea is this, suppose I have the x squared and x terms of a quadratic polynomial. What I'd like to do is I'd like to add some constant that's going to make it a perfect square trinomial, a perfect square. So it's going to be helpful to remember what those perfect squares look like. So if I have x plus h squared, I'll expand it and I get x squared plus 2hx plus h squared. Likewise, if I have x minus h squared, I'll expand it and I'll get x squared minus 2hx plus h squared again. And that means if I have an expression like x squared plus 8x, then comparing this, well, x squared plus 8x looks like the first two terms of this, which means that this thing must come from the square of something like x plus h. And likewise, if I have a difference x squared minus 5x, well, that looks like these two terms here. And so this must come from the square of something like x minus h squared. Now, let's see how that works out. In both cases, we have to figure out what our value of h is. So for example, let's say I have x squared plus 8x and I want to find a constant that I need to complete the square. So since it's the sum, it's got to come from the square of x plus h and I have to figure out the value of h. So paper is cheap. Let's set down our two expressions and compare them. So x plus h squared, I'm going to compare that to x squared plus 8x. So I'll expand out x plus h squared, x squared plus 8x, I don't need to do anything with. Here's my expansion, x squared plus 2hx plus h squared. And I'll compare my perfect square with what I have. So both of them have an x squared. That's good. The perfect square has 2hx and the expression that we have has an 8x. So if I compare those two, 2hx to 8x, that says that 2h and 8 must be the same thing. So that tells me h equals 4. Well, let's fill that in. If I know that h equals 4, I can fill that in. And I get x squared plus 2 times 4x plus 4 squared. And I'll let some of the dust settle here. That's x squared plus 8x plus 16. And again, I'll compare my two expressions. They have x squared, they have 8x. My perfect square has a 16, and my original expression does not. So the constant that I need to complete the square is going to be 16. That's the thing that I'm missing. Well, let's take a look at another example, x squared minus 5x. So here I have a difference, and so this difference must have come from the square of x minus h for some h to be determined. And so I'll, again, set down my two expressions and compare them. x minus h squared versus x squared minus 5x. And again, I'll expand out that x minus h, and I'll compare my two expressions. So again, I have 2hx here, I have 5x here, and I'll compare my two expressions. That says 5 and 2h must be the same thing. And so that tells me h equals 5 halves, and I'll substitute that in. So x squared minus 2h, x plus h squared, I'll do a little bit of algebra. And what I have, again, comparing my two expressions, I have x squared in both, I have minus 5x in both, I have a 25 over 4 in the perfect square, and I'm missing that in my original expression. So what do I need? The constant that I need to complete the square is this 25 over 4.


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It's gonna be Packers rookie Otto Devonte Wyatt the big man for the Packers Devonte Wyatt there to 35 We've got Lombardi Lenny to 25 Leonard for net material signatures bucks again. There you go, Hano Bucks box here on the three color patch Lombardi Lenny 15 to 25 material treasures Nice Leonard there We've got Traylon Burks the 99 on the rookie material signatures Titans Nice hit there Titans Traylon Burks the 99 will mag this one Titans rookie receiver got commanders on the true RPA to 99 Brian Robinson, Jr. Nice one there commanders That's Lee with the commanders nice true RPA Bri Rob will mag this one as well I'll do it for box one. That was sweet nice hit there Hano on that gold Brady Yeah guys hit that like button if you guys are enjoying Do appreciate it. It's one slightly less chunky another booklet. This is treasured rookies to 99 Maddie Corral Go into the Panthers treasured rookies To 49 we got tractorcito Derek Henry for the Titans 49 Titans on the base Devonte Adams now tremendous treasures to 25 for the Raiders The Raiders to 25 tremendous treasures Cadarius Tony number to 49 center materials that's going to the Chiefs Chiefs on the Jersey center materials 225 heirlooms Jersey is simian rice. That's a sick one there for the Bucks Simian rice on the three color Jersey 12 of 25 don't see much simian rice Nice one there Bucks This one will be random at the end. We've got Patrick Mahomes Jersey got Joe burrow and Josh Allen We'll do a random at the end between the Chiefs Bangles and the bills have to random this one. Good luck guys in 99 Some some pretty good QBs there my homes and my homes Alan and a Burrow not bad. Yeah, that's true This one is a 99 for the Vikings you like that Kirk Cousins Signatures for the Vikings 41 and 99 Captain Kirk to 49 got Monty tumor Giants on these signatures.  I don't know if anybody's had a better connection than these guys man We'll mag this for you Niners Joe Montana and Jerry Rice 18 of 25 on the dual That is sick man. I sit there Nicole We'll mag that one And we've got booklet It is rookie first-edition signatures to 99 Aiden Hutchinson. There we go lions. That's Braden Nice one there on the Jersey auto booklet with a three color patch These booklets look sick man. That's a really cool design It's like throwback design there nice hutch there that one is 95 and 99 close to that Jersey number Nice hutch for the Lions on the booklet got two more ready Box three first up. We got Brian burns to 99 go notes Panthers To 49 we got Deandre Hopkins for the Cardinals Newest Titan Deandre Hopkins We got a bird game gear to 99. It's Brandon Graham. There we go on the Jersey there for the Eagles Brandon Graham to 99 this one is the 25 We've got some bangles receivers here Jamar Chase AJ green TJ Hushman Zata and Ocho Sinko That's a sick car there Quad relics for the bangles receivers 22 at 25 Some solid receivers in that group too, man Bengals have had some good ones So 49 we got colossal Jersey for the Ravens. That's gonna be Mark Andrews Colossal Jersey to 49 to 49 as well We've got a Drake London nice one there dual patches for the Falcons three-color patch on the right TJ who's your mama? I know rich my bad Should have said it should have said it to 49 there Rich you got any you got any trivia to stop me today. It's pretty easy. It's pretty easy. It seems This one is rookie to rel Bernard to 99 that's gonna be for the bills Looks like they got some like flakin going on underneath the sticker. We'll send a box with this one bills It looks like something flaked and they put the sticker over it like a little piece of chrome there So we'll send a box with the bills Yeah, I don't know I just grabbed it. Oh, we got the boxer. It's a 99 We've got Frank Gore on the Jersey auto for the Niners Frank Gorda 99 the legend still played forever 75 a 99 oh It's a 49 we've got Damian Pierce on the RPA Nice one there for the Texans will mag this Damian Pierce 38 to 49 RPA That's a sick one there on the purple Magda Texans rookie out of Florida and check this one out. Who's got the commanders? That's Lee Lee P Midnight RPA to 20. We've got Sam howl.  Okay in 2004 Bear Bones at the highest OBP of any player ever in a season who finished second that year Mark McWire 2004 big poppy David Ortiz Show him Hutani back in 2004 He's been good for a long time. Yeah, that's a big one right there First up we got to 99 and Justin Herbert Nice one there chargers on the base 225 we got George Kittle For the Niners Niners get a bunch of cards here to 25 29 we got Brandon Iukes sent your materials And this one will be another random here at the end It is to 10 triple relic. It's going to be Jamal Williams, Austin Eckler and Derek Henry with these sick patches A little star on the Henry there Six of 10 will random this one at the end Derek Henry Jameson Williams and Austin Eckler to 10 Random at the end And right behind it. We got dual jerseys for the Titans Derek Henry and Tana Hill Derek Henry and Tana Hill for the Titans there to 99 What's up, Mr. Mook Triple relic also to 99 We've got bears on the triple. It's uh Fields Montgomery and Colchamette Colchamette there 2004 I'm trying to think who was uh Who's hitting good in 2004? Maybe uh a rod? We have for the birds number to 10 rookie Cam Juergens Cam Juergens number to 10 rookie for the Eagles He apparently is Is he center? Uh, I think he's the center but he also plays guard Yeah, let's say he can't play center of Kelsey's there I think he's supposed to take over for Kelsey Gotcha Next up to 99. We got Jersey Otto gonna be Drew Pearson for the Cowboys From the 70s there. It's the lasting legacies to 99 Jersey Otto We'll mag this one for the Bucks number to 25. It's gonna be rpa Rashad White This one is thick To 25 there on the five color patch 25 of 25 or shot white We will mag that one for you the number patch. That's a sick looking card Nice one bucks And another mag here, we've got crossover rpa to 25. It's gonna be Kenneth Walker Jr Nice one there for the Seahawks now 14 of 25 on the uh crossover rpa Congrats Seahawks Ken Walker That will do it guys for the full case number 25 random team style Do a quick hit recap then we got two randoms to do real quick Ready guys triple first. We got the bears triple got the duel to 99 for the Titans Brandy naive to 99 to 49 Drake London got mark andrews to 49 This one is the quad for the um the bangles there tj who's your mama the 25 you go rich And to 99 brandy Graham birds to 49 kaderis Tony about heirloom simian rice the 25 jersey Bucks this one is a 25 davante Adams To 99 joe burrow to 99 pickens There's dual jersey godwin and evans. We got the quad for the vikings Now for the autos we had to 99 drew pierce in for the um The cowboys cam jargans number to 10 eagles rookie auto to 99 frank gore Torrell bernard number to 99. This one has a little bit of damage just in a box with the bills there Um, there is a money tumor Got kurt cousins to 99. We got lenny for net number to 25 Uh davante why it's a 35 rookie auto um, this one was our um booklet jersey auto Aiden hudgensen number to 99 nice one there for the lions Oh Todd helton. Oh man That's not bad Todd father We had mags now to 25 crossover rpa seahawks ken walker That's a beautiful card there, man Seahawks ken walker crossover to 25. We had rpa brashad white For the bucks We had uh midnight rpa to 20 probably the big hit of the break here sam howell Nice one there lee with the commanders there six of 20 on the sam howell We had to 49 damien pierce purple rpa Sick one there texans We had this sick one as well dual auto It's joe montana and jerry rice on these sink signatures for the niners We had true rpa brine robinson We had gold to 10. This one's tom brady with the one gram of gold For the bucks there and treylon berks to 99 on the rookie material signatures All righty guys that'll do it for the break. Let me get these random set up real quick I've got a random between the lions Chargers and titans and between the chiefs bangles and bills. Let me roll the dice here as many times I'm gonna go once I get these set up Go five times we'll go five times on the random here. Give me one moment to get them set up. So I've got chiefs bills Bangles Make sure real quick somebody doesn't have both though or three of those bangles are just in c chiefs are lee And the bills are joshua. Alrighty, and I've also got lions lions chargers Check that one as well. Make sure Titans are larry chargers Where are the charges? Chargers are justin and the lions or the uh titans Tons of larry lions are braden. All right, let's do the random here guys We'll go five times on this random. We've got the triple between the chiefs bills and bangles going to go five. Good luck One two three four and five got chiefs up top the chiefs And now we'll do a random between the lions chargers and titans for another triple and we'll go five times one two three four and five titans up top titans taking home the triple Alrighty there guys, I'll do it for nt four box full case number 25 get number 26 going in


Broadway's My Beat, from Times Square to Columbus Circle, the gaudiest, the most violent, the lonesomeest mile in the world. Broadway's My Beat with Larry Thor as Detective Danny Clover. When it's October and the night has slipped down over Broadway, the street has spangled with autumn strollers. They come here, the seekers after something or other, pick a doorway with promising neon, pick a smile and run after it, pick a postcard, write home about it. It's the place to be, you've got to leave your mark, buy a turtle and have your name painted on its back, buy a necktie, buy a pillow and send it back to mom. Sometimes you'll be lucky and get lipstick on your handkerchief, but the odds say you'll buy a newspaper and go to bed, but it's Broadway, kid, and you've had it. And where Broadway ebbs off into the side streets downtown, where I was, close to where I was, close to where 18th Street touches the river, the shock was a thing composed of crowd in a nighttime sky lit by flame. The elements, later to be noted in police and fire department records, fire at Russell's Chemical Company, time 4.15 a.m. They're bringing somebody out now, Danny. That's strange. What? What'd you say? I said it's strange, Muggevin. After four in the morning, why should anybody be... Come on, let's see. Put the stretchers down here. Somebody better... How are they? Oh, hello, Danny. These two, I think that's always in there. I just wanted to say somebody better get a priest. They're both dead. This one is the other one. Danny, look at him. Ed Costa. Huh? Do something for him. Don't let... Hey, Doc! Doc! Over here. Ed Costa. Hurry up, Doc! You know him, Danny? Yeah, he's a policeman. Policeman? What was he doing in there? Doc, do something for him. The flames beating against the night sky, burning and opening for dawn. In the street, the reflected glow darts across the face of death, holds for an instant, then scurries at the breath of the October wind. This is the time of shadows, the brief time, the time for shrouding in the charred body of a man, the time for quick gentleness, and the other man still in anguish, and the lifting of them into the vehicle reserved for the dead and the dying, the closing of a door upon them, the hushed ride that puts an end to night. In the morning at headquarters, watch the sergeant lift a phone, dial a number, and after a silence, ask for news of a man who was known to him, who was a friend. It's me again, Dr. Sinski, Barad Koster. Any change? Any... No, thank you, doctor. I'll keep calling. Gino. What do you want? How is he? You heard? No change. Hits us all, Gino. Koster's that kind of man. It's been to the Tataglia house. Dangled at the Tataglia child on his knee. Make it. That'll make it. Sorry, Danny. I keep thinking about Ed's wife, Vera. I keep thinking... He got something for me, Gino. Yeah. Yeah, I got something. I'm sorry, Danny. The man found with Ed the dead man. The technical checked up on him in ways they got to check on such things. Fingerprints, maybe. They know who he is. We got a file on him this long, to my arm. Joe Gant, professional arsonist, a man who sets fires. This way he makes his daily bread by burning... Anything else? It's on the record. Gant was friends to Frankie Crone. All? How were they friends?  Frankie Crown bailed him out. Treated him to Frankie's lawyer. Gant got off. Let's see Frankie get out of this one.  Not that big. I want to talk to him. Yeah, but maybe you better listen to this other thing first, Danny. What? It was called in a few minutes ago. The automobile of one George Russell exploded, in the place of his daughter, Patrice, in the driveway with a booby trap. Russell? Of the Russell Chemical Company, where the fire was. Home address, uptown, 1923, east 112. Thanks, Gino. Dr. Szynski, me again. About that. Any change? I'll call again in a little while. Mr. Russell? Yes, what is it? My name's Clover, police. Mind if I come in? I suppose you may. Patrice, Mr. Clover, another policeman. Hi. How do you feel, Miss Russell? Got my pinching hand in the cast. Oh, the disadvantage of it all. Well, Jimmy sees it. Patrice. It was your fault, Daddy. Wasn't it his fault, Mr. Clover? I understand your car blew up this morning. Not mine, his. Daddy's. What happened? Her car is in the garage being repaired. I loaned her mine. You see how it's his fault, Mr. Clover? He spoils me. I only wheeled him for the car this much. And he patted me and said, yes, my darling daughter. You stepped on the starter and it... And it blew. No way things do. Bang. Like that, bang. She's a lucky girl. Fortunate me. Hand in a sling, gauze on my cheek, and plaster dabbled with it. Poor Jimmy. Your car booby-trapped, Mr. Russell. Your plants set fire to by an arsonist. An arsonist? That's right. The man who died had a record of arson. What's happening? I don't understand. Oh, Pop. Hey, Pop, how's business, Pop? Patrice, you'd better... Do what, Pop? My business is fine, Mr. Clover. If you've got any idea, I had my... Pop carries a lot of insurance. Cut it out, Patrice. Look, Mr. Clover, what? Don't pay any attention to her. I know you police have to think along certain lines. If it was arson, what happened to my plant, you got to think maybe I was the cause of it. Look for reasons. Well, I netted 70,000 last year, and this year it's better than ever. To coin a phrase. What am I going to do with you, Patrice? I'm a mess, my daddy. Mr. Russell, there's some connection between the arsonist who was found and a hoodlum named Frankie Crown. Do you know Frankie? Frankie Crown? A hoodlum? Why should I? Look, Mr. Clover, I didn't ask you into my house to listen. I just asked. That's all he did, Pop. I don't know him. Never heard of it. All right. It's fun, huh, Mr. Clover? Hoodlums, arson, booby traps? The nice things that can happen to a modern miss. Oh, brother, wait till Jimmy hears. Tonight's the night he won't be able to shut me up. And consider the girl for a moment. Consider the delight she had found in the touch of horror upon her.  She's suffering a shock. She doesn't understand, Mr. Clover. She doesn't know. And the girl looks up, laughs at him, and leaves him like that. Then to the discreet office of Frankie Crown in a discreet downtown building dedicated to the deep understanding of stocks and bonds in the affairs of commerce. The shiny new setting for Frankie Crown, the hoodlum, alley boy, friend of dead arsonists. And Frankie holds out a discreetly manicured hand to have it shaken, only it doesn't happen to him. Mm-mm. Have it your own way, Danny. I thought it would spark something between us if he shook my hand. You're a long way from home, Frankie. Blessed, that's me. I've been blessed. Wipe your hands of the old life and a new world shivers on the horizon waiting just for you. You ought to try it, Danny. Ain't any good fires lately, Frankie? Oh, busy, busy, busy, busy. Frankie Crown has been so busy you couldn't conceive no fires, no straight dances, no fawn anywhere. The penalties are the new life, Danny. Friend of yours was at a fire, though. I got crazy friends. They flip over the craziest things. Joe Gant, arsonist. Friend of yours, Frankie. Somewhere in the back of my brain, the name Gant Shivers helped me there. The consensus is he set a fire early yesterday morning at a chemical company. He died in it. Gant.  Joe Gant. I did all that? We got a memory course at headquarters, Frankie.  Don't get hard, Danny. Doesn't suit you. I always said about you. Come on. The touch of your hand brought it back to me. Gant.  Joe, because she came to me that time, cried on my sleeve, please help Joe. She cried. He's a good boy, she cried. Made my eyes water how with my dough and lawyer, Joe Gant was going to reform, so I gave in. I break up at a mother's tears. Maybe she'll cry some for me. You going to look at her? No, don't bother, Danny.    The mark of a polite man to close doors. How about the one on George Russell? It'd come over the tape, the Russell plant burnt to the ground. This morning his car blew up in his daughter's lap. Now there's a door that's never been opened to me, Danny. The Russell door. I'm blessed, huh? Absolutely blessed. Get out of there. Back to headquarters. Sit at your desk and shuffle your thoughts. The coincidence of a booby-trapped car and a fire. The link between a hoodlum, newly respectable, and an arsonist, newly dead. And another man, a businessman, who had a daughter. Try to find a category for her. Try to find... Danny Clover. Dr. Sinske, I'm calling from the hospital. How's Ed Costa? Get down here, Danny, right away. And go there. And the only sound in the corridor is your footsteps. The sound that hurries toward pain. Open a door and find it. He's dead, Danny. Oh, Ed. You are listening to Broadway's My Beat, written by Morton Fine and David Friedkin, and starring Larry Thor as Detective Danny Clover. In days of old, when nights were bold, King Arthur and his round table were the rage. History is not exactly repeating itself, but the best entertainment of Arthur Godfrey's weekday shows is every Sunday afternoon on King Arthur Godfrey's round table. Listen for it starting tomorrow afternoon on most of these same stations. King Arthur Godfrey's round table on CBS Radio. The sunlit visions that never happened. But the October wind shrieks it out of their hands, pushes it into a corner with the rest of the debris. That's how autumn happens to Broadway, kid. Go fight it. And autumn has other sounds. The lingering overtones that float in from a hospital corridor. A woman's called with dead husband and... And... Vera, let me give you something. Let me give you... Don't...don't talk to me. Just for a minute. Don't talk to me. Vera. Empty. Nothing. There's no more crying left in me. I'll get you something, Vera. Something it says on the bottle that makes you feel better. I told you, Doctor. There's nothing I want. Nothing I need. From anyone. Ed was a fine man, Vera. We... You'll miss him? You, Danny? You, Doctor Sinske. All of you. Vera. They say death comes when... They say bitterness won't help. They're dead wrong. It helps. I'll take you home, Vera, then when you... Some other time we'll talk... About Ed? Yes. What's wrong with now, Danny? You can talk to me about Ed now. We never held secrets from each other. I couldn't understand something. Was there about Ed Costa you couldn't understand? Only how he happened to be at the scene of the fire. How he must have been there even before... He was called, Danny. An anonymous call. It told him a fire was being set at that chemical company. It even told him what time to get there. Did he have the call traced? It came from a public phone booth. Ed was new on the burglary squad. He was glad for the tip. He thought it would make for a good start on the burglary detail. He thought maybe... The narcotics squad before that put in for a transfer. Do you know why, Vera? Because I asked him to. Because I didn't like the idea of his being in the narcotics squad. It... It didn't fit Ed. Ed was fine. A good man. He gave me all his love. All his kindness. And listen to her until the time comes when your only answer is silence. Silence, quite, because the screaming questions intrude themselves.  How do you fill in reports? How do you make a statistic out of it and file it in a ledger? How do you write heartbreak as a number? You don't know how. So you turn your back on it. Leave. And to headquarters again. Call in Detective Muggerman. Tell him to get out the record of Ed Koster. And wait. And a while later, a door opens and Detective Muggerman walks in. I got it, Danny. Okay, put it down. Aren't you going to look at it? It's a matter of Muggerman. You're restless. I'll look at it. I know you will, but I think you ought to look at it right away. Look, Muggerman, you... All right, then I'll show you. Hey, sit. Here. This arrest June 12th this year. Patrice Russell. Uh-huh. Ed arrested her for the possession of narcotics. Now you know why I wanted you... Take it, Muggerman. Lieutenant Clover's office, Muggerman speak... What? Bad? Oh, sure. Sure, right away. Danny. Uh-huh? A bomb was thrown into the home of George Russell. When? A few minutes ago into the living room. The fire department... Let's go. I checked with the boys in the fire department. You looked yourself? Yeah, Danny, I did. There's no one else in the house. Just him, you and me. You ask about his daughter? Woman in the crowd outside told me she saw her go out a couple of hours ago. Described her wearing a pearl right up to her hat. The woman in the crowd leans out a window and notices things like that about her neighbors. You make a note of what the girl was wearing? It happens to me like a reflex now, Danny. They tried to kill Russell once before. This time they made it. They can't be going to another room and talk, Danny. The way it hit him... In a minute. He must have been sitting at this window. The force of the explosion threw him... Yeah. Like that. He sure wanted him dead, didn't he? Then routine. Put it on the teletype for all the precincts. Have men go to places where a girl like Patrice Russell might be. Wait. Patrice Russell is at none of these places. Then on all points bullet and find Patrice Russell. And more routine. Out of your office, down two flights of steps down a corridor, open a door. And for all that effort, a man named Gordon greets you. Close the door, Lieutenant. Thank you very much, Lieutenant. Don't you ever open a window in here, Gordon? For fresh air? You need fresh air, Lieutenant? Oh, poor you. Down here in technical, you're hermetically sealed. Take a whiff, Lieutenant. Hermetic, hmm? About the fire at the Russell Chemical Company. I've been sitting here for two hours watching the door, waiting for you to scrape in here, Lieutenant. You need Gordon again, don't you? Look, Gordon... Don't raise your voice, Lieutenant. I'm a civilian technician. I don't have to bow my head and shuffle my feet when you talk to me. Next time you walk in here, say to yourself, don't raise your voice to Gordon. What about the report? Nicely phrased. Hmm.  The fire was not only set by an arsonist, but there was an explosion, and it was a place of neatly placed to explode at a comparatively low heat. Danny, I got a morsel for you. You... close the door. Close it yourself. Let's get out of here, Geno. I say... I heard what you said. Come on, Geno. What have you got? Patrice Russell. Protect the fuller spotter in the village. She climbed the stair, went to a party at 1212 Bank Street, where she is at this moment. Thanks, Geno. Where's Patrice Russell? Thanks. Patrice. Come on, dance with me. Come to me. Come on, we're getting out of here, Patrice. Goodie. Where are we going? Just away from here. I've got to talk to you. My car's outside. I know a lovely place to talk. Outside in the halls far enough. Halls are trapped. Come on. Or you'll bruise me. All right, come on. Let's go out in the hall. Here? Here. For what? Your father's dead. Kidding? No, you're not, are you? How? Someone tossed a bomb in your living room. Poor Daddy. Who did it, Patrice? Honest. I don't know. I loved him, you know. I really did. And he loved you. I know. I know he did. Patrice. I wasn't very nice to him, Daddy. You know something? Every morning I'd wake up and say to myself, this is a day that I'm not going to hurt Daddy. And it never worked out. I want to ask you something, Patrice. Because I never tried. Around breakfast time I'd think of something to do. And during the day I'd find out a way to do it. What about the narcotics? What? The narcotics. Oh, no more, Danny. I promised him that. And I kept my promise. I took the cure and it worked. I haven't touched it since. Not since that detective picked me up for it. His name is Ed Costa, Patrice. He died because of that fire at your father's place. I'm sorry. Come on, Danny, about the narcotics. I want you to know it's all over. He lost me everything. I had a boy. We were going to get married. And he's gone. You know what I do now? I go to parties. Goodbye, Danny. And leave her and leave Greenwich Village. Ride uptown to the one stop you had to make. The final stop. In front of a canopy entrance to a grey stone apartment house. Give your badge sniffed, Anthony. Be told the man you're looking for is a penthouse dweller. Find the elevator. Press a button because the man you want is 30 floors away. Get there. The man you want is waiting for you. You should step out. Hey, come on in, Danny. Thanks. Like Frankie's new house, Danny? Placid. Where do I show you outside? I got the city for an honor. Come on, I'll show you. All right. My Manhattan Tower, Danny. I'm happy for you. If you figure out renting a place like this, that's why you come to look. Uh-oh. And at what? I want to take you away from all this, Frankie. Too much sweat got me here, Danny. It isn't going to be easy. Not hard. Just a walk to the elevator and a ride downtown. Uh-uh. There were times when that could have happened to Frankie no more. It's going to happen. It's got murder in it. What are you talking about? George Russell. What about him? Dead. Had a bomb pitched through his living room window. Rumor said you used to do things like that, Frankie. Uh-uh.  When I was a kid, I'd give it up. No future. It all gets back to Joe Gant, Frankie. Come on, Danny. You're in a classy place. Make classy conversation. What about Joe Gant? The connection between you and who? Finish the visit, Danny. I got a date. It'll wait. Maybe I can still catch it, Danny. Maybe she's got a friend. You want me to try? Don't bother. Well, let's finish the visit. Sure. It started way back in June. What, dead, Danny? Come on. When Patrice Russell was picked up on a narcotics charge. George Russell, Patrice Russell. What is it with all these Russells? George Russell must have pleaded with the officer not to press charges against his daughter, Patrice. He didn't make it. The charge nearly wrecked his daughter. All right. What's this got to do with me? The arresting officer's name was Ed Costa. Russell was going to get back at him. Danny. He found a way to do it. Somehow he found out Costa was transferred from narcotics to burglary. That was his chance. That's my day, Danny. I don't like to keep a lady waiting. Tough. See? She's impatient. Tough. I'm telling a story. Russell came to you.  Look, Danny. You better forget it. So you arranged it, sent Joe Gant. Joe set the fire, all right, but he was followed by Officer Ed Costa. Because Ed got a phone call telling him where a burglar would be at what time. All right, so they both burned. Why should that keep me from a date? The phone call Ed came from Russell. Russell rigged the place to blow up when the fire started. It blew all right. Gant was killed. Ed died. And I wiped a tear with the back of my hand. You couldn't let Russell get away with that.  Bad for your reputation. You evened it. The bomb in the car didn't work, but the bomb in the living room did. Danny. You can say goodbye to her on your way, Frankie. I asked you, Danny. You didn't agree.  Put down that gun. Yeah. You're not going to get to say goodbye to her, Frankie. She went away. Broadway's wearing its harlequin clothes. It winks an eye and beckons. And in the press of crowd there, that pale girl walks like a queen because Broadway's a dream street. That man with begging eyes hungry for a new dream.  It's Broadway, the godiest, the most violent, the lonesomeest mile in the world. Broadway, My Beat. Broadway's My Beat stars Larry Thor as Detective Danny Clover, with Charles Calvert as Tortaglia, and Jack Cushion as Muggevin. The program was produced and directed by Elliot Lewis with musical score composed and conducted by Alexander Courage. In tonight's story, Anthony Barrett was heard as Frankie Crown. Featured in the cast were Michael Ann Barrett, Paula Winslow, Herb Butterfield, and Ed Max. My friend Irma is everybody's friend Irma. There's something downright appealing in that gal's goofy mentality, but this Sunday evening Marie Wilson stars as the world's most adorable dumbbell, my friend Irma. Kathy Lewis is her level-headed roommate on most of these stations Sunday nights. Enjoy CBS Radio's My Friend Irma. Bill Anders speaking, and remember the Frankie Lane show is your date for slick syncopation every Sunday afternoon on the CBS Radio Network.


This is Anabaptist Perspectives and we are back to talk about money again. This series has presented some suspicion of things like interest, usury, as we talked about in the episode about economics and pre-modern Catholicism, but there's a positive vision or something that we can believe in rather than just critiquing abuses. Stephen Russell is with us again to talk about something called distributism. So introduce us to distributism. Well, the previous episode was about Catholicism especially and its view of money. And this view called distributism also comes out of modern Catholicism. Distributism is something that arose at the end of the 1800s as Europe and the West in general started to experience some definitely harmful aspects of the industrial revolution. And because of that, there was a lot of turmoil among the working people and out of that comes socialism and Marxism. Of course, the thrust there is revolution and destruction destroy those that have wealth and spread it out, redistribute it. That's not what distributism is about. Pope Leo XIII became quite aware of the problems. It's probable that the fact that many, many, many years after the industrial revolution had already started as the problems mount and the workers start to get upset about their situation. That's probably what woke the Catholic Church up. And Leo XIII issued an encyclical called Rerum Novarum which means about new things. And so the point here was to say that the economy is developing in a certain way and we need to think about new ways to help people because right now things are going in a bad direction. Poor people are getting poor, rich people are getting richer. And so anyway, he recognized this and he stated that work is good and that people ought to be invested in their work. Now, at this point, that was mostly farming. And so one of his points was it's good for people to actually own their own land and provide for themselves, their families and perhaps have extra so that they can sell the extra and buy other things that they might need. But the emphasis was work is good and we need to get people invested in their work and what they're doing and make it something that they can actually own and be excited about. And then distributism sort of comes out of his writing Rerum Novarum. It comes out of that and especially some English Catholics started talking about how to do this, how to practically do this. Chesterton is one of them and another man is named Bellock. And I think it would be good to talk about what their aim was in trying to develop this idea that Pope had talked about that it's good for us to be invested in what we're doing, kind of work we're doing, that it actually is something that, you know, I can do this work and I can be proud of it and I'm proud that I can take care of my family. Well, these English Catholics said that their focus should be on the family, not on individuals. This was definitely the modern world was moving towards a focus on the individual and the individual was important and they weren't denying that, but the unit, the essential unit of society is the family. And so something needs to be done that would strengthen the family and make it sort of the key aspect of society. The point of distributism isn't redistributing wealth. It is enabling people by somehow distributing the means of production, helping each person to develop his skills, to develop the gifts God's given him. So if he's a farmer, help him have a farm and farm well. And if he's a blacksmith, help him to get the tools he needs and get his little shop started. The best thing is when the family, if possible, and maybe a little bit, maybe the extended family, if it needs to be a larger enterprise, that there's a focus there. The emphasis isn't on making a lot of money. The emphasis is on helping each person to develop the skills that he has and to develop other things like if I have a gifting to sing or to play an instrument, I should be able to produce enough that I have time for other things. I have time for people. I have time for learning an instrument. I have time for reading things. I have time to go to church and actually help out there. So the focus is the individual, that the family, that people in general become what they can become. The emphasis is on small is good, small is beautiful. And let's have each person become basically a craftsman, a person who can do well whatever it is that he feels gifted in. Now, what I've talked about is mostly family-sized businesses. Some things have to be bigger than that. It just has to be. So, for instance, if you want to fill trains, you need a company bigger than...  And I can't build a Boeing 777. So, there are companies that need to be bigger than that. Distributism would say the best way to do that is to have a co-op. Have a company where at least as many as possible of the employees are actually, they have a part in that company. They actually own it to some degree. There is a particular example of this that I think is a really good thing to think about. In Spain, after World War II, the economy was not that good. And in Northern Spain, there was a priest who was concerned about this and he started to try to practice distributist principles in a town called Mondragon. He started a company called Mondragon because of the town. And this is a fascinating story. I don't know exactly where they are today, but they started several different co-ops to do industrial work, to do financial work, to do retail work, and even educational work. The people that were, at least originally, that were part of the company were, in essence, holders of that company. They were co-op. They were in a co-op. And so they're huge nowadays. They have about 80,000 workers. They have factories in over 100 countries, I believe. I'm not quite sure if they've held on to all of their ideals. As you get bigger, that's always a problem. And some of the reading I've done sounds like some people have felt that the original care that each person had for the other is missing, maybe at least sometimes today. But the point is that we are in this together. And that would mean things like, let's say if my father was sick and I need to take care of him, if I'm one of the people that's a part owner of this co-op, I probably can get some time off. Somebody will fill in for me. And later on, I will fill in for somebody else. There's that kind of flexibility because I own it. I'm one of the people that owns it. All of the people that are part of the co-op make decisions together, at least as much as possible. And one of the fascinating ways they do this is they recognize that the managerial staff has more responsibility and should be paid more. But it's the people in that particular department that get together and decide what multiple of the incoming salary or wage for a person coming into the company, what multiple of that does the management at the top get? There are many departments under Mondragon, the Mondragon co-operative company name. And each one of them will decide what multiple the management gets. It goes anywhere from three to nine. Three times the entry or nine times the entry. And I think I read somewhere that roughly five is the average for all of the Mondragon departments. So it's a very different approach to running a company. And it involves those people because of ownership and because of helping to make decisions. It involves directly the people that work there. So it's more than just working there. I'm not working there for a salary. This is actually something that I own in the sense of I claim that it's important to me. So the distributism emphasizes family and what's local. But what you're describing here sounds like there might be principles that would also apply to larger companies. Yes, but even the larger company is going to be a co-op of some sort, a mutual, a corporation or an organization where there's a mutual ownership and responsibility back and forth. So before I began to talk with you about economics, I never heard of distributism. So I guess I'm wondering is this really a thing? Like you mentioned Pope Leo, you mentioned Chesterton, English Catholics, this company called Mondragon. But who takes this seriously? Is it really a codified economic theory? Or what could we direct our audience towards? For like the definitive definition of distributism? Well, Chesterton was a big motivator for this whole concept. And I would suggest reading his book, What's Wrong with the World? That gives you some sense of what he thinks a well-functioning economy might look like. Or actually society. It's broader than just the economy. He also has a book was put together recently called The Hound of Distributism. So it's articles that he wrote. So those would be two things one could look at and read. There are people out there that are writing about it today from a modern perspective, how it could work in the modern world. Mondragon is an example of a large corporation that is functioning as a co-op, working together. There's one in Northern Italy. I can't remember the name of that. There was a small group of artists and artisans in England that functioned for about 70 years. They had trouble passing on the vision. So from about 1920 to 19, I think it was 1989, what's called the Guild of St. Joseph and St. Dominic. And they lived, oh, I have a quote about their motto. Let me see if I can find that. Men rich in virtue, studying beautifulness, living in peace in their houses. It kind of expresses the whole thing. Living in virtue, looking for beauty, producing beauty, living in your own home peacefully. And so there are people that have done it, but one of the key things is it can't be imposed by government. And I think government can perhaps provide a setting through the laws that makes it possible. But by and large, distributists would say, government can't do this. This has to be something that committed believers start to do one by one. I have some friends that live near Pittsburgh and they purposefully look for small farmers that they can go to to get milk and eggs and other things. It's a little thing, but it's something. It might cost a little more to go to the private farmer and get the milk there or get the eggs there. But there's actually something that you're encouraging that is more important than maybe the extra money you're spending there. So yeah, it is a thing. Catholics are more aware of it probably than anybody else. I think that this is how most conservative Anabaptists actually approach life, something like this. They care for the family, they care about the business and their skills that they have. So the thing that I like about distributism is if we read about it and they have actually thought through why they're doing it and what some of the pitfalls are and how to do it well. And I think when we don't actually think consciously about intellectually why we should do this and how we should do it, I think we're in danger of eventually losing it. So I'm suggesting let's look at distributism and see how it fits in with what we have traditionally tended to do and learn from it and maybe improve it and do better ourselves. This approach to economics, it really is something that has to be done individually or by family and being committed. And I think that yeah, government can perhaps make it easier for those things to happen, but I'm a little nervous when it tries to become the motivator there. I don't think it's gonna work too well in the long run. I think maybe that's a crucial point because it sounds to me like at least some of the concerns that distributism is responding to are ones that the socialists also want to respond to. But what you said a bit earlier, I think is important in that distributism shouldn't be imposed by the state. And that would be a pretty clear distinction between it and socialism. And in some ways, other political theories also that try to demand that economics happen a certain way. Distributism is trying to take a path that's between the kind of laissez-faire capitalism that was being experienced in the late 1800s and the state socialism that Marx and other people were starting to say is the solution to that problem. And this says that both of those are an accumulation of wealth and power in a few hands and that either in any case, that's wrong. It's dangerous. It brings bad results. And distributism is about the things that develop wealth are distributed among many people and that the wealth itself isn't all heaped up by just one person. To a large degree, it's an attempt to get us to recognize that our security isn't in heaping up a lot of wealth, that our security is first of all in God but also in his people. Instead of a kind of cutthroat economic system where I'm trying to undersell you to get as much business as I can, distributism would actually say, we should kind of help each other. I will have my little farm here and I will provide food in this area, you'll provide food in another area. And we actually might end up helping each other rather than going after each other.  That's why it can't be imposed by the government. It's gotta be something in here. There's one more thing I wanted to say, I'd mentioned Mondragon and an American sociologist went to see what's going on in that town in Northern Spain, which is the hub of this corporation. And this is what she said, her name is Barbara Peters and she teaches at Southampton College which is a part of Long Island University and she said, in Mondragon I saw no signs of poverty. I saw no signs of extreme wealth. I saw people looking out for each other. It's a caring form of capitalism. So it is a kind of capitalism, people own their own things but it's not the kind of capitalism that the emphasis is on, I need to keep up lots and lots and lots of money. I just think there's a marvelous testimony from someone that I don't know what her religious belief would be or her views on economics but as a sociologist she's saying, this town is really strange. It's not quite what you'd expect. What does distributism have to offer to the entrepreneurs and employees who are listening to this? Well, what I just mentioned, which is if I am fully invested in my work because it fits the giftings that God has given me and it enables me in a good way to provide for those that I'm responsible for. And it also gives me an opening to do something for the community because my work is gonna at least be needed by somebody in the community. So it opens up this whole different approach where who I am and what I do is actually important instead of I work here to make a paycheck so that I can go out on the weekend and have a wild time. So it's totally different approach. So that's for the worker but I think that fits for the owner too. He's gonna have different kind of workers if he's actually somehow engaged his workers in becoming part of his business. In other words, maybe owning something in it or maybe giving good bonuses at the end of the year. I don't think there's any one way this has to be done but I think the owner of a business is gonna have better employees, people who are more engaged and committed to what he is doing. And another thing is the emphasis is not on becoming big. I mean, for some things you need to be big and Mondragon is an example of having a large company but maybe an advantage to at least some employers would be that they could actually help someone else. Let's just say if someone is working on construction he has several construction crews. Maybe instead of adding more and more crews he could help someone that he has seen has really good potential to start his own construction company. And it takes, he doesn't have to feel that pressure of figuring out what five crews are gonna do or what 10 crews are gonna do and what he's got to do with the government and all that. He can actually help others develop their giftings and he doesn't have to bear the weight of having this big, big company. Now I'm not a businessman. So maybe a businessman will how and laugh at what I'm saying, but maybe there's some truth to it. Yeah, well both of us are employees and work for somebody else. So the practical implications of this are a bit different for us. This sounds very compelling. I should think about it more before I commit but this sounds very compelling. Before we end, can we mention again the resources that you spoke about? Two Chesterton books, right? Two Chesterton, one is a book that he wrote called What's Wrong with the World. And the other one is a recent compilation of some of his essays on distributism and I believe it's called The Hound of Distributism. So those would be two places to go to. You can Google distributism and you will find some modern writers on it. If you have a Catholic neighbor, you might ask, they might be involved in trying to be distributist in how they do their shopping and how they do their work. They are the people that I would say mostly are aware of this. Yeah, so I'll be in touch with you after this interview and we'll find some links and put those in the show notes so our audience will be able to look up these books and resources. Good. Well, thank you so much for talking with us about distributism. I've enjoyed it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for joining us for this episode. We invite you to join our monthly partner program. Monthly partners are key to the financial sustainability of Anabaptist Perspectives. Partners also gain access to bonus content, including our exclusive podcast where we respond to audience questions and comments. Sign up at anabaptistperspectives.org.